The Politics Thread

[LeClerc]

I was watching Chris Hayes' segment on MSNBC earlier tonight on the sabotage being carried out by various Repub governors and it really is just disgusting.

Unfortunately I expect the mainstream "liberal" media is going to launch a full-throttle attack on the administration/ACA now to balance out having been extra tough (in their minds) on the Republicans the past few weeks (extra tough= "both sides are equally to blame", "Obama is so mean/arrogant")

I do think Kathleen Sebelius deserves to be fired for the roll-out mess. But making a change now would probably do more harm than good and I imagine the confirmation of any HHS candidate would be stalled indefinitely.

[DRW50]

RIP Congressman CW Bill Young.

http://www.politico.com/story/2013/10/bill-young-dies-at-82-98546.html?hp=l2

[DRW50]

I remember hearing over and over and over about how brilliant Ken Cucinelli was, and that libruls feared him because he's a true conservative who knows how to win!

He could still win, even with the polling deficit, but if he does, it is apparently because of his great pals and their shaking down of the far right fringe. They include the Duggar family, and Florida AG Pam Bondi, who did one of the most thoughtless and pathetic things I've ever seen a major elected official do.

http://www.politico.com/story/2013/10/ken-cuccinelli-virginia-governor-race-98548.html?hp=f1

http://www.tampabay.com/news/politics/national/execution-rescheduled-to-accommodate-pam-bondi-fundraiser/2140891

Edited October 19, 2013 by DRW50

[Soapsuds]

[DRW50]

Looks like they'll be a fight in Ohio over the Medicaid expansion.

http://www.politico.com/story/2013/10/ohio-moving-toward-obamacare-medicaid-expansion-98609.html?hp=f3

[juppiter]

Ken Cucinelli is creepy and cray as hell, but as much as I hate myself for saying it, I think he's so f*ckable. Please please let him be a self-hating gay and have a Larry Craig "wide stance" moment in an airport mens' room. If I could have just one wish.

[marceline]

You called this 100% right.

[DRW50]

RIP Congressman Major Owens.

http://www.politico.com/story/2013/10/major-owens-dies-98674.html?hp=r1

[Max]

I ordinarily might have some sympathy for the left over the horrendous website launch, but one has to remember that it was the Obama supporters who were gloating endlessly over how superior their get-out-the-vote technology was, while ruthlessly trashing Romney's disastrous Project ORCA. In fact, prior to this launch, Team Obama was widely recognized by even its opponents for being technological wizards; that is what makes this experience all the more embarrassing for this administration.

While others are blaming the failure on solely "racist" Republicans, it was refreshing to see Robert Gibbs not spin the situation:

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As badly as Obama and his administration botched this website up, there is one piece of information I found out that makes me almost feel sorry for Kathleen Sebelius:

Read more: http://www.politico.com/story/2013/10/heckuva-a-job-sebelius-98761.html#ixzz2imKk0tvH

While Cruz's desire to shut down the government was crazy, it looks like his desire to push Obamacare back a year was a modest request, given that Sebelius want to push it back four years. But, whatever Sebelius wanted to do (and what was really in the best interest of the website) did not prevail, because President Obama chose to cave into the base (as he had already been on their bad side with Syria and Larry Summers) by giving them the website on October 1. We all know there would have been hell for him to pay if he said the website wasn't ready on October 1 and therefore had to delay it.

The one thing that I agree with the progressive base on is that these glitches will eventually be fixed. However, that it itself does not vindicate Obamacare, because the website (which again, should never have been launched until it was ready) is the most basic thing to get right. Obamacare will be vindicated when/if premiums don't rise, the program doesn't add to our national debt, nobody is ever forced to change insurance plans (although many people, including myself, are already being forced to do just that), small businesses are able start hiring more than 50 full-time workers (without incurring fines), etc.

Edited October 25, 2013 by Max

[juppiter]

Caving to the base would've been Canadian-style single payer.

[Juliajms]

I like the idea of the ACA, but I'll admit I'm concerned about how this is going to play out. If the government hasn't even done enough planning to make the website work, I have to wonder about how the actual implementation of ACA is going to work. You have to figure that there has also been no or little planning for all the extra health care workers we are going to need.

I suppose the Republicans would say that it will all come out in the wash. Increased demand will lead to increased supply, but I can't help but think we have gone about all of this in an assed backwards way. The government is mandating an increase in demand, but it's the private sector that is responsible for supply.

I guess we can hope that there won't be a true increase in demand, since when someone had an urgent need for care they were getting it, just not using insurance, but I'm not entirely convinced. When I was in my 20's without insurance, I just didn't see anyone for preventative care. I'm glad other young or poor people will get that now, but I also wish that we had planned for it in advance by encouraging medical schools to train more primary care physicians and PA's and such.

Since the government can barely manage to stay open, it's probably too much to hope for advanced planning for this type of policy. I do wonder if we are going to regret not going with a single payer system down the road though. I dismiss the idea that we should have stuck with the status quo out of hand. Having people use the ER as their first line of treatment was not working.

[alphanguy74]

EXACTLY. Republicans kept carrying on about how Obama needed to "negotiate" with them before the shutdown. He ALREADY negotiated when the law was being written! But it all just boils down to greed. A PERFECT example in my own life. One of my former customers has a granddaughter that was just diagnosed with Leukemia. The child is 8 years old, and it is very sad. HOWEVER.... the child is on Medicaid because her mother doesn't make enough money, and she qualifies for it. But her grandparents are RABID Tea Partiers, and are posting things on facebook all the time about personal responsbility, and not letting the "Nanny state" take care of you, all the while their own granddaughter is on Medicaid, and their church is organizing a fund raiser for her care... all the while, these grandparents own TWO million dollar homes, and are sitting on a net worth of 3-4 million dollars. So you see how THAT works.

[I Am A Swede]

What do you all think of this? This could turn into a real international crisis, if it isn't one already.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-24692908

It's really astonishing if it's true, that the U.S has spied on the German Chancellor since 2002!

[Max]

These allegations are very disturbing, Swede. There is quite a bit of outrage on this, but I imagine that the outrage would have been so much greater if these charges were leveled against the Bush Administration.

Republicans did not feel that they were being involved in the ACA negotiations, since there was no need for Obama to talk to them (as the Democrats had 60 seats in the Senate and a large majority in the House.) Despite the oft-repeated narrative of Obama being a bi-partisan leader, Olympia Snowe (hardly a Breitbart conservative) tells a different story:

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/power-players-abc-news/frustrated-senator-olympia-snowe-gives-obama-f-101657433.html

I know progressives are upset that there is not a single-payer system, but that failure was solely due to the objections of moderate Democrats. Far be it from me to defend the president, but even he can't be blamed for that. (Does anyone honestly believe--if the Constitution had been established in a way that gave the POTUS absolute power--that Obama wouldn't change the U.S. health care system to single-payer?)

Alphanguy, you are entitled to make generalizations if you wish. But the problem is that liberals who make generalizations about certain things then get upset when conservatives make such generalizations. (Please note that I am not necessarily referring to you here.) For instance, just like many liberals generalize that conservatives are greedy, many conservatives generalize that government bureaucrats are incompetent. The terrible problems that the Obamacare website has been experiencing is just the latest piece of evidence that supports their generalization.

Edited October 27, 2013 by Max

[Juliajms]

How is this astonishing in any way? No one in any government is legitimately astonished. The only thing that surprises me is that we haven't been spying on the German Chancellor longer. Allies spy on each other. The U.S. has been caught red handed spying, so now our allies can demand concessions, but they spy on us and we spy on them and that's the way it has been and always will be. I'm getting a big kick out of all of these governments pretending otherwise though.

http://www.cnn.com/2013/10/29/politics/nsa-hearing/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

Edited October 30, 2013 by Juliajms