Members TC Posted May 27, 2009 Members Share Posted May 27, 2009 It depends on your perspective. If your perspective includes accomodation of homophobes then you won't see it the same way I do. If your perspecrtive includes seeing someone like me, who is married to his same sex partner, as an oddity - now be honest with yourself, then all of this is just about a silly homophpbe that some people feel a need to protect. He's a PHOBE. Protecting him, giving him the benefit of the doubt, makes you HOMOPHOBIC. No doubt in my mind that he is a homophobic. He made sure he didn't say anything outwardly bigoted but he managed to avoid saying anything positive about same-sex relationships. If the kiss was not a problem he would have said so. This man is a homophobe. Anyone who defends him is a homophobe. That's how I see it and anyone who disagrees with me will just have to deal with it. We all know what he meant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MarkH Posted May 27, 2009 Members Share Posted May 27, 2009 Can I seriously trouble you for what Coretta Scott King quote you are referencing? Did I find it? I'm eager to know what she said. Ever since marceline wrote about Afro vs. Homo in this thread, I have been kind of thinking a bit about the juxtaposition of civil rights issues. This is a bit OT, since I don't really think we can build anything of substance based on what we conclusively know about Engen at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members TC Posted May 27, 2009 Members Share Posted May 27, 2009 Mark, I will have to look for it, but the jist of it was that gays and african americans had the same struggle. I'll try to find it. Just in case anyone asks, I have dual citizenship. I was born in the US but live in Canada. My husband/partner is Canadian from Nova Scotia but is black. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Doyen Posted May 27, 2009 Members Share Posted May 27, 2009 Wow. Just...wow. Hey, if you say so. To hear some people tell it, Engen is out kicking the dogs of gay couples, just because he [allegedly] wasn't comfortable acting out scenes of a gay nature and opted to move on from the role. I think getting all flustered and frustrated because some people don't see it in black/white extremes the way you do, and resorting to petty name calling, makes you AFFECTED, at least somewhat childish and quite possibly an unlikable person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members TC Posted May 27, 2009 Members Share Posted May 27, 2009 Okay, Coretta Scott King's comments.... http://www.akawilliam.com/coretta-scott-king-on-gay-rights/ For too long, our nation has tolerated the insidious form of discrimination against this group of Americans, who have worked as hard as any other group, paid their taxes like everyone else, and yet have been denied equal protection under the law…I believe that freedom and justice cannot be parceled out in pieces to suit political convenience. My husband, Martin Luther King, Jr. said, “Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere.” On another occasion he said, “I have worked too long and hard against segregated public accommodations to end up segregating my moral concern. Justice is indivisible.” Like Martin, I don’t believe you can stand for freedom for one group of people and deny it to others. I still hear people say that I should not be talking about the rights of lesbian and gay people and I should stick to the issue of racial justice… But I hasten to remind them that Martin Luther King, Jr., said, ‘Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere’ … I appeal to everyone who believes in Martin Luther King, Jr.’s dream to make room at the table of brotherhood and sisterhood for lesbian and gay people. We are all tied together in a single garment of destiny…I can never be what I ought to be until you are allowed to be what you ought to be,” she said, quoting her husband. “I’ve always felt that homophobic attitudes and policies were unjust and unworthy of a free society and must be opposed by all Americans who believe in democracy. Quotations via Soul Force, 365Gay.com. That's just a start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members TC Posted May 27, 2009 Members Share Posted May 27, 2009 No, Engen is not kicking dogs. That's your fabrication. He is a homophobe. That's how I see it. As Vee implied, he doesn't have to be a murderer of gays, or a gay basher, or even an influential evangelical hyprocrite to be a homophobe. He doesn't even have to kick dogs. He just has to be what he has proven himself to be. A homophobe. I'm sure his acting career is not over. He has quite a future with the likes of Kirk Cameron and those direct-to-DVD left behind style movies. No doubt it is quite lucrative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MarkH Posted May 27, 2009 Members Share Posted May 27, 2009 Thank you. That is excerpted above in the wikipedia stuff I posted. Apparently, it comes from a speech in November 2003 at the opening session of the 13th annual Creating Change Conference, organized by the National Gay and Lesbian Task Force. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members TC Posted May 27, 2009 Members Share Posted May 27, 2009 Unfortunately some of his children feel differently. Sue me. I'll Take Coretta's word over theirs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MarkH Posted May 28, 2009 Members Share Posted May 28, 2009 Me too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SteveFrame Posted May 28, 2009 Members Share Posted May 28, 2009 Wow doesn't that make you such an enlightened homosexual. And such a wonderful human being too. To pass judgement on people you don't even know. Wow what a great representative of the homosexual race. I am beginning to find it hard to recognize who is gay and who is a member of the right wing fanatics. They're all beginning to act so much alike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SteveFrame Posted May 28, 2009 Members Share Posted May 28, 2009 Me three. It's a beautiful statement. It has been awhile since I read it. I agree with everything she said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members bellcurve Posted May 28, 2009 Members Share Posted May 28, 2009 And this is exactly what's WRONG with some people in the gay community. Engen's unwillingness to kiss a dude and even break contract for it is being labeled a civil right's issue?! Hold the presses, someone get GLAAD on the phone so they can protest outside of Engen and his son's home and make out and protest because he won't kiss another guy. And bring CBS2 and Eyewitness out there while you're at it! We, as a people, need to pick and choose our battles carefully. There are much greater things to focus on in the gay community besides worrying about some actor not kissing another male actor. When we focus on petty issues like this(juiced by queens like Perez who think they're the next Milk), it makes the community as a whole look incredibly shallow and arrogant. Why are we spending so much time destroying someone else's career whenever there's probably another one of our own out there who probably lost his job today because he's gay? Why are we so quick to judge whenever we have so many people within our own community(and probably some of you hypocrites here who are so ready to string Engen up by his hairy balls) guilty of homophobia, racism, and other prejudices? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SteveFrame Posted May 28, 2009 Members Share Posted May 28, 2009 Best post in the whole 41 pages. And so adult too. Thanks Bellcurve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Rakesh Posted May 28, 2009 Members Share Posted May 28, 2009 EXCELLENT post, Bell! Well said!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members All My Shadows Posted May 28, 2009 Members Share Posted May 28, 2009 Uhh.....now aren't you proud of yourself? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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