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Generations Discussion Thread

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On 1/26/2018 at 11:55 PM, dc11786 said:

Those episodes are from late June 1989, not August. 

 

I think they give a good glimpse of early "Generations." There are so many side characters featured in these episodes. We get to see Chris Mendoza (the lawyer at the firm with Rebecca), Billie and Amber (the leather and lace models), Joel (Martin's slimy business associate), and Lloyd (the British lawyer dining with Rebecca). Carl, as you probably know, the actor playing Lloyd Bradfield is Ronald Allen, he appeared on the British soap "Crossroads" as David Hunter. Billie, the model featured in the photoshoot with Sam, is Pat Tallman, who would return in the winter as Christy Russell, a cop often paired with Kyle Masters on assignments. Tallman is a lot of fun in both her roles. Joel Resnick is played by Rick Lohman, who I believe was one of the Tom Bergmans or Gary Waltons on "Search for Tomorrow.".

 

 

Lohman was Gary Walton on SFT. Do you know who played the Amber character?

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Do you think the show would have benefitted from dumping Sally Sussman from headwriting duties.  The concept of the show was interesting with a lot of potential.. but it just didn't seem to gell when put into practice.

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IMDb lists Jasmin Paul as Amber. I think that is right.

I don’t know about replacing Sussman Morina. I think she struggled a bit with plotting, but created very strong characters. I think pairing her with someone who had a stronger sense of plotting the day to day episodes would have improved the show, but there were times that the show was excellent.

If they had replaced Sussman Morina, I cannot imagine who NBC would have brought in during the early 1990s. Who would you have liked to see?

The moments Sally gets it, the show soars. I was rewatching some of the March 1990 episodes I’ve acquired, and the story is quite good. The canvas is constantly interacting. In the episodes I watched, Doreen has been shot at Johnny’s Hideaway during a conversation with her friend, Daniel. Daniel manages to save Doreen and deliver her baby, but his involvement threatens to reveal his true identity. Also, when Daniel returns home to Maya and Adam for dinner, Adam learns that Doreen has been shot and delivered the baby, his child. We see Martin dealing with Doreen’s condition, Martin holding the baby for the first time, and Martin confronting Adam when he arrives at the hospital and sees his daughter in the nursery. Later, an emotional Adam calls Sam at Kyle’s place after the couple has made love for the first time. Sam rushes to Adam, who admits he is afraid he will never see his daughter if Doreen dies.

Daniel worries that Doreen will recall his involvement and that questions will arise. Ruth learns of Doreen’s accident in the paper and rushes to her side. Doreen and Ruth, who have been fighting because Doreen alerted the press about the racial attacks against the Marshalls, reconcile when Ruth realizes she could have lost her best friend. It’s a tender moment that I fear we might have lost if Sally had left.

I also watched some episodes from November/December 1990, and they weren’t as good. Jordan and Sam have married in Jamaica, Peter Whitmore is back in Chicago not doing a whole lot, and Eric Royal has been released from prison. The Sam / Jordan / Kyle triangle has taken an odd turn. Jordan’s backstory has become more elaborate and the character works a bit better in the romantic triangle. Jordan’s father, a Chicago gangster, had a mistress who he impregnated and abandoned. It was the gangster daddy who set Jordan up in the hotel business in Las Vegas where Jordan created his brand. Jordan’s father is also the man who Peter Whitmore testified against. It creates a rather rich conflict between Sam and Jordan, who both have serious Daddy issues but who would also be odds as the Taylor family still wants to kill Peter. The real loser in the triangle is Kyle who is sidelined as a bit of pariah for thinking that Jordan is a fraud for the Ming vase story. In the spring episodes, Kyle is a cunning cop who is intrigued by complicated cases, but instead of finding further evidence of Jordan’s guilt, Kyle is offscreen while Sam tries to track down the stolen art. I don’t begrudge Sam, but I think it would work better if Kyle and Sam were both investigating Jordan separately and sparred over their dueling agendas.

I don’t hate Chantal and Eric, but their story lacks any real conflict at the moment. It is nice seeing an African American couple receiving the same supercouple treatment that couples like Sam and Kyle received, but the story is weaker. From what I’ve seen, Eric’s trial was a bit lame, and Debbi Morgan seems unsure how to play, or the writers seem unsure how to write, Chantal. There are definitely hints that Chantal feels inferior to all the other women in playboy Eric’s life, but given where the story is heading with Peter and Ruth, it would be nice to see more of that relationship affect her own with Eric. Eric is given an interesting perspective, a young man from modest means who was able to rise above and avoid gang life because of his involvement in sports. Knowing where this is heading, it’s all right, but if I didn’t, I’m not sure how I would feel.

I will say the best thing I saw in the December episodes was another reunion between Doreen and Ruth. This is only several months after Ruth has learned that Danielle is her grandchild, and she and Doreen have been on the outs because of the deception. When Danielle nearly chokes with a babysitter, Ruth rushes over. Doreen and Ruth reconcile and Ruth makes some comments about being empathetic about the lies Doreen told regarding her child, which is pointed in terms of the long story.

There is also some minor bickering between Maya and Doreen when Maya convinces Adam to let her move in now that Sam has married Jordan and moved into the Winston. There is also the lingering question of whether or not Eric will be allowed to return to the Rifles. A good chunk of time is spent on Reginald and Jordan’s scheme to keep the Ming vase hidden, while Sam is determined to learn whether or not Jordan is lying to her.

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I recall watching the show, and I've read this whole thread, but the family trees still mystify me. 

 

Everyone seems to be the same age but Rebecca is Monique's grandmother?  I totally don't get Jessica's backstory, was she Jason's mother or his step-mother?  Because they seem like they're the same age and Jason and Rob seemed like contemporaries.  Was Jessica's only connection to the Whitmore's her friendship with Laura?  Did I also miss who was Jason's father?   There's so much exposition early on but the fact that every actor had a mullet makes it difficult to remember the differences between Anthony Adabbo and Robert Torti.

 

Also, why did they keep calling him Jason after he learned his real name?

 

Why do fans drag Kelly Rutherford's acting and not the actress who played Monique?  She's so wooden the writers seem to have confused her for set dressing.  Sam's triangle with Kyle and Jordan reminds me of Siobhan's triangle on Ryan's Hope, but without the finesse or charisma of both guys.

 

This and many more question will never be answered...

Edited by j swift

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The timeline never really works. I believe Sam, initially, is a year older than Monique. So there is suppose to be a significant age gap between Sam and Laura. Later on, I believe it's implied that Ruth conceives Chantal at the time Peter leaves town meaning Chantal is younger than Sam, which makes absolutely no logical sense. Originally, Ruth and Henry's daughter Jacquelyn was married with children implying she was the oldest. 

 

I dont one think we ever learned who Jason's biological father was. Hugh originally took Jason away and named him Hugh Gardner II. When Jessica returned to Chicago after her initial banishment, she takes Jason back, marries Senator Tim Craig, and rechristens her son. Jason loved Tim and felt guilty because Jason didn't save Tim when they were involved in a car accident that sent their vehicle into a body of water. It was Tims death that led to the fracture in Jessica and Jason's relationship and why she can't locate him at the time of the premier. The death of Tim also resulted in Jessica falling off the bottle. 

 

Rob is suppose to be older. He's a professor on track for tenure when it starts. I think he is probably a little younger than Jessica and Laura, but still older than Jason, Sam, Adam and Monique. 

 

Jessica's family lived in the same neighborhood as the Whitmores. JD Whitmore also has a crush on Jessica. 

 

I really lije like the triangle between Jordan, Sam, and Kyle. I actually really like George Shannon in the role of Jordan. While his mob ties grow organically in the story, I don't like that they made him the heavy in that way when I felt Shannon's Jordan represented so many things Sam wanted while Kyle was just raw passion. I was actually listening to Here and Now this evening because of Sam and Kyle.

 

rutherford grows immensely as the character of Sam evolves. Valentin is never given the heavy emotional material Rutherford does. The rare time she does (Trevor and Laura's divorce) it's all b-story. With that said I've only seen the fallout of Jasons death. I'm not sure how valens did with her instant widowhood.

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Generations passed a milestone (or would have) and it was virtually left unrecognized on this board.  I just found out that yesterday would have been the show's 30th Anniversary.

 

Cheers to the efforts made by the cast and crew.  It was on but just a few years but I offer a salute to the concept of this show and the talent that got some time and space in the annals of daytime dramatic history.

 

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I remember as a child my aunt would always complain about "that soap with the crazy woman who spent days making that damn fruitcake." I don't know who she was talking about, but it's something she never forgot.

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Did Pat Cowley Quit the role of Rebecca cause the last two month recasting with Dorothy Lyman seemed odd

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5 hours ago, John said:

Did Pat Cowley Quit the role of Rebecca cause the last two month recasting with Dorothy Lyman seemed odd

According to the Classic SOD thread from 1990.  Pat Crowley's contract was not renewed when the character was back-burner.  Then in the final months of the show, producer Jorn Winther attempted to revamp the cast with a few big names including James Reynolds from Days, Robert Gentry from AMC and Dorothy Lyman who had just been on Mama's Family.  Lyman was lured to NBC with the promise of a six-month contract and the ability to direct.  Lyman later credited the deal with starting her sitcom directing career.  Gentry was guaranteed primetime work and got a story arc on Hunter.  However, Generations was canceled in early January of 1991 and off the air by MLK day.  It was right around the time that the Dobson's won their suit and returned to Santa Barbara, and it was notably replaced by Faith Daniels (a former Today hostess) talkshow rather than another soap (one of the first times that a network gave up a soap slot rather than replace it).

Edited by j swift

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I don't know when Pat Crowley last appeared, but I'm pretty sure it was in November, 1989. I believe the character was last seen around the time of Monique and Jason's non-wedding. I'm pretty sure Rebecca was said to be out of town for Christmas 1989. Crowley and Andrew Massett were dropped around the same time. I think Massett's initial exit was in January, 1990, after Monique and Jason survived Aunt Mary's attempt to kill them with the poisoned English trifle ( @chrisml this was what your aunt was speaking about). Massett was brought back in March to bring closure to Trevor's character. It was revealed he was sleeping with a colleague leading to Laura and Trevor's divorce. 

 

The cast revamp was more around early 1990. Massett and Crowley were dumped in January. In March, the show dumped Pat Tallman, Sharon Brown, and George Shannon and brought on Stacey Nelkin, Debbi Morgan, and Robert Gentry in contract roles. To be fair, the show constantly seemed to be in flux.

 

Dorothy Lyman was brought back for the Peter Whitmore storyline. Not only was Rebecca recast, the plans were to recast JD and feature Gail Ramsay's Laura a bit more. Around the same time, Anthony Addabo was dropped to recurring so I'm not sure what the longterm plans were for Monique and Jason. Maybe the plan was to pair Monique with Butch Hartman's Sean Masters. 

 

I like what I've seen of "Generations." It wasn't always perfect and was rarely consistent, but when it was good, it was very good. The Marshalls moving into the old Whitmore estate was a very unique story that blended social issues and character history. The Sam, Kyle, and Jordan triangle was very interesting. Adam and Doreen's affair was fun. There were a lot of really good couples (Adam / Maya, Sam / Kyle, Rob / Jessica, Doreen / Daniel) and some great character dynamics (Helen / Maya, Ruth / Doreen, Rob / Daniel, Sam / Adam / Monique). I think it could have worked if it had more time.

 

Happy anniversary! 

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