@Soapsuds you are corrrect about the huge ratings slide. It was the combo of three things: Ryan's and Malcolm's death and AB leaving. And the horrific Neil in the gutter storyline. All happened in a very short period of time. Y&R lost over a million viewers in a short period of time. Many blamed the loss solely on SM leaving, but SR and AB were extremely popular And CBS started doing surveys, etc. I believe this slide directly lead them to bringing VR back to stem the flow, especially among AA viewers. If someone has a better memory of this era, please chime in. 

I'd have thought things like the Brad/Olivia affair would have played as much of a part as something like AB leaving, especially since Mac quickly became such an aimless character anyway. 

1 minute ago, DRW50 said:

I'd have thought things like the Brad/Olivia affair would have played as much of a part as something like AB leaving, especially since Mac quickly became such an aimless character anyway. 

 

I forgot about that. That was such a gross and not believable story - not because of the actors - because the characters wouldn't do that to Ashley. I hated that story and I LOVE both TLW & DD. 

I believe AB and DT were a popular couple by the viewers. For me they were the future of the soap. I thought the pairing was great and then you had Jill and Katherine to fuel the fire. I don't think Ryan hurt them that much ratings wise. At the time he left the ratings for Y&R were in the low 5's HH. Early that year they were in the high 5's ratings wise. The stories started getting bad and thus the ratings drop.

Edited February 24, 20178 yr by Soapsuds

3 minutes ago, Soapsuds said:

I believe AB and DT were a popular couple by the viewers. For me they were the future of the soap. I thought the pairing was great and then you had Jill and Katherine to fuel the fire. I don't think Ryan hurt them that much ratings wise. At the time he left the ratings for Y&R were in the low 5's HH. Early that year they were in the high 5's ratings wise. The stories started getting bad and thus the ratings drop.

 

Mac/Billy and the sperm story were the two reasons I quit watching, so I can't say. I imagine the pairing was popular with others though.

DT & AB were hugely popular.

 

Jess Walton never received her rightful accolades for that story (Byrne and Lucci's first Emmy's and a couple of Flannery's Stephanie-era Emmys rightfully belong to Jess). Which was a virtual tour de force for her AND Jill. 

 

Grambo's spermcapades was gross & nearly ruined the show. The only reason it semi-worked was the rich histories of the characters and the skill of the actors involved.

 

 

Am I wrong for believing there should have been some sort of Hevon follow up?  Lemme guess, the next time we see them, Hevon will be fully reconciled?  It happened way too fast to the point that I don't know if it was real or a fantasy and then there's nothing the next day?  Huh?  Sally's pacing and non storytelling is just awful!  

 

29 minutes ago, ChitHappens said:

Am I wrong for believing there should have been some sort of Hevon follow up?  Lemme guess, the next time we see them, Hevon will be fully reconciled?  It happened way too fast to the point that I don't know if it was real or a fantasy and then there's nothing the next day?  Huh?  Sally's pacing and non storytelling is just awful!  

 

When Devon approached Hilary about feeling jealous and then kissed her, I fully expected to see Hilary "snap out of it".  My first impulse was that it was a fantasy.  OTOH, Devon has been shown to be on the fence about going through with the divorce though (with others, not Hils).  And apparently the hint of another man finding Hilary attractive and flirting with her pushed him to take action.  I would have liked a little more build.  Several days of her flirting with Jordan for example and seeing Devon seethe a little.  There should have been follow up the next day.

 

I don't know how much influence she has or what her role is, but I noticed more story misses since Sara Bibel joined the writing team.  I have no idea if there's a connection there, just my observation.

 

I don't have a problem with Devon and Hillary, sharing a moment in the heat of passion. There was a scene where Devon corrected Mariah (or was it Lily?) and emphasized that he and Hillary are still married. Also, he clearly stated that he didn't even like the idea of Hillary with someone else, so that kiss I don't have a problem with.

What I would have a problem with is if the next time we see them, they're humming along as if they are a happy fully reconciled couple.

 

One kiss does not mean all their problems are fixed, it means the feelings are clearly still there. There need to be a scene or two where they discuss the kiss, try to decipher what it means going forward but acknowledge that their relationship still has some real 'issues'.

 

Edited February 24, 20178 yr by DramatistDreamer

23 hours ago, DramatistDreamer said:

Are we really going to try to pretend that sex has never been a selling point on this show??

 

Although Nikki was not seen strutting in a bikini, it was her shaking her moneymaker at the Bayou that hooked Victor! Now we can debate what led Nikki to the stripper pole but even in her later years, Nikki has always been shown to embrace those years, regretting nothing and even looking back on those times fondly.

 

A conversation about all of this and no one has mentioned Brad Carlton or his pecs?  What about Malcolm Winters and his abs?  

 

Perhaps because Y&R always made a distinct effort to appeal to its core audience of mainly women, it has often made a point to parade and display many of the male characters that have appeared on this show, while others (Jack, Victor) just were not - even during the illustrious William J. Bell years, this was part of Y&R's DNA.

 

Now we can discuss whether this is an antiquated holdover from a previous period but are we really going to try to re-write history here and make Y&R into something it has never been?

 

For sure! One of the first Y&R episodes I ever saw was Doug Davidson (back in 1987/88) in a bedroom scene with some woman called Farren, and he flashed his naked backside to camera. It was considered groundbreaking back in the day, but was sadly never repeated.

 

And absolutely, Y&R's DNA since Day One was about sex, society's attitudes to sex, and the psychological ramifications of that. Who was getting it, who wasn't. Who was repressed about it, who wasn't.

Mac and Billy are why I started watching. I believe my first episode was the prom one, Billy and Mac kissed at the mansion, Jill saw and she proceeded to eviscerate Mac. All I could think was "Why is this lady being so MEAN to this girl?" and why is this one scene better than everything I'd ever seen in a soap before (I thought the only soaps that existed were on ABC)?

@DramatistDreamer a passionate kiss in the heat of the moment, absolutely! But Devon's words are in contrast to the things he's been saying to Hill the past few weeks. Correcting Mariah is not enough for Devon's confession, IMO. And then nothing?  

@GMac

@ChitHappens

@DramatistDreamer

 

I'm convinced that kiss was a fantasy. It just made no sense to throw them back together like that after a such a long time of angst then being off for two full weeks. That set up and kiss was something that'd come after a small spat. Not after divorce papers have been drawn up. 

 

I assume we are supposed to wonder did they or didn't they with bated breath suspense for the next 2 weeks. That being how long it'll be before we see them again. 

 

 

Edited February 24, 20178 yr by ajsp35801

18 minutes ago, ChitHappens said:

@DramatistDreamer a passionate kiss in the heat of the moment, absolutely! But Devon's words are in contrast to the things he's been saying to Hill the past few weeks. Correcting Mariah is not enough for Devon's confession, IMO. And then nothing?  

 

I don't disagree with you. Even though the idea of Devon being a walking contradiction doesn't bother me, it would be bad writing if the next time we see them, we are being forced to believe that one kiss negates everything that led to their separation. And having this tremendous lag time is forcing the viewers to guess whether or not, the writing will acknowledge that Devon and Hillary's marriage is still on the brink of divorce.

 

I've been complaining about pacing for over a month with Lauren's Fenmore's story. I'm glad to see I'm no longer the only one who sees this how much of a problem this is.

 

@ajsp35801 I'm about done (done, I tell you!) with the "Is it real or is it fantasy?" device. It's so overused and often used badly.

Edited February 24, 20178 yr by DramatistDreamer

Why is Lauren discussing Scott with Phyllis when she should be confiding in Cricket?