Vee

The Bill/Holly stuff was bad, but IIRC it was in part Tony's fault. I think Emma Samms couldn't recall, asked Tony if they'd had a romance and he said no. How they both could've forgotten given Tony's obsession with Bill is wild to me but whatever. To me the worst retcons Korte let slide are Dominique somehow having Cody by Mac and Holly having Sasha by Robert, as both are literally impossible with both women on contract and onscreen for the entire duration. If you want to give Mac or Robert/Holly a child there are intervals where it's possible, but not 1991-2. That just insults everyone's intelligence. Other recent gaffes: Ethan and Lucy being super cozy and friendly when AFAIK they have never even met, let alone been in town at the same time before.

@DRW50 @titan1978 Sharon Stone claims she was asked to audition for a Laura recast in '81 or '82 (timestamped below). I suspect it was actually for Laura Templeton, but who knows. Nice to hear LNL still getting late night applause.

wrong thread

Yes, but she might not know and therefore talks to him the way she does. Still, I do think it's anyone's game who it is now, Kial, Carlton, or someone else.

I thought Sonny did know about Adella being pregnant with Ric. Supposedly he pushed her down the stairs as a boy or something.

Timing is always so interesting to observe and contextualize during this transitional period in OLTL 1991. So on 12/10/91, a day after Tina learns Cord is ‘dead’ in Jaba, there’s Christopher Cousins back again as Cain (out of costume) in the Sweetwater courtroom of all places for Max v. Asa! By my count Cousins has been gone since late October when his seduction/scam of Megan as Heinrich Kaiser derailed, but they clearly had plans for him even then and held him in reserve for now. I was wondering when he’d be back. Cain gets no lines, just watches the proceedings, and I still suspect I know why in terms of what I think may be his uncannily Xeroxed backstory. Later we see him fleeing a dinner theater production with goons on his trail. Sure, okay. Max serving as his own lawyer in his land feud with Asa leads to some minor comedy gold as he begins ranting about 'the money kings who run this country' before finally being interrupted by a country judge who I would swear is AMC and GL's Gil Rogers, but it's not in his IMDB credits so maybe not. Clearly Max was a prophet for our times. I like to think he and his kids would be soaking Elon Musk for all he's worth today. Force Ghost Wingate is at it again, telling Max to search for “serenity”. Serenity Springs this soon? Max takes it as a sign to drop his feud with Asa, which as we all know should last about 18 hours tops. Max and Asa would continue their love/hate dance almost to the end of JDP’s run (including tediously repeating Nicholas Walker's 1990-91 "Max Buchanan" storyline a second time for no good reason), and Max did come back a final time for the old man’s funeral; they never really let go of each other, and did have periods of true affection despite their feud. It's funny to see how far back it stretches. Luna naturally uses Joe Hawk’s divining rod to a horse named "Serenity" which in turns leads to a fun high-stakes poker caper I enjoyed, but I'll get to that next time. I should note that Max takes Carlo’s ‘haunted’ digs where the crime boss recently got shot - whatever. He's also a bit too chipper for having just lost Cord, though he does go to Llanfair to try the offer the absent Tina his condolences. Lee Ann meanwhile is back to the same tedious, whipsawing 180 behavior she was in for much of the transition between Rauch/Craig Carlson/whoever to Malone before Nicholas Walker left, where depending on the moment or general direction of the nearby winds she is either gushing over Max or vowing never to speak to him again based on the littlest slight. Here Lee Ann is very clearly desperate to get wifed up and/or move in with him but continues to fume and throw tantrums when Max doesn't offer either or say "I love you". This is not Yasmine Bleeth's best look but it is consistent with who Lee Ann has (annoyingly) been established as being around Max, and Bleeth is working very hard. The Kevin/Lee Ann stuff is very innocent and sweet even if he will never be what she wants; you can see her weakening to it more and more given his sincere adoration. It makes sense, even if I find Lee Ann demanding a firm commitment from Max on the heels of Gabrielle going off to the big house (like Cassie demanding more from Bo on the heels of his wife's return from the dead and his nephew's apparent demise) unfair and immature. Chris McKenna's Joey gets a great moment with Viki breaking down over Cord on the Llanfair stairs, inhaler and all, but for much of this early fallout everyone else in the family (other than Tina) seems a bit like they’re just running through the customary emotions as they all gather at Llanfair. The loss is given proper weight but it still feels kind of dashed off vs. more integral pumping storylines (Max/Lee Ann/Kevin, the return of Sarah, Megan's rising illness, etc). Viki quoting Romeo & Juliet to Clint ('cut him out into little stars,' etc) is a bit much during this, Malone. It is nice though to have Grace Phillips' NuSarah remember her Rauch-era bonds with Cord and Clint and have them put to use during the family mourning period; I'd argue she plays way better as a friend to Clint than opposite some others, including possibly Bob Woods. Cassie is not sold on Bo having 'chosen' her and I don’t blame her! She's still wildly immature, openly sulking after seeing Sarah in her element with the Bukes on the day they've learned Cord has 'died' and acting out with Bo despite his nephew's death. It's again not doing LB many favors. Phillips meanwhile gives a very realistic portrayal of Sarah's trauma and PTSD, if unrelenting and a bit exhausting. Again, she does better as the talk-to and sounding board for Viki, Clint, Megan, etc. because it's not just scene after scene of Sarah in anguish and terror over her ruined life, which has made up many of her scenes so far. Widowed Tina wants to get out of town with the kids and heads up to Viki's cabin, which is probably a good way to start to jog through more of the grieving process given all the insane upheaval beginning to overtake the show at large. At first I was thinking Clint’s taking the lost of his firstborn a bit too well lol, but then they gave CR another touching scene with Joey Thrower’s manchild Kevin, where he again revisits the topic of fatherhood (as he did early in Malone's run with some beautiful scenes up at the cabin with Kevin, Clint and Asa in September/October) and raising Kevin and Joey as his own, and how his love for Cord is different but not less or more. Kirk Geiger was the right recast for Kevin, but (like Rory Gibson on GH today) he was much more of a man than a boy; Thrower is in between boy and manhood in all his interactions, and while he's wet behind the ears and a bit too golly-gosh earnest at times, he is very affecting in this stuff and much of his ongoing infatuation with Lee Ann. That said did I mind seeing him with his shirt off in Kevin's jungle fantasies about Lee Ann? Nope! Not really sure Schubert(?) is the right choice for a limited Cord and (recast) Tina farewell montage, but okay, Linda Gottlieb. Maybe spring for a classic power ballad. I'm thinking Phil Collins. I did like that Viki still calls Larry 'my best friend' when he brings her the news about Megan's funky kidney. OTOH Viki makes the fatal mistake to not tell Megan immediately, and you can see in both her and Clint's eyes when they uneasily agree to wait (against Larry's advice) that it's the wrong choice. I have to assume that absolutely tormented her later, and I wonder if it comes up again after Megan's death given the events that unfold very shortly after this. The angst between Erika and Michael Storm was hard to watch; these characters have both been doing this for so long, care deeply for each other and Larry delivered Megan. Larry really needed a better role in this era, though they did use him more with Marty down the road. Malone once talked about the show unwisely discarding the Woleks for the Buchanans, but I will dig up that magazine quote for next time. It's something that should've been rectified years ago before the show ended, and it should have begun with Dr. Larry who was always Llanview's quiet, long-suffering unsung hero IMO, however square he could look next to folks like Karen or Marco. Both quotable lines in this post come from Dorian grasping for Jason's favor; blasting pop music in the penthouse and then, after getting her turn to style him as her ideal suited dandy (with his hair down like Roger Howarth), her getting dressed up in turn as a biker chick to hit the dive bars with him. You haven't lived until you've seen Elaine Princi in Mark Brettschneider's arms to the dulcet tones of both Extreme and Nine Inch Nails! This leads to their unexpected rendezvous with crashout Megan, which I'll discuss in more detail in my next post. We get some more great Andrew/Megan stuff with their birdwatching before her latest lupus incident. I could've watched them watching birds or hanging in the park for hours tbh, it's a great relationship. The show gets even more explicit about his feelings for her when she teases him about being smitten with her at the hospital. "Me?" Andrew jokes. "Smitten?" But of course he is, and that will lead to events during Megan's spiral which make me all the more convinced they had planned for something with Cain, Megan and Andrew had Jessica Tuck decided to stay. I'll discuss that next time with those episodes. Wow: Both Carlo and (surprise!) Stephanie are seen again on December 11th as Carlo freaks out over the news that Sarah Buchanan is back in play. Was not expecting to see Robyn Griggs again until certain events in '92. She wants to go back to Llanview too! I dunno if she will, but maybe it was a three strikes program BTS with Griggs lol. Despite previous interesting angles they left on the table in September-November for Stephanie, I can't imagine what place is left for the character with Bleeth and Mia Korf well situated and Susan Haskell weeks away.

Is it me or was Joey's phone call a clear misdirect re: Lia's boss? He calls someone and they cut to Lia on the phone, but we never see or hear either of them actually speaking to each other. The Impaler is someone else (I still bet Carlton). I also do not care about Heather Armstrong unless she is prepared to drop a real dime on Joey. Grayson's "I've been stabbed" walk is hilarious.

There's no there there either way, as I keep saying. Two nice people and talented actors FV does not care about doing nothing together. A waste of both of them if they're "paired".

I do think it would be a huge mistake to dump Drew atm. But I also think this story needs some more movement. We're not seeing enough of Willow's machinations or new political maneuvering (which they could really have fun with given our current age), and it's still not the main story. I do not care about cold fusion or the Faison clan.

Cameron better hope he doesn't get the Uncle Frank freezeout!

We did hear something about scenes being cut for Laura and Aiden I thought, but regardless Laura's gotten too little to do since 2024. She has a bit more now but the material is not great.

in other news: I still have a hard time believing Elizabeth is letting Ric put it in again after all these years. That's crazy to me. I can't really comprehend it. Are we sure they're not just going on trips where he tries to put on Next's "Too Close" and she just smiles and says goodnight? I like how Sonny is like “Sidwell has proven tough to beat.” For real? Sonny, you and Jason used to bang with dudes every 4-6 weeks on these docks like you were filing quarterly taxes. Sidwell takes brunch with Lucy and goes to Aladdin Night. He lost a poker game to Lucky. He is not that threatening. The most he has done is pan-fry Michael and Sonny has somehow let that slide. Would not happen BITD!

Oof. Good luck!

I think Laura was integral in 2023 and around that general period during the Spencer era. People would run everything in town short of bathroom breaks by "Mayor Collins" and I thought it was a hoot, and good for her character to stay connected. Since then she's faltered, probably due to FV's lack of favor. Does Laura have ethical lapses? Sure. Her character is in a particularly bad spot atm with Sidwell. But given Luke the small time gangland runner and rapist ending up mayor, Mac the merc and Anna the enemy agent becoming police commissioners (to say nothing of spy turned high end con man Sean Donely) and both Scott and Ric taking turns as DA, I think her position is pretty typical for soap realism. I think Laura should take a hit and maybe lose the seat for awhile to someone like Ric, then get it back.

Griffith has gone from being long seen as a secret gem and the supposedly 'better' writer of the Michael Malone/Linda Gottlieb team at OLTL to a total burnout case in the last 20+ years. His rep is in the toilet. I can't imagine what he has left in the tank if he clings to the HW position through sheer inertia.

'95 I can handle. I'm just curious when I might best start looking at say, the late '80s or early '90s (when I know Agnes was returning at various points). The creative turnover, the strike, etc. makes my head spin, and I know Laura's death was in there somewhere right before or after the strike, maybe. Maybe I'll go to 1990 like you say.

Laura should not want Elizabeth near Panic Room Ric tbh. I enjoy Ric for who he is, but he's slime.

Steve quit in 2012 because he couldn't come to terms with Frank Valentini. It was not about Nashville.

I also think KL's first three seasons, even as they get slow at times or have eps you can skip (I have a must-watch ep list of my own somewhere as I am sure many fans do), have certain eps that while not serialized or 'important' are essential to understanding the characters and relationships that continue to power the show and story well into halfway through its run and probably beyond. KL prioritized character and that institutional memory in a way many primetime soaps don't IMO.

I know @soapfave06 commented on this stuff recently but I am also blitzing through December '91 pretty quickly. Megan's very quick spiral into hedonism (the prototype for Marty's ongoing saga, which I'll get to more later) and renewed dalliance with Cain/Humberto/Heinrich/Hudson, doing a scorching tango while Andrew looks on, makes me again suspect that Gottlieb and Malone might've been aiming for a Cain/Megan/Andrew triangle had Jessica Tuck decided to renew her contract. But I'll get into that and the John Loprieno variable of it all when I dig into these episodes further (and at nauseating length!) very soon.

Is there an AMC vault for some of these 95 eps? Asking for a friend (me). I never do really know where to start with late '80s or early '90s AMC, or the permutations of when Agnes herself came in and out in the '80s and '90s. I only really started watching in spring-summer '93 myself.

I'll stick to just those I saw live. There are any number of others I saw of course, but these are some I still remember offhand. DAYS 1994-95: Gina/Hope, Bo/Billie, Aremid and the Possession. GH 1993: Luke and Laura's grand return and the introduction of Lucky. GH 1994: Bobbie traps Damian Smith in the tunnels/sewers/whatever they were. OLTL 1994: The hospital rapist storyline with Powell Lord. Still very creepy. (I came in just after the Spring Fling rape of Marty in '93, so I didn't see much of the trial.) OLTL 1995: The abuse reveal, with Viki splitting into her alters, calling Dorian a "stupid, ugly bitch" and hurling her down the stairs. I've talked about this a lot. I was home watching live as a young teenager, had no idea Viki had ever been mentally ill and was terrified. LOV 1995: The Loving Murders. 'Nuff said. GH 1995: Coming home from school to watch Alan Quartermaine tell Robin Scorpio she's HIV positive. She was maybe 2-3 years older than me. Christmas 2000, AMC: Bianca strips down and tells her mother she's gay. I sobbed and sobbed. OLTL 2002: Live Week. A wonderful achievement and the greatest performance in Kassie DePaiva's career, even though she was admittedly terrified BTS the whole time. OLTL 2002: The other shoe finally drops in the long baby switch storyline when Viki confronts Allison Perkins in a padded cell and she answers her questions with "Ask Mitch." The look in Barbara Garrick's eyes says it all as to why they kept bringing her back right to the very end in 2013. I suspected Mitch had to be alive and sure enough, at the end of the episode there he was. OLTL 2007: Asa's death. Bob Woods gave one of his very best performances, maybe the best of his career, as a drunken Bo became unhinged in the Buchanan stables over his dysfunctional relationship with his father. Woods rarely was a showy actor and was often deceptively understated, so to watch him come unglued was jarring and very, very powerful. OLTL 2008: Dorian seizes Buchanan Enterprises and exposes Jared and Natalie, leading to Nash Brennan's violent death while the family looks on at the hospital. AMC 2008: Angie chases the train and reunites with Jesse. Debbi Morgan's screams still rip my heart out. OLTL 2009: Kyle and Oliver have sex, the first gay love scene I can recall on American daytime and not a chaste one. GH 2011: Sonny finds out about Brenda and Dante's relationship at the altar, but chooses to marry her anyway and gives a wonderful speech about how her father lied to her about being worthless. One of Sonny's last great moments as well as some of the last great works from the longtime dialogue team, and oddly enough one of the first times I was legitimately able to appreciate Sonny and Brenda (I had not been a huge Brenda fan as a kid and preferred Robin/Carly) and began to revisit their past. GH 2012: The water crisis. Hokey and silly in many places but genuinely exciting and affecting, and it probably saved the show from cancellation. GH 2013: Robin returns and crashes Patrick and Sabrina's wedding. Again, drawn out and hokey for weeks and months prior, but Ron Carlivati had very deliberately set up to imitate the structure of Laura's clandestine weeks-long return in 1983 as well as of Anna and Robin's Asian Quarter reunion in the '80s (echoed with Robin and Emma in the church), and he delivered on both in those key scenes.

Knots Landing is #1 with a bullet. It doesn't really ramp up til Season 3, but there are eps that are solid and important as well as ones to avoid in the relatively shorter first two seasons.

Thanks!

I agree he wants her. But I don't mind Michael's manipulations. It's pure Quartermaine stuff, Alan and Monica in their prime/at their worst. Easily the most appealing and charismatic he's been to me in ages, working the room (well, deck) talking with that adorable baby.