I wonder if all this cost cutting extended to the writers and producers or were they still pocketing the big bucks?

It seems odd that they could just propose a 50% pay cut, aren't there some kind of union rules that would protect them from such drastic reductions?

26 minutes ago, Paul Raven said:

I wonder if all this cost cutting extended to the writers and producers or were they still pocketing the big bucks?

It seems odd that they could just propose a 50% pay cut, aren't there some kind of union rules that would protect them from such drastic reductions?

I imagine you can't propose this mid-contract but once a contract has ended why wouldn't they be able to change the terms they offer at will? Actor has chance to walk away if it doesn't work for them.
If both parties wanted a guarantee salary, they could sign a forever contract whereby the actor would be bound by the show and the show by the salary. But actors and shows find it to their advantage to have to renegotiate every few years.

 

There's a minimum that an actor can earn, which is often referred to as "scale".   There's a certain "scale" for walk-ons, another "scale" for Under Fives, and another "scale" for contract actors.  It's on the SAG-AFTRA page.

In 2017, scale for a principal actor on an hour show was $1,038 per day.   Scale for a principal actor on a half-hour show was $778.   Scale for an under five on an hour show was $451 and on a half-hour show was $369.   If the day lasts longer than 8 1/2 hours, there's an increase in each category.  They're also guaranteed a break for a meal, and principals are guaranteed a closing (or opening) credit at least once a week, typically on Monday or Friday whenever possible.    

Ditto for writers, producers, and directors.  Their union guarantees them a certain "scale".   Their "scale" is higher on an hour-long show than on a half-hour show.   

In the past, we've seen most everyone on soaps earning way, way above scale.   Evidently that trend is coming to an end, and salaries are being adjusted downward considerably, in light of the tighter budget restrictions.  Clearly, Moss's offer of $400,000 is still FAR above scale, but for newer, younger actors, I wouldn't be surprised if some of them are being signed at scale.  

If Moss were going to be used 3 times a week, 52 weeks a year, he'd have a total of 156 episodes a year.   At $400,000, that would be $2,564 per episode, as compared with "scale" of $778 for an actor on a half-hour show.  So even a "big-name star" like Ron Moss was being adjusted down to "scales times three", which is pretty low for someone who'd been driving story for 25 years.  Not saying I sympathize with him at all, just saying that's a BIG drop.  

Y'all can google "Ronn Moss vs Shari Shattuck" and get all the details 😉

 

Thank you so much for sharing this. The departures of Moss and Flannery probably were the reason why we didn’t see the budget cuts onscreen on B&B until 2020. the show saved a whopping million per annum without contractual hassles with others. My best guess I that KKL also took a paycut years ago down to 500 k, but we will not know for sure until she marries and divorces again, I guess.
 

By salary in 2021 Second in line probably should be Jacquie Wood these days due to her broad social media appeal. Followed by Scott Clifton (with quite a distance). Then some soap sets like John MCCook, Rena Sofer and Thorsten Kay. The rest probably is indeed down to the scale rates.

Edited August 5, 20214 yr by sheilaforever

Yes, reading between the lines,  I would guess that McCook, Flannery, Moss, and Lang had similar salaries going into 2012.  

We know that Flannery opted to retire circa 2012 (probably the moment she was offered the $300,000 or so cut), as she was in her 70s and could afford retirement.  Moss was 60, and probably thought he'd be ok not working steadily -- he had $1,200,000 in his IRA, along with his residence and his rental property, according to the court documents -- so he also bailed out.   McCook and Lang evidently quietly accepted the smaller salary and went on about their business, possibly with some negotiation that left them with a (slightly) higher salary than what was initially offered to Moss.  

I suppose this "salary tangent" is in a sense, Y&R-related as the two are considered "sister shows" and both Shari Shattuck and John McCook have previously appeared on Y&R.   The reason I wandered into this rabbit hole is simply to state that Y&R actors probably shouldn't be expecting raises in a climate where talent is routinely given substantial cuts to meet the ever-declining soap budget.   

Edited August 5, 20214 yr by Broderick

Y&RFAN94 uploaded this clip of Leslie Brooks singing from 1975. 

 

Edited August 9, 20214 yr by Forever8

All the B&B salary talk is interesting! I feel like with Susan Flannery, she probably made more than Moss and also due to her age and how much she worked, she probably had bought property a lot sooner and worked on her savings. Considering he had no chance of booking another acting gig, he should've had a business plan outside of acting to make up for the lack of income. Vincent Irrizary for example is a real estate agent. If he had a backup like that him leaving would've made more sense. I bet he hates that they successfully recast and he'll never have a chance to return. Also, Katherine Kelly Lang has her own clothing line and a store so she's likely set up better than Ronn was and can afford the budget cut.

Edited August 9, 20214 yr by Chris B

A long while ago I saw these scenes of Kay talking to Esther about all of Jill's sins. It was an early sin and I think it was around the time Jill and John first got married.

Forgive me for sincerely asking this without scouring through the 702 pages of this forum, but I was wondering if anyone could tell me the name of the actress who filled in as Lorie Brooks around March 1978 (I believe Jaime-Lyn Bauer was on maternity leave at the time). I could've sworn I read somewhere that the actress who filled in had formerly been part of the cast of "Another World," but I can't recall her name and don't recognize her.

18 minutes ago, DanMan869 said:

Forgive me for sincerely asking this without scouring through the 702 pages of this forum, but I was wondering if anyone could tell me the name of the actress who filled in as Lorie Brooks around March 1978 (I believe Jaime-Lyn Bauer was on maternity leave at the time). I could've sworn I read somewhere that the actress who filled in had formerly been part of the cast of "Another World," but I can't recall her name and don't recognize her.

 

I wanna say Lezlie Dalton but I could be wrong. Nope I was wrong, it was Victoria Thompson. she played Janice Frame

Edited August 12, 20214 yr by will81

1 hour ago, will81 said:

I wanna say Lezlie Dalton but I could be wrong. Nope I was wrong, it was Victoria Thompson. she played Janice Frame

Will, you’re awesome—thank you! BTW, she unfortunately made a terrible Lorie Brooks. I hope she was much better as Janice Frame on AW!

Speaking of Lezlie Dalton, I love watching her in classic GL as Elizabeth Spaulding. She had a breathy Jackie Kennedy type voice and demeanor. She should have been brought back in later years of that show. I don't know if Dalton was ever approached or declined to return to daytime. I saw she had a short stint on Search For Tomorrow around 1982/83. 

Sorry to reply to this conversation so late but wanted to reply to @AlexGrimaldi and share some more Italian clippings from Y&R.

 

Quote

Febbre d'Amore lost 1/3 of its audience in march 1991. The time they decided to do the first unfamous time jump (salto temporale). There was no reason to skip three years and half of the show and the aftermath of crucial storylines, expecially the Nikki Victor Ashley triangle and the Revenge of Jill against the Abbotts. The ratings were very good, the show  won a Telegatto Award in 1990 as favourite soap and was voted again in 1991 (competing with The Bold And The Beautiful and Loving in the category Best soap of the year). All of sudden, there were a new Jill, a new Jack, a new Ashley, 2 Katherines (Kay and Marge) and total different storylines. I think part of the viewers felt disconnected from the show.

I have seen some clips up to at least March 1986 in Italian (Jill's press conference and Lauren being saved from being buried alive), so then if they skipped the rest of 1986, 1987, 1988, that is strange since those are the years that the show started in France and Germany (and we have the German episodes almost complete through mid-February 1988). I wonder if they did that to catch up Italy to the rest of Europe? I agree that replacing Ashley, Jill, and Jack all at once would be a lot to take.

Here's a clip of March 1986.

 

 

Quote

The summer 1995 time slot after BB on Canale 5 was not a total failure. As you wrote, it was political. They simply wanted to get ride of a show that costed them too much money, and they did.

I have also heard that Sony's licensing fee is high, so that may be why Y&R isn't broadcast is as many countries nor has streaming options like B&B.

Quote

I can understand why the french audience had/has a strong connection with YR. French movies are often based on introspection, tortuous loves, fatal attractions, sentimental and existential reflections, long dialogues, sophisticated and rarefied atmospheres, restlessness, the pursue of happiness. That is what YR was about in the 70s, 80s, 90s and early 00s. 

I can understand why the italian audience had/has a strong connection with BB. Fashion, good lifestyle, deep and powerful feelings of love and lust, open hearted conversations, passionated and sharp people, larger than life characters, crazy twists, very closed families, possessive and strong mother figures like Stephanie and Sally, who always put their families at first, strong bond between people.

That's a perfect description, really.

 

Other times the openings were totally remade and they used pretty popular songs of those periods (What I am gonna do by Linda Wesley, Fallen by Lauren Wood, I don't wanna fight by Tina Turner, The extra mile by Laura Pausini). 

I wonder if it confused some people (when they were using pop music as the theme song) when Nadia's Theme would play during the saddest and most important scenes. I guess they thought it was just another sad music cue. I have never seen those openings other than "I Don't Wanna Fight."

 

Italy was in Melody's destiny. A decade later, her daughter Alex studied, worked and lived in Italy (Milan, Rome, Tuscany, Sicily). She's been married with an Italian from Rome.

Cool! I didn't know that.

 

I uploaded in the vault a short clip (2002 Flannery Finnegan) in the BB section.

Thanks! I saw a new Italian clip as well. It's from June 1991.

Here are some Italian clippings that I have. They do make quite a few mistakes (a picture of Janice Lynde when they name Victoria Mallory). 

 

 

November 6, 1985 (Italian dates)

June 27, 1987

August 22, 1987

October 3, 1987

 

 

April 16, 1994 (talking about the Grand Ball - clearly the photo of Nikki is way too old)

 

1995 article about the name switch to "Amarsi" and Sheila's past

 

Edited August 12, 20214 yr by BoldRestless

9 hours ago, DanMan869 said:

Will, you’re awesome—thank you! BTW, she unfortunately made a terrible Lorie Brooks. I hope she was much better as Janice Frame on AW!

No worries. As an extra bit of trivia. Apparently Roberta Leighton tried out as Lorie Brooks to replace JLB on maternity leave and instead they decided to cast her as Casey Reed

10 hours ago, will81 said:

I wanna say Lezlie Dalton but I could be wrong. Nope I was wrong, it was Victoria Thompson. she played Janice Frame

Wasn't Wesley Pfenning a temporary replacement at one point, too?