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I guess I was thinking of most of the 90s...it seemed like from about 93-97 or so. Rex was killed, which was a brief story, then she just had stuff like Kurt's intro, getting another facelift, and the brawl with Jill in the courthouse after she testified in favor of John in the custody fight.

I wish I could see this Allison. She seems like a rare character for the older group - usually the older women on the show, aside from Flo, were more long-suffering.

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I guess I was thinking of most of the 90s...it seemed like from about 93-97 or so. Rex was killed, which was a brief story, then she just had stuff like Kurt's intro, getting another facelift, and the brawl with Jill in the courthouse after she testified in favor of John in the custody fight.

That was all fairly heavy.

She had Esther's love life, Rex's death, a breast cancer scare, then was a heavy part of John & Jill's marriage/eventual custody battle as well as Danny/Cricket/Paul/Giggly/Gina's issues in addition to her side stories (facelift, Dina/John, Nikki, Kurt/Ashley Nina/Ryan/Phillip).

It wasn't only after Who Shot Victor climaxed that Katherine struggled & that was only cause Bill was busy trying to make Jill/Keith work which led directly into their house fight.

I wish I could see this Allison. She seems like a rare character for the older group - usually the older women on the show, aside from Flo, were more long-suffering.

Alison was interesting cause she was a cross between Tammy Grimes & Stephanie Beacham's Sable Colby.

The irony is (much like with Jill/Nina/Chloe) a lot of the things Nikki has said to Sharon are things Alison said about (and to) Nikki.

Flo is who Gloria should be (and was to a certain extent with JVA).

Edited by DeeeDee

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I've been needing to catch up on a lot, work and school have kept me off various message boards lately.

Just curious, but what were Ashley's early stories between 1982-1985? I know from my Y&R history readings she got involved with her step-brother Marc and went crazy and took an amnesiac road trip after learning that John wasn't her biological dad but it didn't seem she had much story until she got involved with Victor there '85/'86. A more recent history question I have but how was Raphael exactly related to Ashley? Wasn't he like Dina's long lost son or something?

That courtroom brawl use to be on Youtube, not sure if it is anymore. I know this is, and note how sinister Katherine is in these clips as opposed to her sainthood nowadays:

[youtubee]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k_l6Mb3ElWI

The Jill/Katherine feud was still warm in the early 90s although growing a bit stretched, Jill and Kay fighting over Rex after he married Jill after Marge as Katherine drove him away. I thoroughly enjoyed every moment of the Jill vs. John story that played out between 1994-1996 because the reasons for the divorce and custody battle over Billy seemed so explosive to me as kid then. However, after watching so many 80s clips I prefer the 80s story of John/Jill/Jack/Katherine because that was much more explosive and had higher stakes, not to mention all the stellar performances by Dickson, Lester, and Cooper.

Speaking of Jill, I need to dig up the short article I have from early 1993 which complains about the Victor and Jill pairing(the author notes it as disgusting and critizes Walton's performance).

Edited by soapfan770

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Just curious, but what were Ashley's early stories between 1982-1985?

Working at Jabot, fighting with Jack & Traci, dealing with Dina (and Brent) & her relationship with Eric.

but it didn't seem she had much story until she got involved with Victor

Ashley was very popular & had quite a bit of story before Victor.

Nikki/Victor/Ashley was the climax (which unfortunately has never ended).

how was Raphael exactly related to Ashley?

Stepsiblings.

how sinister Katherine is in these clips as opposed to her sainthood nowadays

Katherine became a saint after the horrible Mother/Daughter "twist.

It's been all downhill since then.

although growing a bit stretched

Not really.

It wasn't until the end of Victor being shot that Jill & Katherine noticeably slowed down in terms of story.

A that only really lasted about a year & a half (which in reality isn't much overall).

Edited by DeeeDee

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Ok so what I found wasn't as crictical as I thought, I know I have an article from this period which is very harsh on Walton. But here is a piece talking about this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=duFRmramYA8&feature=related

On to the bigger news, from my perspective: Victor and Jill! There is

loathing being expressed all over the place, and I just don't understand it.

On the one hand, I understand that Victor is played so well that people

can dislike his overbearing strength and scowl. That is a credit to

Eric Braeden, that he has created such a masterful character.

I can understand those who think Jill is stupid (for blowing her chance

with John) and those who think that Victor is using her (given his current

between-women status). But think of the drama! Jack has a long-term

rivalry with both Victor and Jill--and can now use news of the relationship

to blackmail Jill and ruin her chances with John. Jill is hurting John,

which will anger Ashley--who will also be angry with Jill because they

share a rivalry over Blade. Kay loves Nikki (who loves Victor) and hates

Jill. The hurt this affair will cause Nikki will intensify Kay's

rivalry with Jill.

Then, of course, there is the promise of the relationship itself. Victor

has steadfastly (the one, fascinating exception was Cassandra--and she

was in a "weak" phase) gone for younger, weaker women. Jill is more

of an age with Victor, and she is certainly not weak. Think of the sparks

that will ignite when these two have a fight. Think of the conflicts

between Jill and Nikki if Jill decides she wants this man! Ah, I only

wish I could see this delicious turn of events.

And there is more....Jill wants to push Nina and Ryan together--so she

will explode at news of the Victoria/Ryan union. Victor's reaction is

bound to be similar, but stronger. Now, put the two of these folks

together: Poor Victoria-Ryan-Nina don't stand a chance. Maybe the Nina and

Jill rivalry will resurface. It gets better yet....John, disillusioned,

gravitates to Flo. Jill can't stand anaother woman having John, and further

intensifies her conflicts with Flo and Nina....

Yes, the marvellous acting of Eric Braeden and Jess Walton promises a

pairing of unprecedented drama, from this distant vantage point. Am I all

alone in this? Am I the only one not disgusted?

Edited by soapfan770

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I don't remember Jill/Victor, only reading about it. I guess I wasn't watching much at the time. I think the idea is interesting but she's definitely not Victor's type.

I was going to ask what you all thought of the rock concert stuff in the 80s, the "rock" out to prevent drugs/teen pregnancy/etc. And also what you thought of the character Stephanie Williams played. Do you wish she'd been used more? She said once that Eric Braeden and Terry Lester, among others, went to the producers with story ideas involving her, and the producers wouldn't go along.

I never knew until I read some Digests from 1986 that Terry Lester quit the show for a while. Did you miss him? Do you think that decreased his standing at the show and was a reason why he was given less to do after his return?

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I barely/don't remember much about Jill and Victor this would have been when I was much younger and only could watch Y&R in the summertime or during the holidays.

I love seeing clips of Stephanie Williams' Amy and it's a shame she was soon phased out and didn't become one of Y&R's leading ladies. Then again, there's a whole world apart from Amy and Dru I could not see them interacting.

Didn't know Lester had quit either, did he actually quit or just take a leave of absence? I wonder if that explains how noticebly different Lester is as Jack there '88-'89 as opposed to the early and mid-80s.

Stepsiblings.

Thanks for the info and insights DeeeDee. I just remember Victoria trying to expose them as a couple when they weren't. This was right when Davidson returned to the show in '99.

Edited by soapfan770

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I think the idea is interesting but she's definitely not Victor's type.

Which is what made it awesome given they had quite a bit of chemistry.

Bill dropped them too quick & unfortunately softened Jill too much toward the end.

I was going to ask what you all thought of the rock concert stuff in the 80s

Annoying.

Mainly because the concerts were SUCH involved processes (in terms of production) they would last entire weeks.

It wasn't so bad initially when just Michael Damian & Patty Weaver would sing but by the time EVERYONE got into the act with increasingly elaborate concerts it was just overkill.

And also what you thought of the character Stephanie Williams played. Do you wish she'd been used more?

Amy was adorable.

Stephanie Williams was (and still is) beautiful & had a LOT of personality.

Amy actually had more chemistry with Doug Davidson than Nathan Purdee but given interracial relationships were rare back then (the more things change) she never got a chance like her co stars to really grow.

By the time she actually did start to get more to do Y&R let her go.

I never knew until I read some Digests from 1986 that Terry Lester quit the show for a while. Did you miss him? Do you think that decreased his standing at the show and was a reason why he was given less to do after his return?

Terry was AMAZING.

Like Jeanne he was able to do horrible things yet the audience loved him so much more for it.

He also never cheated (like say Judith Chapman) to get unearned sympathy.

He just played the beats & it worked.

While there were definitely rough times Terry as an actor didn't really hit a wall until the very end of his run.

By the time Brenda left & Lauralee grew really popular it became clear he was over it which is a shame cause he was easily every bit as good as actors like Larry Bryggman, Justin Deas, David Canary, Charles Keating & Michael Zaslow.

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Thanks for answering my questions. I just can't picture Jill/Victor, because of the way Victor treats women, but I will have to look for more of them to see how they were.

I didn't feel like Stephanie Williams fit in at OLTL (but then they were phasing out their black characters and she was taking over from the great Valerie Pettiford), but I wish I could see more of her at Y&R, as Amy seems to be the precursor to Y&R having heroines like Olivia. What was her story with Paul? Just friendship I guess. It seems like Y&R got rid of a lot of the people in Paul's orbit in the late 80s. I can't remember if they played up the Nathan/Paul friendship later on or not.

I've seen the concert episode where they are upset about the teen mother who disappeared, but haven't seen any concert episodes yet. By the end it was, what, Gina, Danny, Lauren, Traci...? I guess probably Faren too?

Didn't know Lester had quit either, did he actually quit or just take a leave of absence? I wonder if that explains how noticebly different Lester is as Jack there '88-'89 as opposed to the early and mid-80s.

He left in 1986 for a while. I'm not sure how long. They had a goodbye party and everything - if I can find the photos I'll post them. I guess he wanted to try his luck elsewhere. They mention a TV movie he was in for CBS which apparently didn't do very well, or was given a bad timeslot.

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I just can't picture Jill/Victor, because of the way Victor treats women

Victor/Jill was quite a bit different.

He respected her intelligence & she liked his drive.

It was about as equal a friendship (with a woman) Victor would ever have prior to Hope & Diane.

but I wish I could see more of her at Y&R, as Amy seems to be the precursor to Y&R having heroines like Olivia.

Amy was much more fun & definitely less repressed than Olivia.

What was her story with Paul? Just friendship I guess.

She was his Girl Friday (in a cute way not an obsessive stalker way like Laura Birn).

They were a great match (visually as well as chemistry) with Doug in his pastel jackets & Stephanie with her ponytails.

I can't remember if they played up the Nathan/Paul friendship later on or not.

They did.

All the way up until Nathan died.

By the end it was, what, Gina, Danny, Lauren, Traci...? I guess probably Faren too?

At various times it was Danny, Gina, Lauren, Traci, Amy, Nathan, Cricket, Paul & Faren.

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I didn't know Nina or Cricket sang.

There are some 80s Y&R episodes up on Youtube, I'll have to look for the stuff with Amy and Paul. I really like the stuff he had in the 80s with Andy and Lauren and Diane. When I started watching it was mostly just Paul with Lynn and Mary, which was fine, but I think I like the earlier material better.

Victor respecting a woman's intelligence...you can tell that was a long time ago.

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I didn't know Nina or Cricket sang.

They didn't.

But given the ever increasing size of the concerts characters like Nathan & Cricket would be involved in non singing capacities.

Victor respecting a woman's intelligence...you can tell that was a long time ago.

Touche.

Victor has always been chauvinistic but it didn't get really bad until Jack Smith took over.

Prior to that it was kept in (relative) check.

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Just catching up on this thread,and enjoying it! Luv iold Y&R talk.

Terry was off for sometime and Brett Porter filled in.Apart from a superficial resemblance,he was in no way an adequate replacement. This may have been when Terry was filming his pilot. That was 'Blade in Hong Kong'.It was a 2hr pilot that was filmed in Hong Kong and it aired in May 85 meaning that it had been passed over for the fall schedule and its only hope would have been if it had been a rating success (that didn't happen).

I do remember some lean times for Katherine when she and Rex were happily married.They were lucky to be on once every 2 weeks.I recall them turning up in one ep wearing jogging suits and discussing keeping fit! It was filler.i always found Quinn Redecker a little annoying as Rex-the constant clearing of his throat and haphazard line readings.

My memory is hazy but I think Amy was never officially written out and then months later she popped in for one episode and vanished again. Can anyone else remember more details?

Was Amy ever friendly with Traci?

Also re Ashley,she had a fizzled relationship with co-worker Brian Anders when she first came on. She was working in the lab using the name Susan Ashley.After a few months (weeks?) Brian vanished. Ashley and Brian had a SOD cover so they're were obviously expectations that they would be a hot couple.

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I didn't know about Anders. I know she had the stuff with Marc and then with Victor's brother. She also had an SOD cover with Victor's brother (Matt). Was Matt supposed to be a bigger character? I have only seen a little of him, and get distracted by the crazy eyes.

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