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As The World Turns Discussion Thread


edgeofnik

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Reading a Daytimers from February 1980, which mentions rumors of Keith Charles leaving (which I guess would put this in November or December 1979). They mention that Barbara Rucker still hadn't heard whether or not they were bringing Sandy back, but she thought they were.

Clearly they didn't.

I wonder what story plans they would have had for her if they did.

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Jan 5 1966

Everyone prepares for Ellen and David's wedding and imminent move to San Francisco. Judge Lowell, Claire, Paul, and Dan have all come to approve of the marriage. While Paul looks forward to having Ellen as his new mother, Dan cannot accept her as his mother, but he is happy for the couple nonetheless. The only person who challenges Ellen as the new Mrs. Stewart is Franny, the housekeeper, who refuses to abdicate control of the household. But Ellen is determined to be mistress of her own home and decides that Franny will not move with them to the West Coast. During the confrontation between the two women, Franny tries to blackmail Ellen, which leads to violent and tragic results.

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Is it customary to kiss someone on the mouth like that? I guess I get it with Scott and Margo (although I wonder if they were setting up a future relationship if Joe Breen hadn't had to leave), but Larry and Frannie were exes, so her kissing him on the lips is a little different. I don't remember her doing that in the previous episode. I also wonder if they were testing Frannie/Scott.

The comedy with Margo's horrible haircut was a nice throwback to when her stories weren't so miserable for her. She really does not like Dana. The show seems to treat Dana as a joke and a loser altogether (Margo making fun of the name of her shop in the last episode). Weird, as I remember them treating her sympathetically during those endless months she was at Casa Crawford.

Not all that interested in hearing Emily whine, but it's nice to see some of the Emily/Susan/Ellen drama, especially Susan going to Ellen to plead mercy for Emily.

Odd imagining Edwina and Ellen as friends.

Rosanna drab and the poor little rich girl flashbacks just seem lackluster.

Holden drab as always. I do think the woman who played Marsha was a good actress.

Surely Seth would have seen Holden?

Who is playing Ned's ex? At first I thought she was going to make a pass at Seth. That would have made the Snyders even more incestuous...

Why is Ned so interested in globetrotting? I wonder if they were stalling his relationship with Emma. Maybe they should have killed him on one of these trips. That would have made Lily and the Snyders even more angry at Lucinda (and Julie and Iva).

Poor Julie so tormented. I loved Caleb blasting Seth over the phone. MDM Caleb was always one of the more realistic characters in the Snyder family.

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Personally, I think P & G should have stepped in and switched Marland to a different show because his content 1991 through early 1993 was not up to par. In fact, I would think the fact that Marland tried to redo Holden, Meg, and Lily.. with Hutch, Tess, and Rosanna should have sent up red flags that he needed to be switched to a different show.

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The ratings had gone up the last few years, so I guess they were happy. I do think 1992 was an improvement (although very dark), but yeah, they never should have let him do the Lily knockoff.

I think he may have been leaving if he hadn't passed away (wasn't he trying to sell a soap of his own?).

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If they had moved Marland, I wish he would've went to Another World. I feel like he would've been the show's last hope. Marland is one of the few writers I think could've revitalized and stabilized the show.

re: The episode I posted earlier:

Carl, I noticed that kiss between Scott and Margo too. I found it to be odd but just tossed it to the side because of their closeness. But I loved how Scott blended in with the Hughes and accepted them as his surrogate family. He should've been brought back in later years to give Lisa and Tom story.

I am actually enjoying Frannie's story--at least the affair part. I could care less about who killed Darryl's ex-wife. I like how it ricocheted and affected Susan and Larry's marriage too. Susan has been annoying in the episode being posted lately but I understand her insecurity. Plus, I am beginning to love Larry McDermott. Again, I hate that Pass-the-Salami's hack ass would make him into an egg-napper in later years. He seems like such a decent guy. IMO, his character should've remained a mainstay on the show and in the hospital. Did Ed Fry opt to leave or did they write him off?

I know fans who were watching this in real time were sick of Marland drawing out the 'Holden is alive' bit. I am a bit by watching it now, but I am still endeared to the story because I know it'll lead to big payoffs--Julie and Lucinda's worlds being blown apart.

Plus, I am glad that Seth is speaking his mind unlike many other characters. Most are either ignoring the situation or giving Caleb & Julie a pass. Maybe because I like the gentle soul that is Angel. Or at least of what I've seen of her. I love to hate Julie, which is odd because she'd go on to pass the crown as resident bad girl to all my favorite character, Carly.

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Ed Fry was fired. They just had him cheat on Susan during his out of town job, I think. P&G/Valente fired a lot of the wrong people. Frankly I'm shocked they didn't fire Marie Masters too. I don't know how she hung on to the end, but I'm thankful she did.

It always bugged me a little that Caleb slept with Carly not long before he and Julie left town (I'm not sure Julie knew) but those scenes of Julie and Carly working at the yacht club were definitely a torch-passer.

I just loved Julie. She always got to me. She messed up but she was so vulnerable and she never meant to hurt anybody (after her early plans against Duke, anyway). It's funny because some of my views on characters then and now have changed - I find Iva and Shannon a little more annoying - but my feelings about Julie are exactly the same.

I'm not sorry Seth spoke up, but I also feel like the family was too into the Angel/Caleb relationship to begin with, as Angel was too fragile for someone as volatile as Caleb. And then this was also set up for Seth/Angel. I liked Caleb's reaction because Caleb and Meg were the two main Snyders who felt most "real" to me, in their emotional range and how they could say terrible things but still love each other.

I liked Angel too. She's a character who on many soaps, even back then, would have been a psycho, but Marland never went that cheap route with her.

Holden really wasn't "dead" that long - just a few months. I guess I can see why people were bored of him doing slow-talk with Marsha and having wet dreams about her, but the rest of the story was riveting, and the payoff was worth it.

Edited by DRW50
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The reason I think that P & G should have switched Marland to another show in 1990/1991 was due to the mindset of P & G in the old days that believed that writers would burn out/ repeat themselves if they stayed at the same show for too long. This was probably due to Harding Lemay basically becoming burnt out at AW after being there for almost 8 years, and him admitting to that fact.

Hence why you saw the Dobson's switched to ATWT while Marland was switched to GL.

I don't think Marland would have worked at AW to be honest. I could have seen Pam Long at AW more then Marland, tbh.

I do think Angel ending up with Seth made sense. Two nice people finding each other and riding off together. Not a thing for romance novels, but it was a nice B/C story.

Edited by Soaplovers
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But I think his writing would've been well for AW. Especially for a blue collar family like the Frames. IMO, he would've had a field day with Sharlene, John, and Josie on that farm. I think he would've had fun with Iris too. He would've probably mirrored her after Lucinda but it would've been better than what happened to Iris in the long haul--shooting Carl and being hauled off to prison never to heard from again. I think the only thing he might've struggled with was the friendship/hybrid family aspect of AW. While he had strong friendships at ATWT, they were mediocre [and much of daytime] to the strong friendly bonds AW displayed.

He would've needed a strong co-head writer with history on the show to help him cipher through the waters, but once he found footing, I think he would've excelled.

But I'm iffy about Pam Long. While I've enjoyed what I've seen of her writing, I don't know if she would've meshed well with AW. I know some posters have said that she did well at SFT but again, I don't know if she'd excel at AW. I think she would've did well with the Hudson [mainly Vicky] and Harrison clans, but flopped with the rest. Early 90s soap was heading back towards character driven stories [thanks to Bell, Nixon, Curlee, Malone, Labine, and Marland] and were straying from action packed stories [which were becoming a thing of tomorrow but would be revitalized thanks to Reilly in '94/95-ish] that Long excelled at.

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