Black Character Portrayals in Soaps Today

[Cheap21]

Good riddance. Antonio was an awful character who should have never returned in 2003

[Cat]

I really really liked the chemistry between TSJ and the actress who played Vangie (her name escapes me and my puter is playing up so I don't dare Google -- I'd be here all night) but I agree it was way OOC for Frodd to be acting so in love and caring about somebody other than himself.

As a white female viewer, my opinion doesn't really rank in this thread but from my POV what drew me to characters like Vangie and Drucilla on Y&R was that they were exciting to watch. Full stop. I was invested in their character, their backstory. Everything that came out of Dru's mouth was a treasure. The writing ain't all that for any female character as a whole nowadays but Dru in particular was a lynchpin soap character -- glamourous, larger than life, completely compelling to watch. That is really all I ask. And that is really all the writers have to do, is write for a character, any character and watch a competent actor turn it into gold.

As for the males, Cornelius J Smith was smouldering and I am beyond saddened that AMC didn't ride that chemistry from the beginning. Not that I would ever have saddled him with that dope Kendall, but on paper a Kane woman and Hubbard man should have been fire. Timothy J Stickney is a great, great actor and if MAB had had any writing talent in her little finger, she should have tried to get him to play Tucker because if anybody could make that thankless role stand out, it would be he.

[marceline]

Actually, as a white female viewer, your opinion matters a great deal because you are the viewer these shows think they are pleasing. TPTB think that you can't handle seeing characters who aren't like you. You don't need everybody on screen to be white anymore than I need everybody on screen to be black. I don't need everybody to look like me, I just need them to not all look the same. REG, VR, TDS, Shemar Moore, Debbi and Darnell, etc.. have plenty upon plenty of white fans. Just like Robin Strasser, Erika Slezak, Eric Braeden, Susan Lucci, Michael Easton, etc... have lots and lots of black fans. There are plenty of viewers who are willing to embrace true meaningful diversity. We see it with Shonda Rimes' shows. We see it with The Good Wife. We saw it with The Wire. We see it with the fantastic response that the BBC shows get in this country. (Anybody here watch Luther?).

When these shows decide to mistreat minority characters and actors, they don't just alienate viewers like me, they alienate viewers like you too because while they dismiss me as unimportant, they dismiss you as closed-minded and that's a big part of the reason soaps are dead: they underestimate the audience.

As an aside, this also goes for gay characters and stories. The idea that straight viewers can't won't embrace gay characters or stories has been proven wrong again and again. Yet soaps have always dabbled in those stories then dropped them the moment a bunch of homophobes send a few letters. Another reason the genre is dead.

[cct]

+ 1 I'm sitting here thinkin', "Girl had me at clickety-clacking 'round Fusion."

To be fair though, wasn't the phasing out of the Fryes a bit to do with the personal and legal troubles of Tonya Pinkins? By this time, Whitfield had left, and so had Shari. The only one left was Derek. And it's my understanding William Christian never wanted to work as much; hence, the "Derek" recast in the mid, early-2000's.

[frequentsoapfan]

Marceline, you know damn well these shows don't think they are pleasing females white, black, latino, or asian;they write for old white men!

[JaneAusten]

Which is I guess who the network execs are. These shows have not written well for women barring a select few in years, not just black or latina women. Its amazing that these folks seem to think that women in the 18-49 demographic, the group they are allegedly trying to appeal to, think we want to watch women get marginalized so the white over 40 testosterone clubs on all shows can rule.

Phyllis and Sharon are actually leading stories on Y&R but name me one female who thinks their stories are not total garbage or that the writing for them is exceptional.

[soapfave06]

What trouble was Tonya in? I always thought she left to do other work.

[marceline]

Ditto. She seemed to keep working in theatre but maybe I missed some stuff. Regardless, I hated the fact that we never saw Livia and Tom as a couple. NEVER. Tom Cudahy was integral to the fabric of AMC for years but after marrying Livia he vanished even though Richard Shoberg was open to more (http://pinevalleybulletin.com/Features/InterviewShoberg.html). Even if Pinkins had to step back on her appearances for personal reasons, that doesn't explain why Tom never showed up or why Jamal was nonexistent.

Once again, I'm back to wanting to write a soap opera oral history much like the MTV one. There's a lot of truth that needs to be told and a lot of people to tell it.

Maybe Kickstarter...

[DramatistDreamer]

Tonya Lee Pinkins had a rough time of it although she has continued to work in the theatre. She went through a nasty divorce and custody issues. Her marriage after that didn't end so well either...she has stated that her next marriage (the one that just ended), her husband was threatening/stalking her. I don't know whether any legal avenues were pursued in that marriage. About 5 or 6 years ago, there was a very extensive article about her in the New York Times where she talked about the difficulties and the toll they were taking but she could not divulge details out of concern that it would impact her case. At the time, she was very confident that she'd weather the storm, though.

And she has, I think, despite the next marriage ending as well.

I've had the chance to see her perform and she is a powerhouse!

[frequentsoapfan]

Sami Brady on DAYS leads stories too but I'm so tired of her magical vagina. And Hope and Steffy lead the only story on B&B but I hate that story and Liam. All the women on GH are reaction characters.

[marceline]

Thanks for the info. I wasn't aware of any of that.

I can't tell you how much I envy you for that. I love the Caroline or Change soundtrack.

[VirginiaHamilton]

If this soap version comes to pass (from anyone) and is anything like the MTV or ESPN ones, do send me a link and I'll gladly slide a few pesos over.

Forgive me if I'm wrong (as my memory is fuzzy - it's been almost 20 years), but wasn't the last time that Livia/Tom had a story was when they were fighting against Alec McIntyre for custody of Jamal in court?

I'll be the first to admit that I've got a bias against the fuckery that they were trying to pull with Vangie and Frodd because I loathed him throughout his entire run.

I've said it many times that the 90s was a boon for Blacktors and Blacktresses in any medium because they were provided with opportunities to act out more than trifling stereotypes. The fabulous Drucilla Barber-Winters is a perfect example of that because she was able to thrive (and become legendary in the process) because, in large part, of the great writing that Bill Bell provided her. Though other soaps followed his lead (to varying degrees of success), at least they made a genuine effort to create their own fully-fleshed Black characters that they'd hope would become as beloved as Dru or as popular as the Winters/Barber clan.

Unfortunately, for Renee Elise Goldsberry and Cornelius Smith, Jr., their characters were introduced the era that followed it - an era where daytime could care less about tapping into the potential of Black characters or would set them up to play second fiddle to the white characters (no matter how mediocre or unworthy). Had those two debuted 10-15 years prior*, I've no doubt that they'd have been the recipient of the superior writing that elevated Drucilla (and my Vicky) to top of the heap.

*and yes, I'm aware that there was a gorgeous block of wood that played Frankie prior to Jr. Smith, but that character wasn't SORASed until Jr. stepped in as Angie and Jesse's son as far as I'm concerned.

[lovely_m]

Sorry to be slightly off topic here, but I wondered if the reason some actors play characters of different ethnicities is because casting directors see them as that. For example, are Galen and especially Lindsay too ethnic to play white characters?

There were some talks that the main strike against REG(when she asked for more money) was that she was female not black. Then again look how much Rebecca Budig was allegedly paid to return to AMC.

[frequentsoapfan]

Lindsey is Italian she can play Italian characters which I've seen quite plenty of on soaps. Galen doesn't even play a convincing latino, so his characters just come off as white anyway.

[SFK]

Oh, absolutely, and as an ethnically ambiguous actor myself, I'm not gonna lie like that hasn't been a blessing (as well as a curse). I'm half black and my agents submit me for black roles, and I thank them for that, but I know that I'm not what a director or CD is probably looking for if he or she is casting an August Wilson play, for example. A specifically light-skinned character like in Blood Knot, Flying West, or Yellowman, I'm perfect for. I used the example of Walter Lee Younger in a dscussion the other day. That's a role I just know that my Adam Goldberg-looking ass isn't right for and I'd turn down the offer to audition. On the other hand, I have played latino, Italian, Greek, and middle eastern, and yeah, it sucks for actors who are actually those ethnicities to lose out to someone like me, but I am an actor who wants to work so I'm going to go for what I can get, and hey, maybe it's even a little payback for all of those "tragic mulatto" roles that went to white actors.