1 hour ago, DRW50 said:

 

He actually said that? No wonder the writing for her was so suffocating.

 

I would have wanted a bang for Barbara too, but compared to the way she and the other vets were showcased (or not showcased), I was pleased enough. If Hal had still been alive (Benjamin Hendrickson too of course) I would have wanted them back together.

 

I haven't really seen a lot of Barbara and Gunnar together so I can't judge their relationship.

 

The good thing about the Gunnar character is that he basically disappeared with the assumption that he later died.  There was no jumping out of airplanes or something that the viewer would have to suspend disbelief to make his return plausible because no one ever truly found out what happened to him.  Any good writer worth her salt could make it happen, especially is the groundwork is laid (without a reveal) at least a good nine months before his return. 

 

And written well and effectively, the payoff of having Gunnar declare that after discovering James' role in his circumstances (and having a final confrontation with James where Gunnar ultimately 'puts down' James for good), he rid everyone (especially Barbara) of the menace (the irony would be that she informs Gunnar that she hasn't been afraid of James for years as she's no longer the frightened woman she used to be).

 

Sadly. Benjamin Hendrickson died years before the show's end, so I would not have recast Hal.  The part of the story where everyone mourned his loss- I would not touch that in any re-writing of the show's final years.  There are plenty of other things about the show that I would absolutely have written away but this wouldn't be one of those things.

 

Although, I usually dislike the concept of a 'Sliding Doors' storytelling device where you have an alternative reality, if I had the chance, I would apply some variation of it to go back in time in the show's timeline and re-write some things out of existence.  Some of the stories in the last decade were so atrocious and contrived that it could be done quite seamlessly, if done carefully.

Edited June 22, 20187 yr by DramatistDreamer

Henry and Barbara were THE BEST!!!  And Colleen thinks so herself - when I ran into her at an audition, we talked for quite awhile and she was as thrilled that the writers put her with Henry as I was. It was a completely unexpected pairing that just worked brilliantly. They were so fun together and Barbara hadn't been fun for a looooooooooooong time. Their dancing together was a hoot - Colleen said those scenes were so much fun for her to play due to her being a dancer at the beginning of her career. She hadn't gotten to really dance in such a long time - it was a joy for her. I'm so sorry to hear that so many fans on this board didn't like it because Colleen said she was having the time of her life!  And, of course, having a younger man is always nice.

 

It was great to hear about what happened with Soap Classics - that 80s music always comes back to bite us soap fans in the butt. I get so frustrated when I go to watch an AW or ATWT video and get the message "This has been restricted due to copyright infringement."  I'm telling you, I know I"m probably in the minority but ATWT is like a drug for me. I'm would just open my wallet for P&G if I could buy episodes of that via Amazon or iTunes.

16 minutes ago, adrnyc said:

Henry and Barbara were THE BEST!!!  And Colleen thinks so herself - when I ran into her at an audition, we talked for quite awhile and she was as thrilled that the writers put her with Henry as I was. It was a completely unexpected pairing that just worked brilliantly. They were so fun together and Barbara hadn't been fun for a looooooooooooong time. Their dancing together was a hoot - Colleen said those scenes were so much fun for her to play due to her being a dancer at the beginning of her career. She hadn't gotten to really dance in such a long time - it was a joy for her. I'm so sorry to hear that so many fans on this board didn't like it because Colleen said she was having the time of her life!  And, of course, having a younger man is always nice.

 

 

Yes, Colleen mentioned how much she loved the Henry pairing a while back. I was so disappointed in hearing it. I pretty much stated that I hated the pairing and wanted her with Gunnar. For some reason she didn't believe Gunnar was her true love. Very odd......

19 minutes ago, adrnyc said:

 

 

It was great to hear about what happened with Soap Classics - that 80s music always comes back to bite us soap fans in the butt. I get so frustrated when I go to watch an AW or ATWT video and get the message "This has been restricted due to copyright infringement."  I'm telling you, I know I"m probably in the minority but ATWT is like a drug for me. I'm would just open my wallet for P&G if I could buy episodes of that via Amazon or iTunes.

Did you get to purchase the ATWT DVDs that were released?

Henry/Barbara as a fun fling made sense... but having them as endgame.. wasn't cool.  And the show ruined Vienna to prop Henry/Barbara up.  It never made sense Vienna would try to win Henry when she was beautiful and full of life.. that she could have had any guy she wanted.  That's why I wasn't a big Henry/Barbara fan because of what was done to Vienna to make it happen.

 

@vetsoapfan @DRW50 yup.. Goutman actually said that about Katie... in a Paley interview, to boot.  It was like he was living in a bubble and refused to see reality.  It didn't do the show good nor did it do any good for the character of Katie (who I thought was interesting her first year or two on the show when written as a trouble maker).  The actress was better served when she went to OLTL as Aubrey where the writing wrote to her strengths.

Well, I'm glad someone (namely, CZ) enjoyed Barbara and Henry's relationship.  Too bad there were others who didn't.

 

Henry paired with ANY woman never made sense.  I'm sorry, but there you have it.

18 minutes ago, Soaplovers said:

Henry/Barbara as a fun fling made sense... but having them as endgame.. wasn't cool.  And the show ruined Vienna to prop Henry/Barbara up.  It never made sense Vienna would try to win Henry when she was beautiful and full of life.. that she could have had any guy she wanted.  That's why I wasn't a big Henry/Barbara fan because of what was done to Vienna to make it happen.

 

 

I had forgotten Vienna. I loved her and Goutman totally ruined her. She was many in the casualties by Goutman. I enjoyed her pairing with Henry. Breaking them up was a huge mistake IMO.

20 minutes ago, Soaplovers said:

 

 

@vetsoapfan @DRW50 yup.. Goutman actually said that about Katie... in a Paley interview, to boot.  It was like he was living in a bubble and refused to see reality.  It didn't do the show good nor did it do any good for the character of Katie (who I thought was interesting her first year or two on the show when written as a trouble maker).  The actress was better served when she went to OLTL as Aubrey where the writing wrote to her strengths.

It also went to Terri's head. She became more annoying as Katie as the days went on. Everyone hated Katie by the end and that's why she got the nickname Fluffy.

23 minutes ago, Khan said:

Well, I'm glad someone (namely, CZ) enjoyed Barbara and Henry's relationship.  Too bad there were others who didn't.

 

Henry paired with ANY woman never made sense.  I'm sorry, but there you have it.

I never understood why they never paired Henry with a guy. I remember the budding friendship/flirtation with Mike but that was it. I actually thought Mike/Henry had potential if Mike had been revealed to be bi.

28 minutes ago, Soaplovers said:

Henry/Barbara as a fun fling made sense... but having them as endgame.. wasn't cool.  And the show ruined Vienna to prop Henry/Barbara up.  It never made sense Vienna would try to win Henry when she was beautiful and full of life.. that she could have had any guy she wanted.  That's why I wasn't a big Henry/Barbara fan because of what was done to Vienna to make it happen.

This right here. I did not like Vienna most of the time she was on the show, and I often wondered how/why she was around for so long, but she deserved better than the miserable shrew into which they'd turned her for the sake of the Barbara/Henry love train. There was this underlying feeling of Vienna just had to fail because Barbara "deserved" this that I strongly disliked. I thought the dancing was silly and, of course, Henry unbelievable as a romantic lead.

CZ liking it doesn't surprise me. I find that there are a good bit of soap stars who enjoy stories/pairings solely because they enjoyed playing them, not because the story was good or made sense, and that's fine.

15 minutes ago, Soapsuds said:

I never understood why they never paired Henry with a guy. I remember the budding friendship/flirtation with Mike but that was it. I actually thought Mike/Henry had potential if Mike had been revealed to be bi.

 

I never understood why ATWT didn't want to "take a Hike" (for "Henry + Mike") either.  Especially when, IMO, they were more root-able than Luke and, well, anyone.

13 minutes ago, Khan said:

 

I never understood why ATWT didn't want to "take a Hike" (for "Henry + Mike") either.  Especially when, IMO, they were more root-able than Luke and, well, anyone.

 

Look at Henry peeking at hot Mike as he takes his pants off and then their chat afterwards ....

Edited June 22, 20187 yr by Soapsuds

15 minutes ago, Khan said:

 

I never understood why ATWT didn't want to "take a Hike" (for "Henry + Mike") either.  Especially when, IMO, they were more root-able than Luke and, well, anyone.

 

Mike was one of their most popular leading men with Mark Collier, I think, so I never thought that would happen.

 

Henry was a strange one for me because I did read him as gay, but unlike many I never had a problem believing his relationships with women either. I think because Trent Dawson had his own unique energy, for better or worse.

 

I didn't like what they did with Vienna, but compared to many in the Goutman era she got off easy. 

I was more annoyed they made Henry James' illegitimate son, tbh. 

No offense, but from what I've gleaned of most soap actors, they don't really care about service the overall narrative of the show.  They want big drama or big fun, lots of lines and screentime for their characters.  It may be good for them but it's often fatal for the shows that they're on.  ATWT in it's last years is one such cautionary tale.

 

Babs and Henry were pushed as this exciting couple and no doubt there were aspects that CZ loved, like the younger man dumping the beautiful young woman (Vienna) for the older women and the ode to Dancing With the Stars but had Benjamin Henrickson still been alive, there is no writer worth her salt who would prefer Henry and Barbara to Barbara and Hal. 

The show didn't have a lot of options for pairings at that point and the show didn't have a lot of options for much surprises either-- Henry and Barbara offered a compromise solution to both those issues.  CZ is talented enough to sell it and TD can be serviceable, at times, so the show took one of the few options they had left to offer the 'happy ending' option.  Let's face it though, compared to what the show had been able to accomplish in the past, this compromise pairing was a comedown.

 

Vienna could be annoying, at times but she had usually had some vitality to her character.  That was all stripped away in order to make Barbara and Henry serviceable.

As a writer, this option definitely would not have been my choice.

 

3 minutes ago, P.J. said:

I was more annoyed they made Henry James' illegitimate son, tbh. 

 

That was also so stupid!

Edited June 22, 20187 yr by DramatistDreamer

 

7 minutes ago, DramatistDreamer said:

CZ is talented enough to sell it and TD can be serviceable, at times, so the show took one of the few options they had left to offer the 'happy ending' option.  Let's face it though, compared to what the show had been able to accomplish in the past, this compromise pairing was a comedown.

 

The sad thing is by Barbara standards I don't even feel like it was a huge comedown - she had more than her share of questionable or bland pairings and periods (Brian, John, Gavin) before even getting into what Sheffer did to her.

11 minutes ago, P.J. said:

I was more annoyed they made Henry James' illegitimate son, tbh. 

 

Now that was stupid. Absolute garbage. 

8 minutes ago, DRW50 said:

The sad thing is by Barbara standards I don't even feel like it was a huge comedown - she had more than her share of questionable or bland pairings and periods (Brian, John, Gavin) before even getting into what Sheffer did to her.

 

Now that was stupid. Absolute garbage. 

 

Yeah, I was comparing the past overall, not just Barbara's pairings.  I think CZ is a real trooper and I'm not saying her opinion is invalid but but I'm not sure why people are giving an actor's opinions ultimate sway on what makes a story great.  They don't write the story. 

Havin Gunnar return to announce that he slayed James once and for all would alone, have made a return worth it.  Also, if it could happen right before Barbara was set to walk down the aisle with Henry, you generate some intrigue.  Henry and Barbara's disco twirl just didn't do it for me, in terms of interest. 

Edited June 22, 20187 yr by DramatistDreamer