Dallas 2.0: Discussion Thread

What is so wrong with being male driven?

Well, for starters, the fact that it's almost always the female demographic that these bastards who run these shows are seeking.

I think the problem with "male driven" shows is that it tends to throw women under the bus, so to speak. On women driven shows, the men still hold their own and have the opportunity to shine and truly have "equal" status, but on shows like Dallas and today, General Hospital, they are treated as props and the whole nature of it comes off as rather misogynistic. I never really watched Dallas all that much, so forgive me if my assumption is baseless, but from shows that I've seen that have a male driven enviroment, that is how it has always come off to me.

Much about the "dream season" was wrong, but one thing Philip Capice did right was increase storylines for Pam, Sue Ellen, and even Donna. It's just a shame that that fact got ignored because Larry Hagman didn't like Barbara Carrera actually giving J.R. a proverbial run for his money.

We are talking Texas and oil...exactly what power were the women going to have?

But there is a happy medium, I think, between the women making the men look like pussies and them just standing around going, "Yes, J.R.; no, J.R.," with an occasional "Go to hell, J.R.," because the writers need something juicy on which to end the act. Sue Ellen might have been "dull" once she actually put down the bottle and stood up to J.R., but she didn't need to be. In no way should a female character lose that spark or energy once they evolve and grow; however, it is up to the writers to keep them interesting to us, and that's something that Katzman and his writers simply failed to do.

Edited June 15, 201213 yr by Khan

See, I don't see Knots as being purely a more female dominated show. It just excelled better at integrating new characters and being an ensemble, and despite selling itself as one, I never saw DALLAS as a true ensemble effort.

Edited June 15, 201213 yr by Y&RWorldTurner

#242

I wanted to love this so bad and I cringed the whole way through. If it didn't have the name Dallas I know I wouldn't have watched it. Whereas I was cringing my friends LOVED this show. Both Facebook and those I watched it with. I worry that the positive feedback will cause them to not make changes for season 2. They need a new writing staff entirely, somebody with more bite. It was a paper thin soap when it has potential to be epic, like the original series.

The characters:

The originals were mostly handled well. Bobby was consistant and will make a good patriach. He's the true new Miss Ellie, not Ann. I just wish he had better dialogue (well him and everyone else). JR was brilliant and the comedy was spot on. He was the one thing they got totally right. I loved his depression con and when he came out of it. I LOVED the walker. I loved that he was still smart and subtle and the wheels are turning. HATED Sue Ellen. Linda Gray's acting was top notch, but they played it all wrong. She should be living at Southfork, not necessarily drinking, but being the hating, DOA bitch that she is. She should be eating Ann alive trying to set things up for John Ross, especially in JR's absence. She made NO SENSE to me. None. Useless and a total bore.

The new characters were uniformly terrible. Dreadful, forgettable and just as bland as their JR Returns counterparts. Carmen shouldn't be there period, I feel that role should be reserved for Lucy, a Southfork resident who walks around with a glass of wine being a nosey talk to. Basically, Lucy is perfect to fill that void of a much needed colorful secondary character, which this show is missing. The girls are HORRIFIC. Elena has potential, since Jordana can act, but the writing is so poor for them. They seem so bland and aren't allowed to shine. Julie Gonzalo wasn't great and Rebecca isn't making any impression. I don't see the secrets or motivation or anything. I rank these two below Cally (an underrated gem btw), Tracey, April and Michelle. They have NO personality and are supposed to lead the female cast? Ridiculous. Even Marta Del Sol seems lacking a certain spark. The two boys are terrible as well. Josh Henderson is a little green, but the characterization for John Ross is no good. They went a very generic and predictable route with Christopher and John Ross and it shows. This rivalry can't make a show. And them sharing Elena is just zzzzzzzzz.

The storylines and overall writing:

How can you map a season around selling Southfork, yet only two people live there and it seems like an afterthought to everyone else? How are they organically going to run into each other and learn secrets or get into arguments, etc? It just feels weird and so unlike Dallas. Then you have this poorly defined story with Elena being the love interest for John Ross and Christopher. They need to scrap all of that for season two. This isn't strong enough to sustain a series. Larry Hagman and JR were the highlight, but that's it--and he's too old to carry this show. They need to try harder. Better cast and written female characters for a start.

Also, the dialogue was sooooooooo cheesy--and not in a good way. It was novella/Days of Our Lives bad. Very clunky, poor exposition and everything felt rushed. For as fast paced and rushed it was, I feel like nothing happened. A whole lot of nothing. That big scene with Marta and John Ross at Cowboys was style but no substance. They ruined what could be a GREAT twist and location with a completely forgettable scene that meant so little.

I feel like in general I was lied to by everyone making the writing out to be so great and so much better than the original lol . I say that tongue-in-cheek, but I feel it's true. If this were season 15 and we had years to reflect, I'm curious what the reaction would be. I feel like I'm in a Twilight Zone. These scripts are TERRIBLE. I now feel like Cidre and co are mocking the original by saying this is smarter and updated and not a soap but an epic drama. Dallas was a soap and it was a DAMN GOOD soap. Revenge wasn't afraid to be a soap and it proved that being a straight forward soap works.

I hope and pray Knots Landing isn't remade if this is what it has to be like. I have to hope and pray Lynn Marie Latham and Bernie Lechowick can write it, if it does happen. I know they weren't everyones cup of tea, but they re-invented Knots and kept it going strong for many years. They've also done good things with other shows. Hell, they should be writing season two of this show. Anybody but Cidre and her team.

I only watched the pilot episode (the first 1:15). I had pretty low hopes and it's wasn't enough to get me motivated enough to watch hour two. I almost was immediately turned off by the Bobby diagnosis. What a negative way to start a series. Anyway, the writing was lame and it was very predictable who was really buying the land. But whatever, I figure unless the series completely crashes and burns, it'll get a second season and the chance to straighten things out.

I don't think the writing was great but the twists and turns of who's working who IMO was all plot but a decent start on a show mostly filled with vapid characters and actors.

And I don't think JB is really any good. She has no presence or charisma on screen so I'm curious why she'd be a standout and why some feel she's special. She could be replaced easily with another cookie cutter actress.

I just can't say that the show stinks after one episode. I really enjoyed it. To me, all it was was a starting point. They have nine more episodes to go in this season. I'm with this for the long haul, and am truly glad they aged these original characters. if they were the same characters from the original there would be no point ion me watching at all.

See, I don't see Knots as being purely a more female dominated show. It just excelled better at integrating new characters and being an ensemble, and despite selling itself as one, I never saw DALLAS a true ensemble effort.

Can't argue with you there.

They need a new writing staff entirely, somebody with more bite. It was a paper thin soap when it has potential to be epic, like the original series.

Same.

Linda Gray's acting was top notch, but they played it all wrong. [sue Ellen] should be living at Southfork, not necessarily drinking, but being the hating, DOA bitch that she is. She should be eating Ann alive trying to set things up for John Ross, especially in JR's absence.

I disagree very strongly with this statement. I admire the fact that Sue Ellen evolved on a series where most everyone else either stayed the same or regressed into self-parody. (And I definitely don't see anything wrong with her getting involved with politics either. If anything, I want someone in that arena who could be her adversary as well as a third wheel in a triangle with her and J.R.)

I've said it before, and I'll say it again: Josh Henderson's John Ross is crying out for his own "Val." You want to see Linda Gray's Sue Ellen get bitchy? Bring on a trashy-yet-good-hearted girl with a mutual interest (John Ross' love...and concern about his drinking) to fight over.

How can you map a season around selling Southfork, yet only two people live there and it seems like an afterthought to everyone else? How are they organically going to run into each other and learn secrets or get into arguments, etc?

The truth is, the business/corporate stuff won't have the same bite to it that it did in the original series, because even the scandals surrounding the oil industry today aren't nowhere near as salacious as they were back in the '80's. Nostalgia buffs forget that the chief reason why the drama on shows like DALLAS and DYNASTY were so deliciously OTT was because those dramas were metaphors, of sorts, for the wild, excessive dramas playing out IRL in the oil, banking, and other industries. The stuff happening today just can't compete.

I just can't say that the show stinks after one episode.

I think "stinks" might be too strong of a word. Granted, I wasn't as impressed with the first two eps as I had hoped. However, the fact that I'm spinning in my head ideas for changes and improvements shows (for me) that there is some potential for growth. If it didn't spark my creative energies in any way, then I'd know it was doomed.

I rank these two below Cally (an underrated gem btw)

Whoo, it's another Cally fan! We're on the way!

http://tvline.com/2012/06/15/popular-tv-shows-2012-best-true-blood-twosome/

Did you get chills when the Dallas theme and familiar title sequence was cued up on the TNT series’ debut? Also, as “splashy” a visual it is to have John Ross and Elena frolicking in the downpour of a gusher, wouldn’t that oily grime be an absolute horror to ever wash off? (And kinda poisonous if ingested?)

And what do you think of this working theory: Someone paid off Bobby’s doc to misdiagnose him and cause false symptoms, thereby prodding him into selling Southfork.

She won't come back though... (Who played her brief return with the new face?)

and of course her exist...Margaret Michaels was the other Pam

I wouldn't go that far.

I don't mean in the sense that it's as awful a show/reboot/continuation as MP 2.0

Episode 2 just felt sooooo much like a MELROSE PLACE or SAVANNAH episode from the 90s.

4 episodes' worth of plot crammed into one hour, plot point after plot point, no time for characters, reflection, real conversations.

See, I don't see Knots as being purely a more female dominated show. It just excelled better at integrating new characters and being an ensemble, and despite selling itself as one, I never saw DALLAS as a true ensemble effort.

Yes, it respected and used both equally, although it did seem to recognize the power of very good female leads/characters.

I disagree very strongly with this statement. I admire the fact that Sue Ellen evolved on a series where most everyone else either stayed the same or regressed into self-parody. (And I definitely don't see anything wrong with her getting involved with politics either. If anything, I want someone in that arena who could be her adversary as well as a third wheel in a triangle with her and J.R.)

You see, evolving and changing is great, I very much agree on that, but it's a problem when a characters evolves into utter boringness and fakeness. The Sue Ellen that we saw is more of a shallow girl-power representation than a character. Even the original DALLAS chose to ignore Sue Ellen's initially complicated and fascinating aspects, dreams and desires in favor of Linda Gray-ing the hell out of the character (presumably partly because Gray was so popular).

I still miss that multi-dimensional character we saw in the first few seasons of the show and can't understand where she's gone. No surprise DALLAS 2.0 brought back the watered-down version.

As for her getting involved in politics... An alcoholic, who spent time in a sanitarium, was involved in car crashes, had numerous (public) affairs, has been in jail a couple of times and all that is a credible candidate for Governor? Only on a soap.