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Mess. Overly complicated and prone-to-failure voting techniques don't help. I mean, there was a 'voting app' and it crashed repeatedly. Should've just had people mark an X on a paper ballot and called it a day.

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Seeing the cultists stamp their feet on Twitter has been the tonic I really needed today. They are such disgusting people who emulate Trump and who constantly push conspiracy theories and spew poison even as they constantly claim to be voices of righteousness and goodness. They were so sure this was their big moment, years in the making, only for it to be gone forever. To know it was taken from them, and partly because of operations their dear leader insisted on implementing, is very satisfying. 

 

Whatever happens next, however much they ruin the rest of the election and try to give Trump another 4 years, I will always look back on tonight and laugh at these Very, Very Special and Intelligent People resorting to trying to make "Mayor McCheat" trend like they're writing a [!@#$%^&*] McDonald's commercial. 

 

Good times.

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Boy, I'm glad I didn't stay up to try to track this mess!  Yesterday, there were whispers that it was going to be a clusterf*ck and I believed it, so I didn't bother to try to track what was going on last night, knowing the mess would likely spill over into a new day. The Bernie Bros and the Trumpists are having a field day.  I've only been casually following things lately and even I've noticed this. 

 

It's really time for the Democratic party to acknowledge that we're in the 21st century and a 19th-20th century presidential primary system built solely for white men might not work that well for a party that tries to tout diversity. 

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https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2020/02/trump-plots-revenge-on-bolton-impeachment-enemies

 

With Senate Republicans on track to acquit Donald Trump on Wednesday, Washington is bracing for what an unshackled Trump does next. Republicans briefed on Trump’s thinking believe that the president is out for revenge against his adversaries. “It’s payback time,” a prominent Republican told me last week. “He has an enemies list that is growing by the day,” another source said. Names that came up in my conversations with Republicans included Adam Schiff, Jerry Nadler, Mitt Romney, and John Bolton. “Trump’s playbook is simple: go after people who crossed him during impeachment.”

 

 
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Also, don't over-exaggerate Iowa's importance to the point that you drive out candidates that could have sustained interest in the primaries before the primaries even begin. 

As it is, I'm hearing about low-turnout at yesterday's caucus. 

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So basically what I'm seeing on Twitter is that Bernie won but also lost, Biden lost but this was also good for him and Buttigieg worked with Hillary Clinton to develop the app. You know, completely sane stuff.

 

(Honestly all I can really determine is that the Berners are pissed off which always makes me happy.)

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Bernie's followers are braying for a witch-hunt over who is to blame for this (read: Dem hierarchy). It's a bad day for Dems all around. State of the Union tonight (and I'm sure DT will go wildly off-script in order to lay into his opponents), while Gallup has just farted up the Dear Leader's poll ratings for January, which were the highest they have ever been -- admittedly at a mediocre 49%.

 

https://news.gallup.com/poll/284156/trump-job-approval-personal-best.aspx

Edited by Cat
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Wow.  So much to digest in this thread.  Apologies if I go "over my time," lol.

 

On 2/3/2020 at 11:27 AM, Cat said:

I understand your POV. There have been elections where I did not vote either, either because of apathy or fatalist feelings. It is only after Brexit and Trump that I realise what a fragile thing democracy is, and how much I would miss it if it were gone. I would always regret not having tried to keep its small flame burning if it were ever snuffed out.

 

Exactly.  God knows this republic of ours ain't the greatest, but it's a far sight better than what others across the globe have.  I'm not ready or willing to throw it away or burn it all to the ground until I feel I've done all I could to make it better.

 

On 2/3/2020 at 11:29 AM, DRW50 said:

Bernie's cult has made it very clear they will not vote for anyone but Bernie - if he doesn't get the nomination then they're done (I imagine many will vote for Trump). So I think that means anyone who isn't in a competitive state should be free to not vote for Bernie and just focus on downballot races. He hasn't earned votes beyond that, in my opinion, and I don't think he ever will. 

 

As I see it, if Bernie doesn't get the nomination, we're screwed, because Berners will be out to punish the rest of us like they did in 2016; if he does get the nomination and loses -- and he will lose, if he does get it -- then we're screwed, because no way will he be able to defeat Donald Trump; and if he does get the nomination and actually wins, then we're screwed once more, because I think we'll see right away how little that man actually cares about anything other than lining his own pockets with cash.

 

No matter how you slice it, then, we're just plain screwed.  So, yeah, from here on out, I think I'll be concentrating more on down-ballot races in my state.  Especially now that the clusterf**k known as the Iowa Caucus has happened.

 

On 2/3/2020 at 12:10 PM, Fevuh said:

Sanders just isn't marketable and I have so many Democrat friends that feel the same.  Too socialist and too polarizing.  

 

If Bernie were to become the nominee, the only thing going for him would be, "He ain't Donald Trump."  But, would that be enough?

 

I've nothing to say about Rush Limbaugh...except, maybe Rosie O'Donnell was right about how lying gives you cancer.

 

15 hours ago, DRW50 said:

And if this is accurate, turnout is at 2016 levels, which suggests many are burned out on this campaign already (there was tons of hype that Bernie bros would help cause a big turnout surge).

 

Aisha Moodie-Mills made an interesting point this morning on NPR's "The Point"*: Democrats stay looking for another, galvanizing, Obama-like force to excite them into showing up at the voting booths.  Basically, she said, we gotta stop looking for that next savior, because he ain't comin'.  If our primary objective in 2020 is to get rid of Donald Trump, then we're gonna have to save ourselves.

 

(*Yes, I listen to NPR.  Shut up.)

 

14 hours ago, Soapsuds said:

CNN is saying mayor Pete is the one who got the shaft while it helped Biden who will probably finish 4th. Pete would've gotten a bump.

 

They didn't really say "got the shaft," did they?  Because, if they used those exact words to describe a gay man's performance in a political (or any) contest, then they should be very ashamed of themselves.

 

(And I'm not even gonna TOUCH "a bump.")

Edited by Khan
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I admit I am relatively new to following politics, but it does seem to me that caucus-ing, rather than simply casting ballots, isn't exactly the smartest way to go about determining nominees and delegates.  And just how did we decide on IA and NH going first anyway?  Did we flip a coin or something?

 

How about if the states simply went in alphabetical order instead, or in order of admittance to the union?

 

14 hours ago, DRW50 said:

Bernie's cultists are saying it's all rigged of course, like it always is. 

 

Ugh.  You could only imagine how a Bernie vs. Trump election would go.  One side would win; the other would say it's rigged; and we'll spend the following four years going on and on and on about it.

 

I say, in the future, we play tag to determine our leaders.  It's much more efficient.

 

13 hours ago, ReddFoxx said:

The best thing for a campaign to do would be to write Iowa off as a loss due to error and focus on the next states coming up. Delegate wise it wouldn't really hurt to do that and it would avoid drama. New Hampshire is a primary so there will be no craziness because the votes are tabulated and reported out by the state.

 

Why do we even NEED caucuses and primaries?  Couldn't we just cut to the national convention?

Edited by Khan
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4 hours ago, sivad40 said:

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2020/02/trump-plots-revenge-on-bolton-impeachment-enemies

 

With Senate Republicans on track to acquit Donald Trump on Wednesday, Washington is bracing for what an unshackled Trump does next. Republicans briefed on Trump’s thinking believe that the president is out for revenge against his adversaries. “It’s payback time,” a prominent Republican told me last week. “He has an enemies list that is growing by the day,” another source said. Names that came up in my conversations with Republicans included Adam Schiff, Jerry Nadler, Mitt Romney, and John Bolton. “Trump’s playbook is simple: go after people who crossed him during impeachment.”

 

If Trump wins re-election, the next four years will make the past four years seem like paradise by comparison.

 

I'm truly worried about the future of this country.

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15 minutes ago, Khan said:

Why do we even NEED caucuses and primaries?  Couldn't we just cut to the national convention?

One national primary where everyone votes on the same day would solve lots of problems, but there are some states would be be high resistant because they covet their first in the nation status.

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5 minutes ago, ReddFoxx said:

One national primary where everyone votes on the same day would solve lots of problems, but there are some states would be be high resistant because they covet their first in the nation status.

I think Iowa blew their status. And I could care less.

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3 minutes ago, JaneAusten said:

I think Iowa blew their status. And I could care less.

Me too.  I'm DC so there is NOOOOO turning it off.  Politics 24/7 and I swear last night I watched a little and said - foreign countries hacking in again.  How do you NOT measure and count votes.  But Caucuses are stupid.  You show up and run from one group to another?  Just VOTE.  A bunch of people show up and basically run around and talk to each other and get influenced by people who.......may not be very smart.  They've assured us that no one is hacking.  But apps suddenly don't work, votes not counted AGAIN.  How many years does it take to learn from dangling chads?  We've been doing this for awhile now and there's always SOMETHING.  It's so ridiculous.  

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