Guiding Light discussion thread

[robbwolff]

Cool information! Culliton and Long's material started airing in May 1983. After Browne and Palumbo departed, it appears that Carolyn DeMoney Culliton, Richard Culliton, and Gary Tomlin served as interim head writers until Long arrived. And the switch from Ryder to Barrett happened as early as July 1986. I've seen episodes online from July 1986 where Barrett is credited.

[All My Shadows]

An episode from 1961! This one has probably been around before, probably back in the WoST days, but I've never seen it before. Relatively early Ed Bryce as Bill, one of the first adult Mikes, Robin, etc. And of course, Bert and Papa.

If what I'm reading is correct, this is Michael Allen as Mike, who played the part from 1957 and departs in this episode. That means that Mike was SORASed into adulthood five years after his onscreen birth. Damn it.

Edited June 16, 2020 by All My Shadows

[Darn]

Robin is ice cold. I love her. What was the backstory there? What became of her?

[Forever8]

https://www.soapcentral.com/gl/whoswho/robin.php

[DRW50]

 

Robin grew up mostly away from her mother, Kathy, who had wanted to keep her away so she wouldn't know about her messy parentage (Kathy had been in love with Dick Grant but Robin was conceived in Kathy's loveless marriage to Bob Lang - some of these episodes are available on Youtube). Meta, who had had a ton of problems with young stepdaughter Kathy back in the day, was a big influence on Robin, not realizing how desperately insecure and conniving Robin was becoming. Kathy and Robin had a lot of conflicts, not helped by Robin hating Kathy's husband Mark (she instead saw Paul Fletcher as a father figure) and his kid sister Alice (she first became close to Mike to make Alice jealous) but had made up by the time a paralyzed Kathy was accidentally pushed into oncoming traffic. 

 

Robin wanted Meta and Mark to marry, but Mark fell in love with his housekeeper, Ruth. Robin and Meta tried and tried, with Robin even catching pneumonia to try to make it happen. Finally Bert, Paul and Mark told Meta to get over herself and act like a grown woman, which she did, leading her to marry Bruce to get away from her feelings for Mark. Mark and Ruth eloped, and when Robin learned of this, so she got upset she faked her own kidnapping. She then became close to Ruth's newly arrived son, Karl, wanting to eventually dump him in order to hurt Ruth. Karl and Mike were friends realized what she was doing, and told Bert and Bill, but he was beginning to fall for Robin. Karl was a control freak and Robin felt she had little choice but to marry him, but she began to get sick from nerves and regret. Finally she dumped him and eloped with Mike. Karl attacked Mike, hit his head, and died. Mike was charged with manslaughter, but cleared. He was also guilt-ridden for his friend's demise, frustrating Robin, who became charmed by yet another father figure in artist Alex Bowden. 

 

Alex and Robin became closer and closer, and Bert, desperate to get Robin away from her son, encouraged the attraction. She later began to feel guilty, but it was too late, and Robin annulled her marriage to Mike in order to marry Alex. Unfortunately, Alex was resentful of Robin's connections to Springfield and how little he mattered in her life compared to them, and the age difference settled in. Her brattiness was no longer charming now that she was his wife. Mike returned to Springfield, and Robin began to play games with him due to her loveless marriage to Alex. He began to be drawn to his alcoholic ex-wife, Doris. Doris convinced him to give some money to Paul Fletcher's clinic - Paul's wife Anne was angry over this, and manipulated Robin into thinking Doris and Alex had something going on. Anne and Robin berated Doris so badly that she fell off the wagon. She stole Anne's gun and went to Paul's clinic, threatening suicide. In a struggle with Paul, the gun went off, shooting and soon killing Anne. 

 

Divorced from Alex, Robin's daddy issues led her to become engaged to longtime father figure Paul, but her own teenage tantrums came full circle with Paul's son Johnny. Paul's sister Jane and Anne's father began manipulating Johnny into opposing the relationship (Anne's mother supported the relationship). This scheming ended their engagement, but Jane became too clever and accidentally pushed Paul and Robin into a secret marriage. They managed to hide their relationship for a while, but when his desk clerk told Jane that Paul was with Mrs. Fletcher, Jane spitefully told Johnny that Daddy had lied to them. Johnny ran away to the zoo, cutting off Paul, Robin, and Jane. He went to stay with his grandparents until his grandmother died, forcing him to return home. The tension came to a full boil when a pregnant Robin lost her baby while cleaning Johnny's room. She refused to forgive Johnny, lashing out at him and finally angering Paul, who took his son's side. 

 

Robin by this time was played by Gillian Spencer - she's the Robin who has the most episodes up on Youtube as a ton of her tensions with Johnny and Johnny's early relationship with Peggy is available in summer 1966 uploads. 

 

Paul's old friend Sara McIntire arrived around this point. Robin was convinced they were or would become lovers. Combined with her grief over her miscarriage, and her general insecurities, she chose to throw herself in front of a truck, completing the same cycle that had taken her mother. 

 

(I have to assume Irna was involved in this ending as it's so fucked up and so focused on struggling to break lifelong psychological patterns - it is right up her alley)

[Darn]

Thanks for the link @Forever8

 

Thanks @DRW50 for that detailed summary! Reading all of that and to have it conclude with "...and then she throws herself in front of a truck" was quite the ride.

[DRW50]

 

No problem. I decided to summarize Soapcentral as the site is hard to navigate and in case it ever goes under...

 

Yeah her ending seems incomplete to me - I guess that's how life sometimes is, but it still bugs me. I wonder how viewers at the time felt, as I imagine Robin was a popular character (I'm not sure Gillian Spencer ever played an unpopular character on a soap).

[Bill Bauer]

 

Yes, viewers were upset because Robin was popular. Yes, it was Irna's writing. Irna made the rather impetuous decision to kill off the main female lead of the show (Kathy Holden) in 1958. It's been said Irna was angry at the actress for becoming pregnant. There was a huge angry protest by fans and Irna soon left the show. She came back to the show briefly in 1967 after Agnes Nixon left and made a similar arbitrary decision to kill off the main female lead of the show. It also happened to be the daughter of the previous female lead she had killed off a decade before and she killed her off in a similar manner (Kathy being knocked into oncoming traffic in her wheelchair by boys on bicycles and Robin throwing herself into traffic). There wasn't quite the outrage when Robin died as when Kathy died probably because Robin, though very popular, wasn't quite as popular as Kathy was. Also, by the time of her death, Robin wasn't the main focus of the show like Kathy was at the time of her death. Still, there were a lot of angry fans and Irna, once again, left soon after. It was a brief run the second time around for Irna. In fact, it was almost like she just came back, killed off Robin, pissed people off and left again. Her second tenure is mainly known for the unpopular decision to kill off Robin. She may have been "encouraged" to leave after that but I could be wrong about that. It's been a while since I read about it. I think the producers weren't happy with her decision and how it angered fans and that time around Irna didn't have the power with the show she once did. I think the producers were looking for new blood, new writers, new vision and the Robin decision gave them the impetus to make that happen. 

 

Also, Karl actually died because he hit his head on Meta's iron patio table when Mike hit him. That's how Mike was acquitted. Karl didn't die from the punch but from him hitting his head on the table. There's a scene from a 1960 episode where Papa Bauer is running his fingers along the rim of the table. That's why. That's also why Robin is surprised Mike wanted to talk to her out on the patio in that 1961 episode. 

Edited June 16, 2020 by BillBauer

[DRW50]

 

Thanks for the extra detail, and for the episode. I'd never seen that one before. It was interesting to hear mention of some of the characters who sort of drifted into the early '60s but were probably on their way out, like Marie Grant. 

 

Did you ever see any of the other Robins? I wonder if Ellen Weston was any better as an actress than she was as a writer. 

[antmunoz]

Wow. Abigail Kellogg is fabulous here. And how much fun it is to see a daughter-in-law be less than reverent with Bert. Would we see that again until Rita?  I don’t recall Bert’s relationship with early Holly, but she loved Holly post-prison. 

 

I wonder why there was so much turnover in the 60’s in these young female roles on all the soaps. You’d think Kellogg would’ve stuck around; she’s killing it here. But she leaves to go to SFT at Patti, another role, like Robin, with lots of recasts.  Why?  Pay raise?  “Better” show?  Wanted to play a more sympathetic character?  
 

Did every young actress give it a year or so  and then attempt Hollywood, or just jump ship to another NYC-based show?  (Still want to someone to ask Jada Rowland why she was briefly Susan on ATWT—needed a job and SECRET STORM wouldn’t bring Amy back at the time?) 

[Bill Bauer]

 

 

I've only seen Abigail Kellogg and Gillian Spencer in the role. I preferred Abigail's version. She was acerbic and fun to watch. Gillian Spencer's version was more neurotic and manipulative. She was good too but I just preferred Abigail's version and I wish there were more surviving episodes with her in them. 

 

Robin wasn't being reverent with Bert because Bert didn't like Robin and tried to keep Mike and Robin apart. She was the one pushing to have the marriage annulled and one of the reasons Mike is leaving town in that episode is to get away from Bert. Bert was very judgmental and controlling back then. 

Edited June 16, 2020 by BillBauer

[victoria foxton]

 

@DRW50 Great Post Carl. You sure know your GL history. The characters and stories all read as very fascinating. I wonder what GL would've been like had they kept Robin.? Would she had mellowed like Bert did? Would the character of Robin lasted decades? Would Robin had locked horns with Alex? It seems shortsighted of Irna. To just kill her off. But Irna was known for that. 

Edited June 16, 2020 by victoria foxton

[DRW50]

 

I just summarized Soapcentral but I appreciate your kindness.

 

I imagine Gillian would have left, as she never stayed in a soap role too long, but I do wonder what might have been. I think the show ran into problems by the early '70s at not having more complex women in that age range - you just had Sara and then a lot of younger, dewier heroines. 

[Bill Bauer]

It's funny how Bert was so disapproving of her sister-in-law Meta and then disapproving of Meta's step-daughter Kathy and then disapproving of Kathy's daughter Robin. If Robin had had children, I wonder if Bert would have carried on the tradition. Heck, Bert was even disapproving of Meta's little son Chuckie who was a very sweet kid. When Bill was telling Bert how much Meta loved Chuckie, Bert replied, "Oh who could love that little boy?". She was really something else in her younger days. 

 

I think Leslie and Peggy filled Robin's role after she was gone. 

[Justduckey]

I’m watching 1992 on YouTube and can anyone tell me who this is in the film strip Mallet is looking at at the very beginning of the episode after he and Harley break up bc he finds out he’s sterile.
 

I assume it’s supposed to be Harley but it sure as heck doesn’t look like her.

 

https://youtu.be/QbsAz-6SJgA