I have never been so disguted and appaled by the lack of insensitivity displayed by a post on this site. EricaKane4Life when did you become the spokeperson for the Black community? I think that is what has me most upset. Your implication that all Black people are bigoted towards the Gay Community is beyond offensive and ignorant. While I respect that you are entitled to your opinion, the audacity that you have shown attempting to speak for the African-American community is beyond disturbing. While you may be a so called insider within the television community do not try and speak upon things you really have no clue about.

I have never been so disguted and appaled by the lack of insensitivity displayed by a post on this site. EricaKane4Life when did you become the spokeperson for the Black community? I think that is what has me most upset. Your implication that all Black people are bigoted towards the Gay Community is beyond offensive and ignorant. While I respect that you are entitled to your opinion, the audacity that you have shown attempting to speak for the African-American community is beyond disturbing. While you may be a so called insider within the television community do not try and speak upon things you really have no clue about.

Did he not say "most"? Honestly, I don't know. The point is, according to studies on this subject, "most" blacks are against and find a major taboo in the male/male relationship, particularly one between too blacks. I guess that's why I didn't find Erica's post offensive. Perhaps it was too general, though, and I glossed over that. All I know is what I've read and heard, and that is that most blacks seem to disapprove of the 'down low' phenomenon.

Hey, why get mad at Erica? Almost all of the things he said can be backed up by research. I've read several articles about "down low" in the black community and I don't have to be black to know how this phenomenon is viewed by people people of color. Thanks to scholars and researchers who do the work for people like Erica and me, yes, we can speak about his subject.

Yes, you can speak about the subject, but there are many African Americans in the world who are not like that, even though some are.

I know many African Americans and none of them are like what you and Erika are saying.

Unless scholars and researchers know every single African American, things they say could be just a few people's opinions and not the whole community itself.

I don't know, Steve. Isn't that the GREAT thing about his storyline? The chance that we CAN see some Chad-on-Jared (or whomever) ACTION? I should hope you aren't saying we should be anti-sodomy!

No I did not say that. I said the majority of people are and they see it as a dirty thing. So that is the reason they are going to be against. No I do not think people should be anti-sodomy, and I never said I was.

My philosophy is what goes on between two consenting adults is their business, not mine or anyone elses. And I feel that God gave us a remote control for a reason. If something comes on we don't want to see, then change the channel, but don't tell me what I should see on my TV.

Someone made a great point in the Luke on ATWT thread...why is it that shows like "Brothers and Sisters" and "Desperate Housewives" can get away with these types of stories but for soaps, it's not an option? That's what I fail to see. Especially since "Passions" seems to skew a LOT younger than the usual soap and thus viewers aren't as likely to oppose things that the older, more conservative demo may object to. I know Erica mentioned the black demo is more than what I would have guessed for "Passions" but still...

Unless scholars and researchers know every single African American, things they say could be just a few people's opinions and not the whole community itself.

My point exactly. Who cares about what people have heard and what people have read.

To also claim that the entire black community disciminates against "mixed" or light skinned black men is absurd.

Where is this information coming from? Books from the 1800's??

My point exactly. Who cares about what people have heard and what people have read.

To also claim that the entire black community disciminates against "mixed" or light skinned black men is absurd.

Where is this information coming from? Books from the 1800's??

I never said "entire." That wouldn't be true about any issue. The books, however, do say it's prevalent.

I never said "entire." That wouldn't be true about any issue. The books, however, do say it's prevalent.

I wasn't speaking about your post. I was talking about EK4L.

But what books are you all speaking of? I'd really love to crack them open and inform my brain on these matters.

downwhtone believe me just don't even bother with EK4L or JSF.

downwhtone believe me just don't even bother with EK4L or JSF.

DruRocks, Oh, NO, you di-in't!! Several SONers have complimented me on my new leaf. In case you haven't heard, I am SAFE, girlfriend!

Having said that, I knew, down, you'd ask that question. Frankly, I forget where I read it. I was obsessed with the phenomenon at one point, and just did a little amateur research on the issue.

Here you go again with "Jimmy Reilly"'s alleged "Conservative Catholicism." I don't know if you saw Friday's episode, but while it may have been conservative, how Fr. Lonigan handled Simone and Rae, it certainly wasn't anti-gay. I have yet to see one anti-gay message on the show. Okay, I'll concede there was a negative side to the character of Charlie, but since then? Haven't seen much of any of this "anti-gay" propaganda. Examples, please!

Well there weren't anti-Black messages in AMOS & ANDY or BEULAH either, but the title characters were portrayed as stereotypes, which, IMO, is JUST the same as an anti-gay message.

And I seem to recall reading somewhere about Kay(then played by Taylor Anne Mountz) calling two of her classmates "queens" during the planning for the Harmony Boat Prom.

I think the character of Charlie is a good reason for me not to trust Reilly with gay characters. I think the fact that maybe Simone is a relatively low-key gay character(never seen her, so I can't say), he doesn't want to feature her often. The character of Charlie was on every day, aggressively flirting with Beth(a STRAIGHT female), butch talking, dressing and acting. And on top of all of that, the character was really a man anyway. I'm sorry, maybe it's the English major in me talking, but how can one NOT look at these things and determine that Reilly is making a social comment about lesbians or gays in general?

JSF, even with "soaps," someone is always trying to make some sort of statement or social commentary and it may not be as blatant as saying, "I hate gays."

DruRocks, Oh, NO, you di-in't!! Several SONers have complimented me on my new leaf. In case you haven't heard, I am SAFE, girlfriend!

Having said that, I knew, down, you'd ask that question. Frankly, I forget where I read it. I was obsessed with the phenomenon at one point, and just did a little amateur research on the issue.

New leaf? What on earth are you talking about? You seem the same to me except you are Mr. Love EK4L now.

And,i I kind of agree with DruRocks on the don't mess with them thing. JSF is fine in my opinion though, it's just Erika Kane 4 Life I have gotten to where I can't stand him because he acts like the ruler of the world and even at times seems like a child.

And, I still think Chad is with a guy for the record, just don't know who.....hmmmmm....

Well there weren't anti-Black messages in AMOS & ANDY or BEULAH either, but the title characters were portrayed as stereotypes, which, IMO, is JUST the same as an anti-gay message.

And I seem to recall reading somewhere about Kay(then played by Taylor Anne Mountz) calling two of her classmates "queens" during the planning for the Harmony Boat Prom.

I think the character of Charlie is a good reason for me not to trust Reilly with gay characters. I think the fact that maybe Simone is a relatively low-key gay character(never seen her, so I can't say), he doesn't want to feature her often. The character of Charlie was on every day, aggressively flirting with Beth(a STRAIGHT female), butch talking, dressing and acting. And on top of all of that, the character was really a man anyway. I'm sorry, maybe it's the English major in me talking, but how can one NOT look at these things and determine that Reilly is making a social comment about lesbians.

JSF, even with "soaps," someone is always trying to make some sort of statement or social commentary and it may not be as blatant as saying, "I hate gays."

I knew it! I knew someone would bring up the TAM fiasco.

I saw nothing wrong with it.

Basically, two gay men wanted to become king and queen of the Harmony High prom. Kay just made a comment like, "Don't they mean queen and queen?"

Definitely not the exact quote but that was the gist of it. And you know you would find something like that, if not more blatant or "worse" on Will and Grace. Grace always called the guys "homos" and such. that show was much more over-the-top than "Passions."

Besides, it seems most gays like calling themselves queens. So again, how was Kay's dialogue offensive? Heck, that particular show may have even tried to highlight a not-so-talked-about issue: that plight of gay high school students who want to have some crown at the prom!

But we could go on and on about this. As you said, it's all about those Engligh critiquing courses. Queer theory and such. As I just pointed out, someone could even claim JER was promoting the gay culture with that incident.

New leaf? What on earth are you talking about? You seem the same to me except you are Mr. Love EK4L now.

And,i I kind of agree with DruRocks on the don't mess with them thing. JSF is fine in my opinion though, it's just Erika Kane 4 Life I have gotten to where I can't stand him because he acts like the ruler of the world and even at times seems like a child.

And, I still think Chad is with a guy for the record, just don't know who.....hmmmmm....

I have started exactly zero trouble since the new me. That's the new leaf.

As for the last statement, Chad is DEFINTELY with a guy...the only question is, will NBC force JER to rewrite it?

I knew it! I knew someone would bring up the TAM fiasco.

I saw nothing wrong with it.

Basically, two gay men wanted to become king and queen of the Harmony High prom. Kay just made a comment like, "Don't they mean queen and queen?"

Definitely not the exact quote but that was the gist of it. And you know you would find something like that, if not more blatant or "worse" on Will and Grace. Grace always called the guys "homos" and such. that show was much more over-the-top than "Passions."

Grace is a "fag-hag," as is Karen. Kay's just an immature little high school girl and it was obvious that they were doing it for cheap laughs. I've never exactly said WILL & GRACE was on the forefront of positively representing Gay America either.

As I just pointed out, someone could even claim JER was promoting the gay culture with that incident.

Promoting or taking pot shots? You say e-ther, I say eye-ther. Let's call the whole thing off.