The Politics Thread

[Roman]

a roasting like he was on the grill this weekend. Ouch. LOL

[Vee]

More and more credible journalists are getting fed up with the media obsession with the emails and the Clinton Foundation vs. the double standard on Trump's scandals (some are suggesting the media is taking for granted that he's crooked and they've got scandal fatigue), and it's taking off this morning - Paul Krugman shames the NYT in its own pages and it's gone viral.

 

I do think Hillary will win and win big, and I think most of the media knows that. But they also deeply dislike and resent her, and they need ratings. I think right now the shift by a lot of the media is a desperate press to push the false equivalence as much as possible between the two to even the odds and lean on her hard in order to try to save their precious horse race until the end. But it is still vapid, amoral and contemptible.

 

Further, what concerns me about the debates (should they occur!) is that we've now had Martha Raddatz (hawkish moderator of debate #2) haranguing Tim Kaine about "The Emails" on Sunday morning, and Chris Wallace, known FOX News shill and moderator of debate #3, blithely saying he will not be fact-checking Trump during the debate. Granted, I have my doubts three debates will take place let alone one.

Edited September 5, 2016 by Vee

[Ms. Quartermaine]

The nerve of Raddatz to ask if America deserves a better explanation!!! First of all, Hillary has explained over and over and over again, and it's only hurts her. She also expressed regret over and over and over. So, she recently, flat out states that anytime she tries to explain, it sounds like she's making excuses, and there are no excuses, and she still can't win with the press. 

 

Doesn't America deserve a better explanation about... Trump's Russian connections? Trump's foundation pay-to-play's? Trump's insistence that Obama founded ISIS? The Birther Movement? Trump's supposed sacrifices? Trump's lack of tax returns?! And so on and so on. I hope who ever is coaching her is giving her good ideas on how to respond to email and foundation questions because it looks like the debate moderators will want to focus on that instead of actual policies. 

 

Hillary had another coughing fit at start of speech in Cleveland. Let the health conspiracy theories continue, even though a cough has nothing to do with the stroke/seizures/brain damage/Parkinson's/etc. narrative they have been running with. 

Edited September 5, 2016 by Ms. Quartermaine

[Vee]

I actually think it's good that what Josh Marshall and others have described as the latest spasm from the press in one direction vs. another (Trump or Hillary) is playing out now vs. later. According to conventional media wisdom Trump was supposed to 'pivot' in August and make things a real horse race - he never did, so they've been struggling to even up the tally between the two ever since even though Clinton commands a lead and Trump is a walking disaster. That's why the push went from Trump's ongoing messes throughout July and August to trying to handicap Hillary now. The usual election year narrative spun out of control and they're trying to right it.

 

Come late September they will be eager to prove themselves still impartial, and will be after Trump again. They know no one will respect any of them if the rest of the media watches them get rolled by Trump on live TV. It's about their pride, as well as checking him and restoring 'balance'. It's amoral, but that's much of our media.

[quartermainefan]

I don't think there is anything good to say about Phyllis Schlafly.   She paved the way for the rise of modern conservatism in politics, if that is an accomplishment.   A pioneer of sorts. 

Edited September 6, 2016 by quartermainefan
spelling

[DRW50]

She certainly did change politics and the role of women in conservative politics. The bitter irony in her life must have been having a (supposedly) gay son...that and most of what she fought against the ERA for happening anyway. 

 

I guess you could say she kept her principles, unlike many in that movement, but I feel for those who paid the price for those principles. 

[DramatistDreamer]

I agree. Helping to tank the ERA. I'm trying to be respectful of a human being that has passed, so I won't go any further on that.

 

People are braying about the crassness of Rodrigo Duterte but are willing to consider Trump as a genuinely, serious candidate?

[Juliajms]

If she had every one of those problems I would still feel morally compelled to choose her over Trump.

[JaneAusten]

So Vee brought up the NYT Op Ed piece by Klugman, Clinton's campaign is finally touching on the "false equivalency" issue, and while I hate to see HRC going into the gutter like Trump, I'm glad to hear that each time she talks to the press she injects something related to Trump's unfitness and hypocrisy.

 

Josh Marshall's latest piece on the Biondi "pay for play" bride Trump gave her to drop the Trump University case

 

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/trump-lying-about-bondi-already

 

This is now still being soft peddled in WaPo and I am assuming the NYT will finally pen something on this, but people are not letting it go and my guess is this is one item Clinton's campaign is not going to let go.

 

It sickens me by the way how the media(the print media included) are so overblowing the Clinton Foundation alleged issues. This is an organization that got a A from Charity Watch(higher than the Red Cross by the way) and has done positive things for people all over the world and the media has no ethics. But not one bit of coverage about Trump University scamming thousands out of money. I am shocked the cases in Texas and Florida where Trump made donations to both and the cases dropped has gotten zero attention. I wish outlets like TPM, Mother Jones, Rolling Stone would get in touch with some of the former students in Florida and Texas and find out how these poor consumers have been hung out to dry by their so called "representatives". With all Trumps shady dealings an stiffing people, this is the one I find most disgusting and how the media can turn a blind eye is equally appalling. They try to hold Clinton responsible for a foundation that does positive work yet Trump gets away with a multitude of crimes.

 

CNN had a round table on the false equivalency discussion and I found myself actually agreeing with Soledad O'Brien. Why was Clinton's speech a few weeks back, where she just stated facts so unfair yet Trump gets away with time after time calling her a bigot with zero facts.

Edited September 6, 2016 by JaneAusten

[Vee]

CNN is also running a poll claiming Trump is up on Clinton by 2, I believe. The reality is, they oversampled Republicans to get that number. I think there's a big 50-state poll in the WP that is much more in line with Hillary's lead.

 

I do think MSNBC and CNN are running with the Bondi case more these last 24 hours - in part because there was a big backlash over the weekend against both cable and print media for letting Trump slide by puffing up the Hillary 'scandals' from hot air. The Krugman article was a big deal.

Edited September 6, 2016 by Vee

[Ms. Quartermaine]

I read a comment that said she could be on a breathing machine and they'd still vote for her.

 

I think anything post convention is the media's fault. Pre, I would blame both the media and Hillary answers to questions, but once her numbers got really high, media did and continues to do everything to knock her down. And it's working. I'm nervous. 

 

Nate Silver has her at 68.5... That's about 4% down from earlier this morning. 

Edited September 6, 2016 by Ms. Quartermaine

[JaneAusten]

I want an honest opinion from some here. What do you think Hillary Clinton can be doing to shore up her campaign and the Trumpster than she is doing now. There seems to be a feeling among a lot of people that she isn't doing enough. I actually have confidence in her campaign, but maybe I'm naïve and there is trouble on the horizon. The only thing I am really worried about are the debates because I think all that Trump has to do is show up and not say anything stupid and be declared the winner.

[quartermainefan]

I think she needs to tackle the honesty issue head on.  Give a plausible explanation for secret emails, secret servers, all that stuff that feeds into this 20 year narrative--and not use an extra 20 words per sentence trying to muddy the issue.    As far as the debate goes, I said before and I will say again:  Trump should not be underestimated at a televised debate.   He is a professional TV performer with con man and carnival barker powers.  He has more verbal skill than she does and knows how to speak for dramatic effect.  She just spits out facts and figures, but that isn't the totality of what makes a winning debate--ask Al Gore.

 

 

As to the overall general campaign, well, at his best (now and 2 months ago) the best he has been able to do is tie.  At her best she was up 10 pts.  So considering that throughout the entire year he hasn't been able to pull ahead for more than a day, I think she is the favorite and is likely to win.  Historically it is difficult for one party to win three terms in a row however, but there is nothing she can do about that.

[marceline]

I don't believe there is anything she can do. The hate for Hillary is the result of 30 years of non-stop partisan attacks and no matter what she does the media will do what it wants to.

One needs only look at the coverage of the The Clinton Foundation to see that. This is an organization that provides AIDS drugs, vaccines and clean water to millions of people around the world and they'd happily gut it because of "optics."

[Vee]

Hillary's already let the press on the plane, started taking questions and will apparently be giving another interview to ABC this week (I think; she actually gives a fair few interviews). Beyond that I agree with marceline there's nothing else she can do.  She's leading in the polls and she's campaigning hard, her campaign is not the problem and her numbers are up. She's talked honestly about what happened more than once in the last month, and to the press. It's now up to the media to stop putting the thumb on the scale as they desperately try to push a horse race narrative which is nastily exacerbated this year by their long-standing enmity towards Hillary Clinton, and to give up on the endless emails/foundation mess - they've gotten what they wanted out of it, which is a slightly closer race.

 

Meanwhile: The backstory on Greta Van Susteren's abrupt exit/firing from Fox News. The whole place is imploding.

Edited September 6, 2016 by Vee