Remind me who were these people?

Anyway, it's just that whenever I see Lows in the Mid-Eighties or the Friends episode he wrote... I think: soap.

I know why all this is happening. It is cost containment. If they play smaller groups of folks in islands (something, to be fair, Bill Bell did all the time), they can shoot multiple eps in one day--saving $$. But this is a clear place where the license fee cuts are HURTING storytelling. Or, maybe not storytelling--character building.

That's one of the many reasons I could go with a small cast. A small group that plays 5 days a week, but everyone interacts all the time. Though I am not a GH fan, I believe they do this very well.

If people can't interact because of money then there's no way all these storylines will be logical. But with news that Eva and Vail going recurring I don't see why this show won't hurry it along with the rest of the useless cast. And if one actor is shooting multiple scripts in one day they need to plan ahead better. There's literally no reason Della Reese shouldn't've been at the adoption proceedings and she should've been where Tyra went to cry to when she lost Ana. Obviously the same goes with Noah who should've been in scenes instead of Summer and Heather, Nikki, and Rafe all under Adam's a--.

Money as the deterrant really makes me feel sorry for TPTB. That said, whatever strategy they're using just doesn't work in handling the cast.

And I don't understand why they couldn't use the Marge/Kay storyline as a blueprint for mapping out every single storyline on Y&R. They've copy/pasted bad ideas. Why not good ones? And I don't mean the literal s/l I mean the structure of it from beginning to end. The pacing, modern topics discussed, longterm effect on characters, romance, nod to history, creativity, strong, smart female lead in the center, should be applied to everything on the show. I don't know what inspired this story but it needs to inspire others.

she has been a cipher.

No she hasn't.

We never saw Mac and Brock get close.

They did.

The entire idea from close to the beginning of this character is that she is there for Billy to pine over.

Not at all.

Mac is always viewed in this prism.

Not really.

The last thing Billy needed as a character was for Mac to return.

Nope.

The canvas & Billy need Mackenzie.

But there are two problems.

1. Maria wants to push the couple over the individual characters

2. EH is liked so Chloe gets a free pass she doesn't deserve at the expense of other legacy characters.

Edited June 21, 200916 yr by DeeeDee

I don't think storytelling like that is what people who lobby for gays to be represented on their favourite show want, especially when it's the first time the show is attempting to tell a gay storyline.

Equal opportunity means equally bad writing. lol

And why can they write for Amber but not Colleen? That's crap.

Exactly.

Amber & Jana have gotten more story than Mackenzie, Colleen, Chloe & Abby combined.

The problem with Mac is that she needs to be in other people faces. We don't even see her with her grandma anymore.with her.

Yep.

If people can't interact because of money then there's no way all these storylines will be logical. But with news that Eva and Vail going recurring I don't see why this show won't hurry it along with the rest of the useless cast. And if one actor is shooting multiple scripts in one day they need to plan ahead better. There's literally no reason Della Reese shouldn't've been at the adoption proceedings and she should've been where Tyra went to cry to when she lost Ana. Obviously the same goes with Noah who should've been in scenes instead of Summer and Heather, Nikki, and Rafe all under Adam's a--.

Money as the deterrant really makes me feel sorry for TPTB. That said, whatever strategy they're using just doesn't work in handling the cast.

Yep.

Anyway, it's just that whenever I see Lows in the Mid-Eighties or the Friends episode he wrote... I think: soap.

Do you mean Joe Keenan?

Anyways, I loved Joe Keenan's Bang... I thought it was above brilliant.... And I thought he played a big part on why DH Season 3 was so great. (at least IMO). I wouldn't be against trying it out.

Do you mean Joe Keenan?

Anyways, I loved Joe Keenan's Bang... I thought it was above brilliant.... And I thought he played a big part on why DH Season 3 was so great. (at least IMO). I wouldn't be against trying it out.

Lows in the Mid-Eighties is a cult episode from Will & Grace. It was written by Jeff Greenstein, who also did something similar on Friends.

Regarding Joe Keenan, who I mentioned above, and his episode... That episode was many things, but it wasn't DH. It completely stood out from the rest. It was excellent, but it wasn't DH. And I don't know if it's a good thing. Because when you're hired, you're required to write in the style & tone of the show who hired you. This was way too auteurial. But I think he would be an interesting choice, which is why I suggested him.

Edited June 21, 200916 yr by Sylph

Even though not really my kind of writer, whose shows weren't my type of shows at all (Six Feet Under), and whose American Beauty I don't see as groundbreaking at all, I would be interested to see what would "death-obsessed" Alan Ball do.

Edited June 21, 200916 yr by Sylph

Lows in the Mid-Eighties is a cult episode from Will & Grace. It was written by Jeff Greenstein, who also did something similar on Friends.

Thanks, I will make sure to check them out... I've seen all from FRIENDS, do you remember which one he wrote?

Regarding Joe Keenan, who I mentioned above, and his episode... That episode was many thing, but it wasn't DH. It completely stood out from the rest. It was excellent, but it wasn't DH. And I don't know if it's a good thing. Because when you're hired, you're required to write in the style & tone of the show who hired you. This was way too auteurial. But I think he would be an interesting choice, which is why I suggested him.

Hmmm... I actually never saw it that way. I saw it as taking the style and tone Marc Cherry wanted and presenting it in its best, most sophisticated, and less crappy way. But, if he indeed cannot follow the tone and style, that could be very hurtful. Anyway, all this is just speculation, but I really did love the suggestion.

Thanks, I will make sure to check them out... I've seen all from FRIENDS, do you remember which one he wrote?

I think the Thanksgiving episode was called The One Where Underdog Gets Away.

Hmmm... I actually never saw it that way. I saw it as taking the style and tone Marc Cherry wanted and presenting it in its best, most sophisticated, and less crappy way. But, if he indeed cannot follow the tone and style, that could be very hurtful. Anyway, all this is just speculation, but I really did love the suggestion.

He sure did: that's precisely what I was saying. The episode was thoroughly cleansed of campy excess and a lot grittier. There was a certain lack of fun, tons of black humour and it all somehow deviated from the formula...

I read something in Meg's IMDB bio that said she often tweaked her scripts on set and it impressed Bill Bell so much so that he encouraged her to purpose a career in writing for soap operas. He clearly liked her a lot, as for a time, she acted AND wrote scripts for Y&R.

And yes, that would be a great combination. Too bad that Guza holds on to his writers with everything he's got and yeah, Meg is his wife.

But I don't think anyone in the Bell family, Sony, or CBS is smart enough to take our advice.

Actually, I would really be on board for Meg Bennett to play a big part in the writing of this show. I wouldn't have problem ONE with them ditching Sheffer and replacing him with Meg Bennett. I suppose the main reason I want Maria there (If nothing else as Executive producer) is that she is family, she knows the history, and she CARES. But I like the idea of putting OTHER people with her, besides Hamner and Sheffer, and see what clicks. When she was interviewed on soaptalk a couple years ago, she talked about how she wrote and acted on the show at the same time, although she said Bill Bell would NEVER let her write for her own character, that was strictly forbidden. However... in the same interview, she heavily PIMPED her husband's work, saying how wonderful it was. I wans't sure how to take it.... was she just supporting her husband in public, or should I seriously question her taste level? She's still a gorgeous lady.... I have her leggs pantyhose commercial from 1977 on tape, cute as hell!

Edited June 21, 200916 yr by alphanguy74

Gloria has been backburnered. That's what I wanted when I quit 2 years ago and I finally got it so I'm happy.

I'd rather watch Y&R and say "That was a good episode" or "That was a great week" then watch any other soap and over praise a single scene because someone acted in character for one piece of dialogue. Right now I'd say Y&R is mediocre to great. The art crap = mediocre, Adam's revenge = alright, the mystery of P3 = great.

It's not perfect but it's watchable and has me waiting for what happens next. That sense of anticipation has returned.

The canvas & Billy need Mackenzie.

But there are two problems.

1. Maria wants to push the couple over the individual characters

2. EH is liked so Chloe gets a free pass she doesn't deserve at the expense of other legacy characters.

3. Clementine Ford can't act for [!@#$%^&*].

I completely understand why Mac is back, you simply can't unrelate Jill and Kay and NOT handle the Mac and Billy aspect of the story, it would be disingenuous to the characters and to the viewers.

Funnily enough I've thought for a while that Mac should have just been Katie, the only aspect of the story they would have had to change was Brock being her father, Kay could have still been a surrogate grandmother to her.

Edited June 21, 200916 yr by Darn

And why can they write for Amber but not Colleen? That's crap.

I think MAB has Amber in position to be the next Nikki. They write for her character because TPTB love Adrienne Frnatz. On another message board someone has said that Amber is Hogan's favorite character, but I have no idea how much truth there is to that.

If I were to have my guess I would say that the Scoobies are Maria's favorite young adult characters. If they don't write for the legacy character they would probably blame it on the casting.

This Amber thing reminds me of an article I read:

http://snarkweighsin.blog-city.com/swicolumn3.htm

I think MAB has Amber in position to be the next Nikki. They write for her character because TPTB love Adrienne Frnatz. On another message board someone has said that Amber is Hogan's favorite character, but I have no idea how much truth there is to that.

If I were to have my guess I would say that the Scoobies are Maria's favorite young adult characters. If they don't write for the legacy character they would probably blame it on the casting.

This Amber thing reminds me of an article I read:

http://snarkweighsin.blog-city.com/swicolumn3.htm

OT: What ever happened to Snark? Has he simply had it with soaps?

I like Adrienne Frantz - actually I don't mind any of the Scoobies as actors - but the writers don't seem to know what to do with them other than the same lame capers.

I think CF is capable, but she has no clue whatsoever about who Mac is. She has no direction at all. It doesn't help that the writers can only manage to give Mac two lines a episode. How are you supposed to develop a character when said character doesn't even --ugh!-- speak?