12 minutes ago, Soaplovers said:

If anyone deserves credit for making Maureen beloved..it wouldn't be Jill.  It was a combination of Ellen Parker,  Pam Long (who I thought wrote Maureen as wise, funny, warm, flawed,  and wisely made her the matriarch), and Nancy Curlee (who continued what Long started...and crafted the lead up to the story).

 

If anything, I would have written Maureen as leaving town instead of dying.  I also think it odd that viewers blamed Lillian..when Ed was as much t blame...and in some ways took advantage of Lilloan during a vulnerable time.

Its odd as that baby story could have played out with Mo being alive instead of giving it to Van.  Mo leaves Ed and takes over the Boarding House..Bridget is preggers, and Mo says we will raise the baby together..lets say she does not know Hart is the father. Bridget sees how much Mo loves the kid and lets her adopt the kid while she can still be in his life. They do that for a while, and she and Ed get together..there would be no custody battle but drama when all finds out that Ed is the adoptive father of Rogers grandson.

 

Ed was to blame and I am sorry, I know Simon is a good actor but he is such a COLD fish!

 

And the only reason Jill listened to the focus groups is that she wanted to free up money to hire Deas and turn the show into the Buzz Hour..which we all know how well that worked out.  Anyone who works with focus groups know how easy they are to sway into corporate line of thinking. I am sure Jill showed Mo cleaning the kitchen or something and wow..she's boring. Of course, the focus group was probably full of viewers who think clones, fairy princes, and the Real Housewives drunkenly screaming at each other is exciting..(okay, I love the drunken HWs of New York schreeching at each other but..)

The bully has spoken. Trying to control who responds to whom. Classic! 

1 hour ago, BetterForgotten said:

"I LOVE YOU, COURTNEY PHELPS!"

 

"An hour movie a day, 365 days a year!"

That’s all you got? Really??  Everytime Erika Slezak won an Emmy (only 6 for Erika to Jill’s 11), Erika mentioned her husband and children (Brian, Michael, Amanda) I can still hear Erika always thanking them. Why wouldn’t Jill mention her daughter? She’s obviously very close to her. 

Edited May 4, 20205 yr by VanessaReardon

I am not making fun of her loving her daughter, her Emmy speeches just blend together and follow the same pattern. 
 

That’s why it sticks out whenever she was cut off or told to wrap up. 

2 hours ago, VanessaReardon said:

You caught me! How did you find me out? I’m so ashamed that I’ve been outed. 🤭 RME. First, you people find out that Beth Ehlers is posting on here and now you find me out. Really good detectives, I tell ya. 

Poor Ellen Parker never had much of a career after GL. She did a play near where I live a few years back. The Playhouse sat 50 people. She must’ve made big bucks on that one!  

Ellen has been having time with family & enjoys doing community theater. Sounds like a good career to me

Edited May 4, 20205 yr by John

It picks any topic you all will respond to (JFP, Ellen Parker, Passanante, beloved vets, Daniel Goddard, livestreams) and transparently pushes to get attention. You don't have to reply to every thing it says just to let people know how you feel for the umpteenth time. This is an old game with a slightly more roundabout approach.

Edited May 4, 20205 yr by Vee

Lillian was blamed because the other woman usually gets the hate rather than the cheating husband. Ridiculous, but usually the case. My problem with JFP is that she has the same style and focus on every show she's been on. Her shows are always extremely sexist and the women always become oversexed idiots when she takes over (still can't get over how OLTL's Nora became an idiot overnight). I think GL was one of the few times that JFP could have done a fantastic job because summer to winter 1992 was first rate, but that's her biggest problem. She can never sustain momentum for very long. She is terrible at long-term storytelling. Maureen turning to Roger because of Ed's affair would have been so much more interesting than her death. JFP never learned. Didn't she have to rewrite YR's Avery lying about rape because of the outcry? Boggles the mind.

1 hour ago, BetterForgotten said:

I am not making fun of her loving her daughter, her Emmy speeches just blend together and follow the same pattern. 
 

That’s why it sticks out whenever she was cut off or told to wrap up. 

Well, when you win so many Emmys, its hard to be unique everytime. 😁

And just to let X or Y know, you have me confused with someone else. God, you are wrong. Very very wrong. 

11 minutes ago, chrisml said:

Lillian was blamed because the other woman usually gets the hate rather than the cheating husband. Ridiculous, but usually the case. My problem with JFP is that she has the same style and focus on every show she's been on. Her shows are always extremely sexist and the women always become oversexed idiots when she takes over (still can't get over how OLTL's Nora became an idiot overnight). I think GL was one of the few times that JFP could have done a fantastic job because summer to winter 1992 was first rate, but that's her biggest problem. She can never sustain momentum for very long. She is terrible at long-term storytelling. Maureen turning to Roger because of Ed's affair would have been so much more interesting than her death. JFP never learned. Didn't she have to rewrite YR's Avery lying about rape because of the outcry? Boggles the mind.

Jill was not a writer. She was a producer. 

Jessica Collins complained to her about the outcome of that story (and the message it sent out) and they changed it.

 

But it won Jessica an Emmy, so...

Edited May 4, 20205 yr by BetterForgotten

3 hours ago, BetterForgotten said:

Jessica Collins complained to her about the outcome of that story (and the message it sent out) and they changed it.

 

But it won Jessica an Emmy, so...

That's the thing. JFP and her HWs were good at creating meaty material even if the storylines sacrificed common sense and character development in the process (Avery's rape, Felicia/John/Sharlene, Maureen's death, etc.). I don't know what happened in the fall of 1992 where JFP felt she had to make changes to GL, but I think the show would have had a great year if she had continued GL the way it was playing out in 1992. The blackout episodes should have given the show material for 12 to 18 months of story. I was a child back then so I don't know what was happening BTS but it's so disappointing.

Giving jobs to friends or showcasing actors she feels are worthy of attention (when most don’t) often seemed to be a motive for JFP.

 

 

Moving on 🙄

 

Just watched this episode from the summer of 1989 (1989 being the start of GL's last golden era until 1993), and it really showcases what made GL special. Vanessa is flirting with a young Frank to make Billy jealous. Sarah is uneasy about Dylan and Revas growing relationship. Awkward yet adorable Sam Marler sharing scenes with her brother Phillip, and her overly protective uncle Ross. Holly and Blake caught up in Alan's games concerning Phillip. Oh and Ed and Maureen's marriage on the rocks.  While Y&R prides itself on not having everyone know everybody in Genoa City, GL being a completely different animal, really goes above and beyond in this episode with the cast interaction. 

6 hours ago, chrisml said:

Lillian was blamed because the other woman usually gets the hate rather than the cheating husband. Ridiculous, but usually the case. 

 

There were a few other factors with Lillian as well. Maureen had been her friend for years, and Lillian was supposed to be a morally upstanding character. Some fans still would have blamed her, but the show chose to make her a self-absorbed martyr in this period, with that silly letter used to expose the affair, showing up after the funeral to offer apologies no one wanted to hear, etc. 

 

I don't know how true it is, but I once read that the show planned to pair Ed and Lillian until they realized fan backlash was too severe. 

 

It may have been shallow of me, I'll admit, but I really could not accept Lillian after this story for years. I think it took at least 3 years. I don't know if one of the other rumors about Lillian is true (that Tina Sloan didn't ever really ask for a big salary because she didn't need one), but if it is true, that is probably the only reason the character survived those years until Beth's return. 

 

Watching some of the early 1983 material is very surreal due to rapid fire character progression. I always wonder how viewers at the time felt. Over the space of two years, they had seen Nola go from a desperate, vicious schemer, ruining the lives of good people, to endearing comic relief waiting to her storybook romance, to a brittle central heroine involved in gothic drama and custody fights. Over the course of a year, Josh had gone from a vicious schemer, ruining the lives of good people, to a moralistic figure giving lectures on maturity. The latter must have been especially perplexing for fans - the ones who weren't just watching for how good his ass looked in tight blue jeans, anyway. 

 

Morgan has also been severely regressed, possibly because Jennifer Cook was on her way out anyway. It's a shame, as this whiny, insecure Kristen Vigard version suits her much more than the stiff, awkward woman Marland had tried to write her as the year before. 

Edited May 5, 20205 yr by DRW50

1 hour ago, DRW50 said:

 

Watching some of the early 1983 material is very surreal due to rapid fire character progression. I always wonder how viewers at the time felt. Over the space of two years, they had seen Nola go from a desperate, vicious schemer, ruining the lives of good people, to endearing comic relief waiting to her storybook romance, to a brittle central heroine involved in gothic drama and custody fights. Over the course of a year, Josh had gone from a vicious schemer, ruining the lives of good people, to a moralistic figure giving lectures on maturity. The latter must have been especially perplexing for fans - the ones who weren't just watching for how good his ass looked in tight blue jeans, anyway. 

 

Morgan has also been severely regressed, possibly because Jennifer Cook was on her way out anyway. It's a shame, as this whiny, insecure Kristen Vigard version suits her much more than the stiff, awkward woman Marland had tried to write her as the year before. 

That was a spot on assessment. Marland/Cook's Morgan was so bland. But the little i've seen of Morgan post Marland i like. Cook had gotten better. Plus she had chemistry with Phillip. I also like the promo where Morgan tells Jennifer that Amanda and Mark are lovers. I do wish more of the period after Marland quit. And Pam took over as HW would surface. 

 

Fair enough when new writers come in they drop a few characters to make room for their own.

Marland did that in time with Holly, Elizabeth. Lucille, Diane,Rita etc but kept a good balance and integrate the newbies so it didn't seem like a different show.

He brought in Tim and Andy to support Barbara's and Sara's role in the show.

 

But in the long term I get why Barbara, Adam and Steve Jackson were dropped. They didn't have any connection to the canvas. Their children were all gone. and the actors were probably expensive to keep. Maybe if they were happy with recurring - but was that even offered to them?

Maybe if Emily Norris had been brought on Barbara could have functioned as a grandmother figure?

 

However, when Long got in full swing most of the cast was dropped .Mike, Hope, Justin, Eve, Floyd, Hilary, Morgan, Jennifer, Amanda, Tony, Nola and Quint etc And Charita passing away.

 

The show just changed too much.