Loving/The City Discussion Thread

[Kane]

Thanks!

I gather that that must be one of Laura Wright's first episodes. Interesting to see Shana in conflict with Stacey and Trisha since so much of what she gets up to in 1991 ends up getting swept under the rug later, with them all acting as though nothing has happened even though some of Shana's actions (helping Clay get custody of Tommy, paying Dinah Lee to try to break up Jack and Stacey) should have been friendship enders.

[slick jones]

Thanks, @DRW50     I enjoyed watching this.  Great to see Shana with claws.

[DRW50]

I hadn't thought about it before, but you're right. 

I wish Susan Keith had been interviewed about these years as Shana, and how she felt about the changes. I felt like some of her work in the last few years of Shana's run was scattered and at times had little impact. She felt much more focused here.

[dc11786]

Ally's first episode was June 25, 1991. It's a shame the beginning with Ally and Matt isn't present as I'd imagine that was there first scene together. Matt had been there for a few weeks. Matt's first episode was June 10, 1991. 

I wonder if this is the last appearance of Det. Art Hindman. I'm not sure who is playing the role in this episode, but if this isn't the last episode, it's gotta be one of the final episodes. 

The Louie material is incredibly strong. The story about Louie finding Paul's gang jacket when he was growing up was actually really impactful. Kate talking about always loving your child while Carly looks off into the distance was also very good. I do think that Millee Taggert's solo material is stronger than when Tom King was also there, but, to be fair, 1991 seems fairly strong despite the massive shift in the canvas. 

I can't for the life of me remember why Stacey would be in a wheelchair at this point in the story. I mean it may have been due to Lauren Marie Taylor being pregnant (she gave birth in early August). 

Shifting Shana back into the role of antagonist is interesting and I don't hate it. I imagine Anthony Herrera is recently out as Dane by this point or has to be close to being gone. This new direction for Shana has potential given her origin. 

The Archie Knapp stuff is very functional. I think the Tommy storyline was effective, but it's a shame that it is wrapped up so quickly in the transition period. As much as I enjoy Mary Ryan Munisteri's run, she definitely has some critical missteps like not letting the residue from that story play out (as the source of Trucker/Trisha tension, more ostracism towards Shana, etc.)

[slick jones]

Herb Downer is the actor playing Art Hindman.

 

HERB DOWNER

THE GUIDING LIGHT Dr. Gregory Adams 1971

THE EDGE OF NIGHT Dr. David Roper 1977-78

THE DOCTORS Dr. Mitchell 1979

Dr. Phillip King 1979

ONE LIFE TO LIVE Gaston Tourneur 1983

THE GUIDING LIGHT ____ Morgan 1984

LOVING Lieutenant Art Hindman 1991

AS THE WORLD TURNS Felix Harrison 1991

[Joseph]

THANKS!!!! 

[victoria foxton]

@DRW50 Thanks Carl

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I don't think it's been up before either.

[Franko]

Thank you for the tag, Carl! It's always great to see new Loving episodes.

[j swift]

@Kane After reading your profile of Linc Beecham I have some questions

1. What ever happened to his brother?

2. Why did Rebekah need Linc to marry into Zona's family if the Beechams were rich enough to take over AE?

3. Did you have a favorite Linc (of the two actors)?

4. Was Zona short for Arizona?  It is such an unusual name, even for a soap.  Or was she created by a writer known for odd character names (Eben, Egypt, and Staige come to mind)?

Edited April 2, 2023 by j swift

[Kane]

1. Judd returns to Corinth either just as, or just after, Linc and Rebekah leave. He gets involved with Ava, who sees him as her next meal ticket, but he's constantly tossing her aside to go after other women. He abruptly moves back to Wyoming at the end of 1986, leaving Ava to start a relationship with the show's second character named Tony.

2. Greed. They were rich, but she wanted them to be richer and Zona had inherited considerable land holdings from her family that Rebekah wanted to control.

3. I've only ever seen episodes with Brian Taylor, who I quite liked. I don't understand why they dropped him when they did. There was definitely more drama to mine from the Linc/Lorna relationship.

4. Yes, I believe so. I'd add Giff, Buck, Cabot, and of course Trucker to the unusual names list. I've also always thought that Cecelia, while not necessarily an unusual name in and of itself, was a strange choice for such a hardscrabble character.

[dc11786]

I think Judd Beecham and crew were dumped because they didn't fit the vision Nixon had for the show once Marland left in May, 1985. Most of the conflict in Linc and Lorna's relationship stemmed from Linc's involvement with Dane and his plot to oust Cabot Alden from the CEO position at Alden Enterprises. From what I've seen, Nixon isn't really interested in telling those kind of boardroom stories.

Nixon shifts the conflict in Linc and Lorna's relationship to Linc's meddling mother Rebekah Beecham who arrives in August, 1985, if I remember correctly. Rebekah immediately introduces "The Secret," which was suppose to keep Linc and Lorna apart. The secret was eventually revealed to be that Linc was married and that he had never disclosed this to Lorna. Zona arrives in town by October under an alias and starts romancing Curtis in order to get intel on Lorna. In November, gossip reporter Christy Connors Bennett confronts Lorna on Christy's talk show with the news of Linc's marriage, blindsiding her. By this point, Zona has begun to show symptoms of pregnancy, which turns out to a phantom pregnancy. It is all pretty lame if I am honest. 

I don't think Rebekah Beecham was a bad idea or even her as an interloper. The wealthy Aldens would need a rival family to continue the ongoing business shenanigans and, in concept, the Beechams could fill the role. While I understand the decision to end the boardroom drama, switching gears and pairing Lorna with John Gabriel's Zach Conway was odd. Giving Lorna a stepdaughter from hell like she had been to her own parents was appealing, but it never really went anywhere.  

Similarly, the Ava-Tony relationship was an odd choice. Ava and Nick would have made sense given that Ava basically spent the early 1990s lusting after Nick's successor, Paul Slavinski. The whole Nick/Tony/Marie story isn't super appealing. 

[DRW50]

@Kane @dc11786 @victoria foxton @danfling @slick jones @soapfan770 @Paul Raven @Vee @SFK @Sapounopera @j swift @Franko @Soaplovers @Joseph @FrenchFan @Soapsuds

 

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[Franko]

Much appreciated, @DRW50.

[Joseph]

THANK YOU!!!!

[Kane]

Thanks very much. I believe this episode is from the week of October 19, 1987.

Couldn't help but laugh at 19 year olds Trisha and Steve showing up dressed like an old married couple while Stacey stands there dressed like a tween.