3 hours ago, JaneAusten said:

I kind of halfway agree with this but finally the democrats have agreed to withhold consent and people are now submitting amendments  - we need to get thousands of them in - to force a vote-a-rama.  I've pretty much given up on O-Care but if the democrats can accomplish stalling long enough to get the R's to release their bill, it's a big victory.  Now the question is will they squander it?

 

I've been very bummed out locally due to our own town council's recent decisions on min wage opt out. But some villages that have actually changed leadership in the last election won over. And I am finally convinced that single payer is the answer after being ambivalent. The costs are not nearly as high as projected. In fact my R friend who is mega conservative is also on the single payer bandwagon. He has a small business and I think he sees it as a cost saving and benefit to his business more than the idea of helping people, but whatever reasons someone supports the same thing, more power to them.

That an incredibly powerful ad. With GE leaving Waukasha, and Ryan being a reason why, it would be nice to see some people in WI wake up. This state is going to end up like Kansas in no time.

I know. I was going to pass it(he's already on my ignore list) but damn these people are stupid. They brag about the stock market numbers going up under Trump as if that helps them personally, celebrating in the 1% taking more of their own tax dollars for corporate welfare, like it helps them. Dumb. And I have no intention of responding to such troll again.

Right On. they are brain dead. they heard "build a wall!" "Mexicans are rapists!" "Muslims are terrorists!" and "Make america great again!" and then proceeded to the polls and screwed themselves and this nation. SAND has more good sense. That person and some others are on my ignore list as well, because they bring NOTHING to the discourse. Nothing. you did the right thing. 

3 hours ago, JaneAusten said:

I know. I was going to pass it(he's already on my ignore list) but damn these people are stupid. They brag about the stock market numbers going up under Trump as if that helps them personally, celebrating in the 1% taking more of their own tax dollars for corporate welfare, like it helps them. Dumb. And I have no intention of responding to such troll again.

 

It would be nice to have some conservative posters in this tread who could make intelligent fact based comments but the truth is there's very little about the current behavior of Republicans that any intelligent fact based person could defend. So we're stuck with these crackpots blathering on about Hillary, Obama, and Pelosi. 

Some precincts here in Georgia are reporting lines up to three times as long as the lines during Election Day for President. Lawd! I'm so nervous!

Edited June 20, 20178 yr by Eric83

1 hour ago, Roman said:

Right On. they are brain dead. they heard "build a wall!" "Mexicans are rapists!" "Muslims are terrorists!" and "Make america great again!" and then proceeded to the polls and screwed themselves and this nation. SAND has more good sense. That person and some others are on my ignore list as well, because they bring NOTHING to the discourse. Nothing. you did the right thing. 

 

I honestly think there should be a "voting license". Kind of like a driver's license but a test for voting. If you can't answer coherently about any issue outside of slogans or propaganda, no vote.

 

I know it'll NEVER happen, as the right to vote is in our Constitution (much as that document is spit on in this administration!), but there should be such a test to assess cognitive thinking and brain function before anyone steps into a voting booth!

 

Or suffer the consequences. (And wow, are we suffering now thanks to the brain dead.)

1 hour ago, Wendy said:

 

I honestly think there should be a "voting license". Kind of like a driver's license but a test for voting. If you can't answer coherently about any issue outside of slogans or propaganda, no vote.

 

I know it'll NEVER happen, as the right to vote is in our Constitution (much as that document is spit on in this administration!), but there should be such a test to assess cognitive thinking and brain function before anyone steps into a voting booth!

 

Or suffer the consequences. (And wow, are we suffering now thanks to the brain dead.)

Despite what the same idiots parrot, the electoral college was created to avoid the catastrophe we have in the WH today. These were supposed to be non partisan educated people who would pick a leader if the citizens elected an idiot.  Well see how that has worked.

 

The problem is all those things Trump said he would do, break up the banks, remember when he said he would not allow Amazon to become a monopoly LMAO, make sure Medicaid, Medicare, and Social Security were secure, renegotiate bad trade deals, provide healthcare better than any country in the world, none of that list is happening or will happen because Pence basically picked all his appointees who are all Koch Brother cronies, who are in it for the 1%. Had Trump actually followed through on his populist message, things might be different but then most of us who have followed this grifter con man for years knew the person who has screwed working people out of wages for years, hired illegal labor for his buildings and properties, knew he was full of crap.

2 hours ago, Roman said:

Right On. they are brain dead. they heard "build a wall!" "Mexicans are rapists!" "Muslims are terrorists!" and "Make america great again!" and then proceeded to the polls and screwed themselves and this nation. SAND has more good sense. That person and some others are on my ignore list as well, because they bring NOTHING to the discourse. Nothing. you did the right thing. 

 

I call those the "3-word voters." They don't look past the slogans: "Lock her up" "Build the wall" "Feel the bern" "Bern the witch" "Trump that bitch." and yes, I include "Hope and change." 

 

Her slogan? "Stronger Together" 

9 minutes ago, marceline said:

 

I call those the "3-word voters." They don't look past the slogans: "Lock her up" "Build the wall" "Feel the bern" "Bern the witch" "Trump that bitch." and yes, I include "Hope and change." 

 

Her slogan? "Stronger Together" 

 

Ironically, just days before the first round of the French election, Emmanuel Macron changed his campaign slogan to "Ensemble, la France!" which translates to France, Together!  or Together, France!

 

Hillary's biggest mistake at the end was using "when THEY GO LOW!?  WE GO HIGH!".  Stupid. You gotta go lower sometimes to beat the lowest.  People are listening to shi* so - unfortunately you have to go crappier.  The Obamas couldn't go higher or lower because they were leaving.  Hillary likely was never going to win unless she appealed to the stupid people, and honestly, I'm not sorry that she didn't.  Let them find out in 15 years that they're dying and have no health care.  I get what I want faster that way.

17 minutes ago, Fevuh said:

Hillary's biggest mistake at the end was using "when THEY GO LOW!?  WE GO HIGH!".  Stupid. You gotta go lower sometimes to beat the lowest.  People are listening to shi* so - unfortunately you have to go crappier.  The Obamas couldn't go higher or lower because they were leaving.  Hillary likely was never going to win unless she appealed to the stupid people, and honestly, I'm not sorry that she didn't.  Let them find out in 15 years that they're dying and have no health care.  I get what I want faster that way.

 

I think it was less not going low as it was just months of negative Trump antics and coverage numbing voters. Media darling Marco strutted around telling people that the man likely had tiny meat, which is about as low as you can get in a machismo-dominated country like this, and it didn't do him any good.

 

There was so much about Trump, how awful Trump was, how terrible Trump would be, Trump Trump Trump, and so little about Hillary. I will always think that they made a big mistake in the Vice Presidential debate in having Tim Kaine spend the whole time yelling about Trump rather than saying anything positive about himself or Hillary. 

 

When people mostly hear about one man, especially people who feel disenfranchised and checked out of politics, they are more likely to either stay home or to vote for him.

12 minutes ago, DRW50 said:

 

I think it was less not going low as it was just months of negative Trump antics and coverage numbing voters. Media darling Marco strutted around telling people that the man likely had tiny meat, which is about as low as you can get in a machismo-dominated country like this, and it didn't do him any good.

 

There was so much about Trump, how awful Trump was, how terrible Trump would be, Trump Trump Trump, and so little about Hillary. I will always think that they made a big mistake in the Vice Presidential debate in having Tim Kaine spend the whole time yelling about Trump rather than saying anything positive about himself or Hillary. 

 

When people mostly hear about one man, especially people who feel disenfranchised and checked out of politics, they are more likely to either stay home or to vote for him.

 

You have to be specific about what kind of people though.  Black women feel hella disenfranchised and we didn't vote for Trump. 

 

Also, studies were done and in the final analysis, the showed that the lionshare of media coverage in MSM focused on Hillary's perceived negatives while minimizing Trump's perhaps being overly sensitive to his victimization narrative that the media was somehow out to get him.  For those who stayed home, the media coverage helped to cement the false equivalency narrative that somehow both candidates were equally bad.

8 minutes ago, DramatistDreamer said:

 

You have to be specific about what kind of people though.  Black women feel hella disenfranchised and we didn't vote for Trump. 

 

Also, studies were done and in the final analysis, the showed that the lionshare of media coverage in MSM focused on Hillary's perceived negatives while minimizing Trump's perhaps being overly sensitive to his victimization narrative that the media was somehow out to get him.  For those who stayed home, the media coverage helped to cement the false equivalency narrative that somehow both candidates were equally bad.

There is no question that the campaign was flawed but I put a good deal of blame on the MSM. I watched a couple of good speeches Hillary Clinton gave at rallies, one in Youngstown where she talked about new jobs and broadband and she got mocked for that. ANd it wasn't a high minded speech. And another I believe in Columbus on some of the same topics. Very little coverage by the media.

 

I find the first speech ironic now. I read an article recently I think in Politico about the former coal miners starting a coding company to employ former miners to compete against off shore companies. Biggest problem broadband access.

Edited June 20, 20178 yr by JaneAusten

16 minutes ago, DramatistDreamer said:

 

You have to be specific about what kind of people though.  Black women feel hella disenfranchised and we didn't vote for Trump. 

 

I was mostly talking about the voters in places like the Rust Belt (places that it was taken for granted that Hillary would win). White voters were responsible for Trump and I never intend to imply otherwise. My apologies if I did.

Seems Karen Handel is winning against Jon Ossoff in Georgia, from early results. Anyone surprised? Yeah, me neither.

5 hours ago, marceline said:

 

It would be nice to have some conservative posters in this tread who could make intelligent fact based comments but the truth is there's very little about the current behavior of Republicans that any intelligent fact based person could defend. So we're stuck with these crackpots blathering on about Hillary, Obama, and Pelosi. 

 

I'm gonna go old school, because it came to mind:

 

Word.

 

 

 

10 hours ago, DRW50 said:

 

That and they didn't realize they were even voting against their own health insurance.

 

They're damned either way because even if this doesn't get repealed, Trump will keep strangling the market until no providers will want to participate. 

 

Democrats will get the blame, because of terrible messaging, a media that worships Republicans, and a public that is apathetic and easily manipulated. And deep down I am starting to wonder how many leading Democrats actually want to win anyway - it's certainly easier, and more lucrative, to just tsk-tsk about Trump.

 

 

Bottom line is racism. Pure and simple.

 

How do you get a blue collar white West Virginian to believe that SOMEONE ELSE is the enemy that is taking jobs and tax money from you?

 

Blame the black man or the welfare queen or the Mexicans.

 

The reality is there has been such a long-seated plan very carefully designed by Those in Power (i.e. Rich White Men) to pit the Poor against one another. It is all very effective, because it keeps us living in fear of the Other.

 

Edited June 21, 20178 yr by cct
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18 minutes ago, Wendy said:

Seems Karen Handel is winning against Jon Ossoff in Georgia, from early results. Anyone surprised? Yeah, me neither.

look how close South Carolina is