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Small Town Pine Valley vs. Big City Pine Valley


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I can see it now.... Angel Oprah announcing that she will saved AMC:

"OK, child. I have some awesome news. Starting in January of next year, my OWN network will be the new home of... All My CHIIIILDRRRREEEEEEEEEEENNNNNNN!" *massive applause... and a couple faints*

I bet she would, cause she wouldn't be able to live without it. If they cancelled ONE LIFE TO LIVE, well then AMC is my back up, but I would soooo miss seeing Erika Slezak and Robin Strasser. The are like distant aunts to me, I grew up watching them the time the secret room in Llanfair was the hot storyline. Anyways, Oprah would miss Erica...and Jackson...and Tad. I bet she would give control over to Agnes, have advise more than ABC lets her, and then get some real writers in to tell the stories they wanted....in essence she'd EP the sucker.

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I can watch Enid Nelson clips forever. I wish there was more of her stuff on youtube. I am actually a little surprised that of all the things to not be archived, Jenny and Greg seems to be the a huge missing chunk from youtube. I guess the AMC fans were not as hardcore as the GH and DOOL fans were. Pity, because the days of Enid were the glory days indeed.

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You know what is so funny...was when I was 16, 17 years old...I didn't care about Hayley and Brian, or Terrence and An-Li...or Timmy and Harold...I was sooooo into the adult stuff, and couldn't wait to have my own adventures like Erica feeling double crossed by Travis and Barbara who decided to make a baby in order to in turn save their daughter Molly, or was it Bianca, from an ailment.

Not funny at all--from talking to fans I think it's more common than not--, and this is what network heads do not get (and to be fair, have NEVER gotten ever since they started chasing youth in the late 70s because shows like AMC, Y&R had created the market successfully). My twin sister who kinda got me into AMC in a roundabout way did love Hayley and Brian but she lost interest quickly--for me it was always the older characters (though I did like a lot of the younger ones back then). And I think this is more true than not, when young people get into soaps.

The main market for Archie comic books is pre teens, cuz they want to live the lives of teenagers. Similarly, I think most teens want to experience the lives of those older than them--and I think Agnes Nixon's oft state point of supplying a sense of family to young people who didn't have one rings true too. Who watches Kendall/Zack/Greenlee/Ryan and wants to be them, or envy them? Only a few hardcore couple fans. To be a fan of a show like AMC was more about wanting to hang out in Myrtle's boarding house and discuss problems, wander over to the Pine Valley Inn and see Palmer and Adam get into an altercation, and yeah, maybe, to go to PVH and wonder why Hayley isn't allowed to be with Brian.

Even with Hayley and Brian--which was the 99th iriteration of Agnes Nixon's "young love" theme on AMC, who were the people in their way? Adam. Booze (not a who, I know :P ). Arlene, Trevor got into the fold--ie all adults. I don't blame the current writers for the lack of any of this--I blame the clueless people trying to chase a demo and somehow, after years, not realizing that young people who watch soaps largely watch for characters older than them.

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I can watch Enid Nelson clips forever. I wish there was more of her stuff on youtube. I am actually a little surprised that of all the things to not be archived, Jenny and Greg seems to be the a huge missing chunk from youtube. I guess the AMC fans were not as hardcore as the GH and DOOL fans were. Pity, because the days of Enid were the glory days indeed.

I would love for any of the Blue Danube/Budapest location shot which was less than a year into when I became a fan, and it all seems, oddly, completely missing in collections. Considering AMC was still at that time ranked the number one taped show ever, and the number two soap watched, it's, odd...

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you know what would be kind of cool, is if Vanessa Bennett came back to Pine Valley bought the Tyler estate as a base to operate from and became the shows "black queen" manipulating the hell out of people, while keeping an assortment of creamy stud houseboys in Phoebe Tyler Wallingford's once pristine home.

That wouldn't be kinda cool--it would be perfect. It's the kinda story that is missing from AMC, and I think from all soaps now.

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AMC always felt like the product of a marriage between Grace Metalius and Charles Dickens, if that makes any sense. It had that great small town, close-knit Peyton Place feel populated by very Dickensian characters.

It does, and I think this is exactly what Agnes did best. She mixed melodrama (often based around serious, and even shocking social issues) with young love stories and great, often comic caricatures. Her young love stories almost all would have been bland as [[email protected]#$%^&*], without the other stuff to balance them (Phil and Tara?? Greg and Jenny??) In Schemering's book he says many soap fans at the time found the balance hard going--and the change in tones and styles off putting, but that's why I love her classic writing so much, and why, as much as I respect him, I could never get into Bill Bell's one tone melodramas.

oing back to Dickens--that's how he held audiences' attention when he serialized stories. He would have young, innocent, likeable, (boring), lovers surrounded by over the top, often comic, often loving, caricatures that were written just well enough to seem real. In all honesty, I think at her top game, Agnes was as good as Charles.

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What if...they cancel it. Okay God forbid...but do you think Oprah would then pick it up as her OWN? I think she would. I seriously do. I think Oprah would save the show, as silly and far fetched as this is, Oprah loves her soap. And when Oprah is attached to something, she fights like a tiger to preserve it. I think it's a crazy faerie tale...but you never know.

Would never happen. I wish it would, but crazy talk. I think Agnes is still capable of maybe doing a final 6 weeks or something--and that would be my dream, though I have no idea how she would handle everything that's going on, even in a fan fiction way.

She said that even co-HW in 1999 exhausted her physically, so I guess it could never happen, but has any creator of *long running* soap been able to close their story?

I bet she would, cause she wouldn't be able to live without it. If they cancelled ONE LIFE TO LIVE, well then AMC is my back up, but I would soooo miss seeing Erika Slezak and Robin Strasser. The are like distant aunts to me, I grew up watching them the time the secret room in Llanfair was the hot storyline. Anyways, Oprah would miss Erica...and Jackson...and Tad. I bet she would give control over to Agnes, have advise more than ABC lets her, and then get some real writers in to tell the stories they wanted....in essence she'd EP the sucker.

Agnes doesn't want control is the thing though. I hate to put words into an old lady's mouth--but I've been kinda obsessive about her, and it's clear she still loves the show, but finds it hard to even keep up with daily. And why should she at her age?

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You mean the Pine Valley Inn? But I do definitely agree--I wish they'd just junk ConFusion and bring it back, they can keep Krystal's for lower key stuff the way they used to with McKay's (that was Tom's restaurant right?) and before that the random diner you can see Erica and Phil at in that 1970 episode.

I like the mix of rich and middle class that they had, myself--not all rich. But I really miss that snob set--Phoebe and Enid, etc (who Broderick brought back in 96--and then Agnes really tried hard to bring back in her brief return stint in 1999/2000, with that great side story about Opal trying to get Marian to get the group to accept her, etc). It's too bad, I really don't think the show is beyond being able to bring that back, you even got a tiny sense of it again when Broderick was interim, full HW last Spring, but they just have no interest in it (and I blame some of this on Frons, even if he's an easy scapegoat, I don't think it's the kind of thing he would even have a slight interest in).

I miss the Valley Inn. The scenes at the yacht club and that new hotel Annie hid out in (the Beacon?) just aren't the same. For the record, McKay's was not Tom's restaurant, it was more of a teen hangout run by Vern McKay. Tom owned the Goal Post.

AMC always felt like the product of a marriage between Grace Metalius and Charles Dickens, if that makes any sense. It had that great small town, close-knit Peyton Place feel populated by very Dickensian characters. Other shows may have had more complex characters and more layered storytelling, but very few shows were as atmospheric, dependent on humor, and laden with such unique characters. Even with all the urban flourishes Behr and Broderick brought to the show in the mid-90s, it still retained that small town vibe. I'm not a big fan of Francesca James's stint, mostly because it seemed so directionless a lot of the time to me, but she actually did a lot to restore that community feeling. Jean Burke, for all her many flaws, continued that, and it was nirvana when Agnes returned, restored the Glamorama, and had all that stuff with Vanessa who wanted to be accepted by PV Society and then with Opal and Marian. It was just classic AMC. As others have pointed out, the big change came when Frons appeared on the scene and tried to turn the show into some trendy Sex and the City clone with all that Fusion uber-crap that continues until this day. I remember his first press conference or something, where he described AMC as a show about youthful romance portrayed by very attractive young actors, or something like that. Yeah, that was part of the formula. He forgot about the other things that made AMC so special over the years...family, community, humor, the topic issues. And JHC obviously doesn't get the show either. I don't think any other show within recent memory has been as unrecognizable as AMC is right now. It's definitely gotten back on track a bit with D&D I think, but it'll never be even close to the same show I grew up with.

Grace Metalius crossed with Charles Dickens is a perfect description! I think the potential for Pine Valley to regain its feel is there if only the show would get a new EP who understands what made AMC so special.

What if...they cancel it. Okay God forbid...but do you think Oprah would then pick it up as her OWN? I think she would. I seriously do. I think Oprah would save the show, as silly and far fetched as this is, Oprah loves her soap. And when Oprah is attached to something, she fights like a tiger to preserve it. I think it's a crazy faerie tale...but you never know.

For one thing, I don't believe the rumors that one of ABC's soap is getting canceled. But after SoapNet goes off, I think it's possible for OWN to air AMC at 8 p.m.

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I can see it now.... Angel Oprah announcing that she will saved AMC:

"OK, child. I have some awesome news. Starting in January of next year, my OWN network will be the new home of... All My CHIIIILDRRRREEEEEEEEEEENNNNNNN!" *massive applause... and a couple faints*

I had the same thought. But recently on Twitter, someone asked Oprah if she plans to have any scripted shows on OWN. She said not in the immediate future because it's too pricey.

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The thing is when Francesca James had the helm, she quoted a lot about how it would be a modern day Peyton--I think she meant well, but back then I think she had no real direction. Since then--I'd gladly take her back.

Yeah, I think she saw AMC as a daytime PP, but, yeah, there seemed to be no real direction. It was under her IMO that the show began to take on that "let's throw anything against the wall and see what sticks" feeling that has continued on and off until this day. Yep, having said that, I would take her back in a heartbeat too. Given her pre-EP history with the show, she obviously cares deeply about the show and would probably restore some dignity. I doubt under her that we would've gotten the unabortion story or Tad burying Madden alive. I could be naively wrong, but I think she'd care too much about the show's integrity to greenlight inane plots like that.

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That clip is fantastic (and woot for the Canada reference). Natalie's mom was certainly different than later shown...

Yeah, I hadn't remembered Natalie's mom from those days. When Dena Dietrich showed up during the Jane Cox s/l my mom told me that she wasn't the first Wilma and the actress in that clip (Jo Henderson) had died in a car accident. :(

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Yeah, I hadn't remembered Natalie's mom from those days. When Dena Dietrich showed up during the Jane Cox s/l my mom told me that she wasn't the first Wilma and the actress in that clip (Jo Henderson) had died in a car accident. :(

There was actually another actress whose name I forgot who played Wilma in 86 I think, in between the great Jo Henderson's stints. Henderson was doing a play and was unavailable to reprise Wilma. I remember this other actress's interpretation of Wilma as being both dithering and conniving. Tad had accidentally shot Adam, and Adam wanted to keep it a secret from the media. Wilma found out and blackmailed Adam into letting her live at the mansion. This was probably close to the time EP Jackie Babbin was getting set to leave, and the show was doing these silly little plots with no long-term intention.

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