DRW50

Clarence. He announced for the CBS soaps in the late '80s and early '90s, and again with B&B about 10-15 years ago.

I think BTG is mostly going to struggle from a new soap being introduced in 2025 and likely being seen as "DEI" by bigots at a time when they run every part of our media and government. It's a shame they can't provide better lead-ins in terms of ratings but ideally, they can still scrape through.

I hate almost all custody battle stories on soaps, so the aversion sounds good to me, although you're right they spent a lot of time on nothing (the perils of being made up as you go along). I do wonder what they will do with Ava, as that character always seems to be at a loose end. If they have to keep Ava, I would give her the whole long-lost child she has a love/hate relationship with storyline, only unlike most soap versions of this story, a man instead of a woman. I'd probably kill off Avery, maybe accidentally by Kristina's hand (causing her to have a full breakdown and a lengthy break from the canvas), with Ava's son severely injured trying to save Avery. There would always be tension with Ava and her son because she'd be unable to shake the belief that if he had tried harder, he could have saved her. Lucas would also be torn between them. For added angst, he might have a fling with Nina. Jason always has that halo.

I think what held Erica back was the show never letting her mature. Resetting her in her 40s, 50s, and 60s just became increasingly empty as a gesture. I think she and Jack were fine enough when they had them get back together in the mid '00s. It's just the show - yet again - did a reset, and I don't think they did anything especially good with Erica from that point on.

I would have been curious to see what would happen - probably nothing great, to be honest, but seeing her try a brand new show, maybe even have the actors as new characters, could have been interesting. The idea of going back to episode #1 is something comics like to do. I'm not a fan. Is Wheeler a big comic fan? Russell T. Davies also did that with Doctor Who last year, which did nothing for the show whatsoever.

It's hard for me to judge that period because we only have two episodes - I do think Charlotte's "suicide" aftermath episode is decent. The other is not great, in part because of everyone narrating, as you mention. Based on all the panning of Cenedella from Lemay's book (admittedly not the best source), and the issues with Lipton as a writer, some of the problems don't surprise me. I don't have a problem believing these three women would want Joe. One was crazy, one was a desperate schemer, and Sara didn't exactly have great taste in men (Joe was one of her better choices). I think Call was able to show his quiet charisma on OLTL. He's not playing much of a character here. The parts about Leslie's mother are clunkier to me.

As someone who read comics and watched soaps for many years, I think the idea of a one-off episode being tied into a comic isn't a bad idea. GL wasted years on stories involving mind control, magic mirrors, clones. An episode that gets some free publicity and a few new viewers I can see the appeal of. But the long term I agree it doesn't lead up to much. I will say I am one of the lapsed fans who did come back to watch that episode. (just not much else) I wonder if the Inside the Light episodes may have also been for some kind of budget reason. I know they would also use those to for some reason wrap up certain stories - didn't the Blake episode cover like a year of storyline for her?

Oh wow - I had no idea Sonni was mentioned that late in GL's run. I liked the idea of those episodes but I was not really watching by that point...I think I tried one about Blake because I read Holly was in it.

That's good to hear. I hope they can work in a little tribute to Wayne.

It doesn't. That's why I wanted you to know I didn't think you were coming across that way.

I just don't care about anything with Cindy and the tedious Knights or Ruby's poor return and the umpteenth tease about Stacey/Martin or the woeful Reiss storyline or the cynical vote-in for Denise that combines one relationship the show destroyed beyond repair and one relationship the show ignored until this vote began. I also can't watch Nigel's story because dementia stories are just too much for me as time passes. There are other stories, I guess - are we still meant to remember that Tommy beat the hell out of Kat...are we still meant to care about the dull new Mitchells and Harry's dead girlfriend or whatever she was? The show is so plot-driven and hollow to me and I think many stories just get by based on how great we're meant to think they are rather than what they actually are. I get what you mean about Letitia, but I mostly just worry for her health (I'm not saying you aren't either, if it comes across that way).

I don't think most of the actual stories have been very good, maybe aside from the Phil stuff. I also struggle to care about most of the characters and their relationships.

https://www.salon.com/2025/02/14/what-the-lord-established-elon-musk-is-camouflaging-a-christian-nationalist-takeover/ Apparently, thousands are being fired from HHS today...as we face down another pandemic. If you have any way of leaving this country, do so while you can.

The Tate brothers are pushing the lines now about how Putin should have those countries. A good way to get social media and all the brain-dead Trump supporters on Putin's side. We're getting what Putin and Xi paid a lot for - they will take over the world while America is a backwater. And likely split into parts within a decade. I keep seeing a lot of people on the left endlessly blaming Democrats for messaging and saying they should have said this or that to convince the public. The public doesn't want to be convinced. This is what a majority of the country voted for. There is no great moment where a speech or a scandal is going to change their mind. The majority of the country is built on hate and bigotry, and they are willing to sacrifice their own lives if the rest of us go with them. Otherwise they are apathetic. All the people in Alabama who voted for Trump and now have to pay an extra $100 for their electricity bills because he took away money that would have helped them will still support him. Those people are dumbasses. They are very proud of it. And they deserve to be called that, no matter how much sanctimonious, self-satisfied, bitter attention seekers like Nate Silver, Ken Klippenstein or Astead Herndon claim differently.

Thanks so much for tagging me @slick jones

That might have actually made me watch. William Atherton (who I think was in that briefly) has such an odd history.

Here he is. He's no Larry Pine in terms of acting but I think he makes more sense as someone who could have gotten to Iva, and other vulnerable girls, and someone who might have caught Betsy's eye (I think that story may have been truncated due to Frank Runyeon quitting or whatever went on there). ATWT April 23, 1986 Pt.4

I said all this on DS several days ago, but it annoys me enough to where I may as well vent here too. (this is about last week's episodes) I'm very confused by the backstory with Seb and Fallon. For quite a while, all we saw of Seb was exploiting Krista. He cared so little about her that he kept asking her to send him money, working with a dealer that whole time. We saw him only falling in love with her after his recovery began. Why are they now having him say that he was in love with Krista all along and that's why he broke up with Fallon? Is he just meant to be deluded or is that the new backstory? Why did we need the backstory with Seb and Fallon anyway? Wouldn't it be enough reason for Fallon to resent Krista if she thinks Krista had all the opportunities she never had? I won't claim Seb was a good character, or a good actor, but he had enough of a spark that I at least felt a little involved in his scenes. Without him I just have zero interest, especially with Krista becoming such a dreary character who is only there to suffer and to react to people using her/lying to her/manipulating her. I'm also unsure about what the point was of Max hitting on Sadie to where she was uncomfortable even being around him. When Sadie talked with Holly about Max, shouldn't this have been a topic, rather than just Holly having a vague decision about not wanting to be with someone who might be a risk? Did the show just decide having Max behave the way he did toward Sadie was a horrible idea and now it never happened? Why didn't we get to see Nicolette telling Holly about convincing Yaz to leave, instead of Holly storming out from something left offcamera? Did they not trust the actress who plays Holly? Why did we not get to see Jane find out? The reactions from Jane, Byron and Aaron should have been the MOST important part of this story because, as they even had Holly herself say, she and Nicolette were never close, so who cares about tension between them? Aaron was just having a big laugh with her not long after. I don't want to see them on their high horse, but considering we just had a story about their not trusting Nicolette, wouldn't her letting a lunatic she barely knew escape charges for trying to kill somebody reinforce their doubts about her? Is the story supposed to be about Nell keeping Paul and Terese apart when Terese seems to doubt Paul at every turn even without help from Nell (she was already sabotaging business plans behind his back days after their reunion)? They just barely got back together and between Nell and the return of vapid Chelsea, it's already all conflict and obstacles. What I still don't see, at least on Terese's end, is any real trust.

Thanks @MissPalmer

Back when I started ATWT around 1989 or so, I loved Shannon, but while Margaret Reed is a very charismatic and talented woman (as shown by her steady primetime work, she's also a survivor in a tough industry), I don't think most of Shannon's material has aged well - lots of "comedy" and iffy pairings (aside from Duncan) and then a lot of misery. I never see Marland as a comedic writer and the attempts with Shannon often feel like they got dumped from AMC (not that he was especially fond of Agnes Nixon by that point). I wonder what she might have been if the glimpses we saw of her early on (much more of a scheming mystery woman, albeit with a heart) had stayed. I don't think I ever saw any voodoo or shrunken heads in what's been available on Youtube and I don't remember reading about it in any synopses, but others have paid much closer attention to the synopses than I have. I don't have any investment in Craig and Iva because to me it's entirely pitched as "poor Iva," and he was always just in love with Sierra, but they may have taken more time if Scott Bryce hadn't been leaving. The one time they seem to write Craig as genuinely torn between two women is Ellie and Sierra. I have a lot of respect for Larry Pine, but he was badly miscast as Tad Channing #2 and it hangs over the whole story. Thomas was Beatrice's dead fiancé. When Beatrice was mentally ill, Brian had to pose as him. I think maybe just Duncan and his servants knew the truth at this time, but I can't remember. Mark Pinter said quite a few years ago that soon after Marland arrived at ATWT, he told Pinter that he was writing Brian out, and had the story in place, but it would take a while.

@Maxim I appreciated reading your thoughts on 1988 AMC. I had forgotten just how much of the year is missing. I imagine that does weigh on views. My own view is that AMC went into 1988 with assorted riches but also had a multi-tiered system that was always going to collapse. The same had happened around the late '70s, but they did a better job with pruning and bringing in new creations around the early '80s than they would manage in the late '80s and early '90s. I think those decisions ultimately helped rob the show of its identity. There are also decisions at that time I've never really understood, like hurriedly and permanently splitting Jeremy and Natalie after many fans had waited years to see them together (it was not down to personal reasons as Kate and Jean were good friends). Your points about Brooke and Adam remind me of why I never felt very involved in the pairing. The chemistry between Julia Barr and David Canary, along with just how much Brooke was written into a corner by the mid '90s, seemed to keep the relationship alive past a very natural endpoint. Even by 1995 the soap magazines were pointing out how repetitive their interactions were. The story with Adam and Dixie and Brooke was pure soap and had long-lasting consequences...but it's not something I ever want to sit through.

The way I see it is GL put its fans through a lot, more than a number of other soaps. Many fans remained loyal to the end and even past the end (those cruises and farewell tours), but we're still going to complain. I will never stop missing ATWT and GL, but I'm also never going to stop complaining about them. That's what it means to be family.

They all but abandoned most of the longstanding characters and families, instead focusing on a lot of stunts, location shooting, new characters who only lasted a few years, and histrionics.