Members classicmoment Posted May 29, 2009 Members Share Posted May 29, 2009 It sounds to me as if he just drew a line. It sounds like this was an inevitable moment the actor would have eventually approached. I would guess (perhaps correctly, perhaps incorrectly) the actor is rethinking his career choice. Are we sure yet the actor doesn't have any other opportunities or economic resource? I know the economy is bad but we are taking giant leaps in terms of what we are concluding based on the evidence or the full picture (or lack thereof). He mentions his son, I mean I would suppose he thinks about when his son asks him about things he was doing in the name of the character maybe he found he wasn't prepared to give him a justifiable answer based on principles he's taught him or examples he tries to set for him. I can't title the man a homophobe and I get that we will just disagree on this, but I just think that's not a description we throw on someone unless we have conclusive evidence to the fact of them being anti-gay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Difficult Diva Posted May 29, 2009 Members Share Posted May 29, 2009 Bravo, Vee. From a fellow "uppity minority", who expected an actor to ACT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SteveFrame Posted May 29, 2009 Members Share Posted May 29, 2009 And MAB didn't say he did either. Even her statements on this to Nelson were ambiguous. That's the problem with every source we don't know exactly what happened. It all boils down to we don't know. ANd see there it goes again you have to draw conclusions. It was just stated. You either have to read between the lines to make your judgement or you have to draw conclusions. Those are the same things that the right wing fanatics have used for years to condemn everything from dirty magazines to music to you name it. They say they don't have to know for sure. SO go right ahead whoever wants too and draw your conclusions. Read between the lines. Whatever you need to do. As long as you feel comfortable with it and can lay your head on your pillow at night that is fine. But I won't. I refuse too. If I choose to pass judgement on a person (which I usually choose not too) I will at least do it when I don't have to draw conclusions or read between the lines. Becuase you know what many times when you draw conclusions those conclusions are WRONG. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members cara mia Posted May 29, 2009 Members Share Posted May 29, 2009 The problem with judging CE is that the kiss is on top of torturing Ashley and causing her to lose her baby. Engen may have been more than willing to play Noah Mayer. We don't know. I have NO IDEA what's in CE's heart but we have talked about his Catholic background, and even if he's a super evolved liberal hippie lapsed Catholic, you don't just wipe out of your mind the Church's obsession with unborn life. Adam is talking joy out of killing Ashley's "baby". If CE is already unhappy with Adam's turn and feeling that the character crossed a line into being downright disgusting, he wasn't going to be inclined or receptive to the Rafe story and may have felt it was just for shock value. If Adam were a good guy and slowly realizing that he was gay and then fell for Rafe in a romantic way and CE objected to that, we could safely cast judgment. But people are trying to divorce the kiss from the entire storyline and make it a standalone reason for CE quitting. I don't think it's that black & white. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MarkH Posted May 29, 2009 Members Share Posted May 29, 2009 Excellent point. If the kiss was the straw that broke the camel's back...is that meaningful, or could it also have been a slap, a grimace that -- in all this darkness -- drove Engen to quit. We'll never know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members All My Shadows Posted May 29, 2009 Members Share Posted May 29, 2009 This times a million. I agree with every single word. My main issue is not people putting CE on blast but people immediately jumping on the "CE left because of the gay kiss!" bus without giving a moment's thought to the fact that maybe, just maybe, it's not about the kiss. In his statement, he talked a lot about the gay aspect, but can you blame him for doing that after half of the internet is branding him a homophobe? Just about every legit source (sources that didn't get their info straight from Nelson) make note that there had already been rumors going around on set that he was getting ready to leave, rumors that had been around since last fall. Again, when all is said and done, and it's all but confirmed that he left because he was icked out by kissing a guy, then I'll be first in line to call him every name in the book. I just do not see why so many people are ignoring other parts of the story just to jump in and call him a homophobe. I don't see why people are doing that, and I won't do it, but I am powerless to stop anyone from doing it, so I'm not telling anyone that they should be ashamed of themselves or that they should just shut up or whatever. People like Perez, yeah, because he's a grade-A !@#$%^&*] who doesn't give a rat's ass about Y&R either way. But no one here is even close to his level of....:rolleyes:ness Also, I wish people would pick their problem and stick to it. It bounces from "he left Y&R because he didn't want to kiss a guy!" to "he didn't want to kiss a guy because he's a homophobe!" to "well he's an actor, he should act!" to "he walked on his contract, that's bad!" I don't believe that we have all of the facts for the first one, and if that is indeed why he left, then I still don't think that we have all of the facts for the second one either. I totally agree with the third one, but notice, he didn't want to act, so he left. As far as we know, he didn't give them a "it's me or the kiss!" ultimatum or beg to stay. And I totally agree with the fourth one. But again, this is all JMHO. I'm only here to speak my mind, not change everybody else's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members JackPeyton Posted May 29, 2009 Members Share Posted May 29, 2009 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MarkH Posted May 29, 2009 Members Share Posted May 29, 2009 Avatar and this Muhney clip suggests JP has discovered animated gifs! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Difficult Diva Posted May 29, 2009 Members Share Posted May 29, 2009 YUMMY. Thank you, JackPeyton for posting that lovely image. I also LOVE your icon (Blossom!!!). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members JackPeyton Posted May 29, 2009 Members Share Posted May 29, 2009 LOL, i have always knowen of them. I just dont usually use them. I found them on Oh No They Didnt. LOL! WHOAHHHH! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members classicmoment Posted May 29, 2009 Members Share Posted May 29, 2009 Excellent post! ICAM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MarkH Posted May 29, 2009 Members Share Posted May 29, 2009 Yes. Cara Mia said she studies comparative lit, and I really appreciate her viewpoints. The thing is, of course, these days Engen is being given wonderful (if creepy) stuff to play. The juxtaposition of that face...which to me carries some kind of "sweetness" to it...with the horrid things he is doing just works for me. Muhney, it is already clear, doesn't have that same sweet look. He is darker, more physically imposing. So, I think it will be a matter of Adam beginning to look more consistent with his actions. If they want us to keep connecting to Adam's "Hope side", Muhney is going to have to play it somehow, because he won't be able to rely on his looks to invoke it. Am I even making sense? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members brimike Posted May 29, 2009 Members Share Posted May 29, 2009 You're actually making perfect sense, and put into words what is my only concern about the recast. Part of the reason you root for Adam, as dark and twisted as he is, is that I always somehow manage to see a glimmer of Signy Coleman in him. Muhney may be able to play it, but it might take a little more work to get it out of him. But otherwise, I'm fine with the recast, as long as we can still get the juxtaposition they're talking about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MarkH Posted May 29, 2009 Members Share Posted May 29, 2009 Well...when it comes to ACTING...I don't think Engen played the juxtaposition very well at all. Scenes were written for him (like flashbacks to his mom), but mostly he was able to "skate by" on those DAMN pretty looks! But while Engen is boyish -- maybe, frat-boyish -- Muhney strikes me as all-man. So, he's got to be a better ACTOR to play the contradictions. But if he can...if he can do the kind of work with his eyes and body that (setting the bar high) Bergman or Stafford do...I think he might actually make us grateful for this switch. It's funny. I'm actually excited about the recast, because I'm eager to see what he can do. That said, he's switching in at an awful time (well...let's say...hitting the ground running), so I have to remember to give him TIME to grow into this. Let's hope the writers and production staff feed him with the backstory and subtext needed to find the character. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Evan Posted May 29, 2009 Members Share Posted May 29, 2009 Muhney has been talking on his Twitter site about the wonderful scripts he's getting from the writers. He seems genuinely excited about the new job, which bodes well for Y&R fans, I'd suggest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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