Guiding Light discussion thread

[Mitch]

Too funny that they chose Frankie D to get some excitement going for the GL move.. Kimmer looks like she just came to the studio to pick up something she forgot and they asked her to film it.

I loved that story from Hayden..and when she said, "He read me the riot act," Derwin said, "But with class, I am sure!"

 

Its nice to hear good stories about our old favorites.

[kalbir]

 

 

Mark Derwin was shady about his time at Y&R. I wonder how much of the well-known BTS drama he witnessed during his time there (Summer 1989 to Spring 1990). 

 

I didn't know Jocelyn Seagrave was on Days not long after GL. She was shady about her time at Days (well it was the Reilly sci-fi years) but surprisingly no mention of that 1997 Aaron Spelling Fox show Pacific Palisades.

[titan1978]

I decided to go back further than my original Curlee starting point, so I started a 1990 GL playlist on YouTube.  I’m in April now.

 

I had no idea Kassie DePaiva was such a central character.  I am in the middle of “The Fan” stalking storyline.  She is on all the time.  I never hear people talk about Chelsea.  Kassie is fine, if a little bland.  She shows nothing of the power she would bring to Blair.  Her boyfriend is so bland.  This is also the only time I have found Frank compelling on his own, not just because of the women in his life.

 

I also had never seen Carl Evans as Alan-Michael.  He’s pretty cute and fun in the role with Harley and Blake.  But Hearst is better.

 

I just saw some great scenes with Dylan and Reva. And this is clearly a period of time where we are building to her leaving.
 

Blake is even more fun here than later, when she is all passion, wounded and out for blood.

[BetterForgotten]

I've always found Chelsea insufferable, and Kassie as an actress as well (no matter the role). 

 

1990 is a good year, and I feel the consolidation of why Calhoun was brought in as EP (to really temper Long's sometimes extreme tendencies). Reva, even though she's on her way out, didn't seem to eat the show and finally felt part of an ensemble cast. 

 

The Acapulco storyline with Roger/Alexandra/Holly/Ross being a big highlight from that year, the effects of which were felt for the next several years.  

Edited June 14, 2020 by BetterForgotten

[titan1978]

Yeah, I’m excited to get to Acapulco.  
 

I just had no idea Chelsea was on this much.  And so far the first 4 months of 1990 have not been great for Ed and Maureen.  They have very little to do.

 

I have watched way more of 1991-1993, and while I can see some of Nancy Curlee’s tendencies, it’s still not quite what we get in just a few more months to a year from then.

[kalbir]

 

I enjoyed the Robert Calhoun era but for whatever reason, there was a ratings drop during his tenure.

1988/1989: 6.2 (7th). Robert Calhoun takes over as EP in June 1989.

1989/1990: 5.4 (tied w/ Days for 7th). Kim Zimmer departs July 1990.

1990/1991: 5.2 (tied w/ Days for 7th). HW change from Pamela Long to Nancy Curlee in January 1991. Big cast purge during January and February 1991. JFP takes over as EP in July 1991.

 

JFP got the ratings up briefly but the momentum didn't last.

1991/1992: 5.6 (5th). Beverlee McKinsey departs August 1992.

1992/1993: 5.4 (7th). Maureen Bauer killed off January 1993. Buzz arrives March 1993.

1993/1994: 5.4 (8th). Nancy Curlee leaves as HW in March 1994.

1994/1995: 4.4 (8th). The year of OJ. JFP leaves as EP May 1995.

 

 

[BetterForgotten]

Midway through JFP’s tenure is when CBS affiliates starting messing with GL’s timeslot as well. That coupled with the drop in quality still surprises me that the show wasn’t cancelled by 1995/1996.

 

I imagine some of the changes in 89/90 turned some folks off, and the rapid cast changes in early 1991 didn’t help keep a ton of people who had gotten used to what the show had been since the mid-80’s.

Edited June 15, 2020 by BetterForgotten

[GLATWT88]

 

That's something I always wondered about. Why did affiliates mess around with GL's timeslot so much. I know as early as 1992 some affiliates had dropped GL or already made the move to an early morning timeslot. In fact, most major markets had GL on in the morning instead of its intended 3pm slot. However. GL's ratings were pretty good in the early 90s and the demos were on par with ATWT and BB (It would beat both several weeks in demos in 94). I know CBS had a pretty full lineup with 4 soaps taking up a large block of affiliate programming at very competitive timeselots. In the NYC area GH was the lead in for Oprah on ABC, which may have hurt GL in this market. GH is still the most popular soap in the NYC area and I think largely in part of it's timeslot and years of being lead in for Oprah. Around 2005-early 2007 GL would on average have less than a 500k difference in total viewers than GH which would often rank third overall. Some weeks there was less than a 200k difference when GH would have drops. Yet, by this time GL was already on at 9 or 10am in most of the major markets. The only thing I can assume is demos. GL's total viewers throughout the 90s and early 2000s were pretty consistent with the competition (exception being YR and BB), but it was never that far off the soaps that ranked 3-7. However, the demos for GL weren't the best. I did see that it would beat out ATWT and BB in the early 90s in 18-49 some weeks, but by the 2000s, the demos just weren't there. Again, not sure if it had to do with timeslot changes or other factors. 

[soapfan770]

 

The timeslot change argument always get blown out of proportion to say the least. Here's what I gathered up on CBS Daytime in August 2006 doing much meticulous research. Some stations like KCBS, KCNC, KSWT etc. which had aired GL in the mornings a day behind in the mid-90s later switched it back to its regular time-slot. It was determined at that time Sacramento CA was the only market without GL even though KOVR became a CBS O&O in 2006:

KFMB-8 San Diego CBS
9:30AM B&B
11AM: Y&R
1PM: ATWT
2PM: GL

KKTV-11 Colorado Springs(CBS)

11AM: ATWT
12:30PM: B&B
1PM: GL
2PM: Y&R

KREX-5 Grand Junction(CBS)
9AM: TPIR
10AM: Y&R
12:30PM B&B
1PM: GL
2PM: ATWT
Florida

WFOR-4 Miami(CBS)

10AM: GL
12:30Y&R
1:30 B&B
2PM: ATWT

WKMG-6 Orlando(CBS)

10AM: GL
12:30Y&R
1:30 B&B
2PM: ATWT

WINK-11 Fort Myers(CBS)

10:30AM B&B
1PM: Y&R
2PM: ATWT
3PM: GL

Georgia

WTOC-11 Savannah(CBS)

12:30PM: Y&R
1:30PM: B&B
2PM: ATWT
3PM: Montel Williams
4PM: GL

Hawaii

KGMB-9 Honolulu(CBS)

11:30AM: B&B
12PM: GL
1PM: Y&R
2PM: ATWT

Idaho

KBCI-2 Boise(CBS)

9AM: TPIR
10AM: Y&R
12:30PM B&B
1PM: ATWT
2PM: GL

KIFI-8 Pocatello(CBS)

9AM: TPIR
10AM: Y&R
12:30PM B&B
1PM: GL
2PM: ATWT

KMVT-11 Twin Falls(CBS)

9AM: TPIR
11:30AM B&B
1PM: GL
2PM: Y&R
3PM: ATWT

Illinois

WBBM-2 Chicago(CBS)
9AM: GL
11:30Y&R
12:30 B&B
1PM: ATWT

WANE-15 Fort Wayne(CBS)

10AM: GL
12:30Y&R
1:30 B&B
2PM: ATWT

WSBT-22 South Bend(CBS)

9AM: GL
12:30Y&R
1:30 B&B
2PM: ATWT

WKYT-27 Lexington
9AM: Y&R
1:30PM: B&B
2PM: ATWT
3PM: GL

WLKY-32 Louisville
1:30PM: B&B
2PM: ATWT
3PM: GL
4PM: Y&R

WAFB-9 Baton Rogue
12:30PM: B&B
1PM: ATWT
2PM: GL
4PM: Y&R

WGME-13 Portland
9AM: GL
12:30Y&R
1:30 B&B
2PM: ATWT

WBZ-4 Boston
10AM: GL
12:30Y&R
1:30 B&B
2PM: ATWT

Michigan

WNEM-5 Flint
--Station does not air GL, airs on local MyNetTV at 10AM instead--

WWJ-62 Detroit
10AM: GL
12:30Y&R
1:30 B&B
2PM: ATWT

Missouri

KOLR-10 Springfield
11:30AM Y&R
12:30PM B&B
1:00 PM ATWT
2:00 PM GL

KMOV-4 St. Louis

12:30PM: B&B
1PM: ATWT
2PM: GL
4PM: Y&R

Montana

KTVQ-2 Billings

10AM: Y&R
11AM: ATWT
12:30PM: B&B
1PM: GL

2PM: TPIR

KXLF-4 Butte

10AM: Y&R
11AM: ATWT
12:30PM: B&B
1PM: GL
2PM: TPIR

KXGN-5 Glendive

10AM: Y&R
11AM: ATWT
12:30PM: B&B
1PM: GL
2PM: Passions
3PM: Days

KPAX-8 Missoula

10AM: Y&R
11AM: ATWT
12:30PM: B&B
1PM: GL
2PM: TPIR

KRTV-3 Great Falls

9AM: TPIR
10AM: Y&R
11AM: ATWT
12:30PM: B&B
1PM: GL

New Mexico

KRQE-13 Albuquerque

10AM: ATWT
11AM: TPIR
12:30PM: B&B
1PM: Y&R
2PM: GL

New York

WCBS-2 New York City

10AM: GL
12:30Y&R
1:30 B&B
2PM: ATWT

WRGB-Albany

10AM: GL
12:30Y&R
1:30 B&B
2PM: ATWT

North Carolina

WRAL-5 Raleigh

1:30PM B&B
2PM: ATWT
3PM: GL
4PM: Y&R

Oklahoma

KOTV-6 Tulsa

--station airs B&B at 12:35am overnights)

Pennsylvania

KYW-3 Philadelphia
10AM: GL
12:30Y&R
1:30 B&B
2PM: ATWT

WYOU-22 Scranton-Wilkes-Barre
10AM: GL
12:30Y&R
1:30 B&B
2PM: ATWT

WTVF-5 CBS Nashville:
11:30AM: Y&R
1:30PM: B&B
2PM: GL
3PM: ATWT

KUTV-2 Salt Lake City
9AM: TPIR
10AM: Y&R
11AM: ATWT
1PM: GL
2PM: B&B

KGWN-5 Cheyenne

10AM: TPIR
11AM: Y&R
12PM: ATWT
1PM: GL
2PM: B&B

 

 

 

 

[Manny]

Anyone have a good GL playlist on Youtube with some 80s/90s episodes to share in PM?

[GLATWT88]

 

Thanks for the information. If you look at it from the number of affiliates airing GL in the wrong timeslot, it may not seem like a big deal because there are 100s of affiliates. If you look at it by market and affiliate reach then it's more clear why the timeslot change may have played a role in ratings.

 

The top 10 US markets make up a little over 30% of TV homes. That's roughly 1 in 3 TV viewers. 8 out of 10 of those Top US Markets aired GL at 9 or 10am (exception being D.C. area and Houston). If you include Miami, Orlando and Detroit from your list, all which are in the Top 20 markets (two in the top 15), and add them to the 8 - that's already over one-third of US homes getting GL at a rather unusual timeslot of 9 or 10am. That means that just from those 11 stations, 33% of TV homes in the US have GL on at 9 or 10am. This doesn't include other stations that aired GL in the morning as I didn't count all of them or the fact that Sacramento (a top 20 market) didn't have GL on at all. Also, from your list Pittsburgh and Portland (Top 30 markets) and off the top of my head Baltimore (Top 30) have GL in the morning. I wouldn't be surprised if 50% of TV homes or more had GL at 9 or 10am or in the case of Sacramento not at all. 

 

I'm by no means stating that GL would be a ratings success if the affiliates all had it at the 2/3pm timeslot, but when it's on at an unfavorable 9 or 10am timeslot in at least 40% of TV homes. It's going to have a significant impact on the ratings. That 500k margin from 8th to 3rd place is difficult to bridge when your timeslot is hurting rather than helping you. Also, it's harder to reach a younger demo at 9/10 for a soap opera. I'm many of those markets GL didn't have a lead in or lead in for any other CBS soap, which is always helpful especially when viewers would watch an entire lineup or get curious to what was happening on other soaps from promos or general curiosity. 

 

Despite all of this and what many have said about GL's ratings, I thought GL performed solidly in the early 2000s.

[Bill Bauer]

When did GL go to the Peapack model? I was watching an episode from 2007 and they were still using the old model with proper sets and everything. Does that mean they were only out in Peapack for like a year or two? It seems like it was way longer than that. GL had a long, slow deterioration but that deterioration accelerated really fast in the last year it seems. I don't know if it's really the fault of the writing (although that was certainly bad). I really think it was all about Peapack. That was just hard to watch. 

[All My Shadows]

They went full Peapack in February 2008, so it was little over a year and a half of the madness, but yes, you're right, looking back, it feels like they were in that mode for much, much longer.

[kalbir]

From some further research, the big ratings drop seemed to start in the mid-1980s.

1979/1980: 8.3 (5th). HW change from Jerome and Bridget Dobson to Douglas Marland in December 1979. Time slot change from 2:30 pm ET to 3 pm ET on February 4, 1980. Michael Zaslow departs in April 1980.

1980/1981: 8.2 (4th)

1981/1982: 8.0 (4th)

1982/1983: 7.4 (6th). HW change from Douglas Marland to Pat Falken Smith in October 1982. HW change from Pat Falken Smith to L. Virginia Browne in November 1982. EP change from Allen Potter to Gail Kobe in February 1983. HW change from L. Virginia Browne to Richard Culliton and Pamela Long in February 1983.

1983/1984: 8.1 (5th). Pamela Long becomes sole HW in September 1983. Kim Zimmer joins the cast in November 1983. Beverlee McKinsey joins the cast in February 1984.

1984/1985: 7.5 (4th)

1985/1986: 6.8 (6th). EP change from Gail Kobe to Joe Willmore in January 1986. HW change from Pamela Long to Jeff Ryder in January 1986. Mary Ryan Munisteri becomes co-HW in February 1986. 

1986/1987: 6.3 (7th). Co-HW change from Jeff Ryder to Ellen Barrett in September 1986. HW change from Mary Ryan Munisteri and Ellen Barrett to Joseph Manetta in October 1986. Sheri Anderson becomes co-HW in November 1986. HW change from Joseph Manetta and Sheri Anderson to Pamela Long in July 1987.

1987/1988: 6.2 (7th). Writer's strike March-August 1988.

1988/1989: 6.2 (7th). Michael Zaslow returns in January 1989. EP change from Joe Willmore to Robert Calhoun in June 1989.

Edited June 15, 2020 by kalbir

[VanessaReardon]

Joe Willmore became a Stage Manager in the waning days of GL. To go from Executive Producer, which he failed, to Stage Manager. Joe Willmore fell, bigtime.