there is no story with Liam. John is not his father. End of story. I think you are looking for more to be there but there isnt and thats totally understandable. I think most people in his position would proceed the same way. If he's not going to be with Natalie, the mother of hte kid, then he has no business clinging onto her child, when said child already has a father that is in the picture. Its ridiculous that he is being made to have to feel guilty about thisa nd that he's expected to be obligated to raise Liam as if nothing has changed. And let me reitterate the important point that he only had Liam for a month. He's lucky the truth came out so soon. Its in everyone's best interest that he move on with his life. It could have been alot worse with the truth coming out a few years down the line and creating a big mess for all involved

I see what you're saying, but then what was the point of anything in the last year, if John doesn't care about Liam at all? I know they probably did this to try to manipulate viewer sympathy for John and John/Kelly after he spent so long watching paint dry with Marty, but still, there's a way to make this more interesting. Instead it's just one long shrug.

Ford is the biological father, but he is keeping the child away from his mother and allowing her to remain in a state of mental illness for his own benefit, under those circumstances, I don't think he's fit to be a parent. Brody and Jessica agreed a long time ago that they would raise the child as Brody's, so I don't see a problem with Brody calling Ryder his son.

I think they'll let Ford get more and more attached to Ryder and then flip the paternity again.

Didn't Jessica apologize to Ford and make sure everyone knew that his rape was her fault?

And TESS gave her an excuse too (while happily ignoring the fact that Tess presence meant Jessica was too traumatized to remain in control).

there is no story with Liam. John is not his father. End of story. I think you are looking for more to be there but there isnt and thats totally understandable. I think most people in his position would proceed the same way. If he's not going to be with Natalie, the mother of hte kid, then he has no business clinging onto her child, when said child already has a father that is in the picture. Its ridiculous that he is being made to have to feel guilty about thisa nd that he's expected to be obligated to raise Liam as if nothing has changed. And let me reitterate the important point that he only had Liam for a month. He's lucky the truth came out so soon. Its in everyone's best interest that he move on with his life. It could have been alot worse with the truth coming out a few years down the line and creating a big mess for all involved

I agree with you. It drives me NUTS when Natalie keeps telling John that Liam is his son. I love Natalie, but she doesn't get to change reality to whatever she wants it to be. John is not the child's father. He can be the stepfather if he chooses to be, but she has no right to try to force any obligations onto him or act as if Brody doesn't exist.

People are always saying that soaps hate women, but when it comes to parenthood, soaps love to act as if men have no rights at all. It's strange. Brody is that kid's father, no matter what Natalie has to say about it and Ford has rights, no matter what Brody or Jess think about it. Brody isn't even married to Jessica for heaven's sake.

People are always saying that soaps hate women, but when it comes to parenthood, soaps love to act as if men have no rights at all. It's strange. Brody is that kid's father, no matter what Natalie has to say about it and Ford has rights, no matter what Brody or Jess think about it. Brody isn't even married to Jessica for heaven's sake.

The soaps only like to act like a man doesn't have rights if they don't like that man. Sonny, Victor, Todd, Ryan, etc. are usually written as being fathers that children should have, imperfect but all the better for being imperfect, and if women ever keep children away from them, it's something they regret and pay for.

Edited March 30, 201114 yr by CarlD2

I think if John and Natalie had been married and he had been a father to Liam for six months or more than I could understand Natalie's position better. John would have loved the child, but due to how quickly he found out that didn't happen. That's why her "Liam loves you" stuff falls completely flat.

The soaps only like to act like a man doesn't have rights if they don't like that man. Sonny, Victor, Todd, Ryan, etc. are usually written as being fathers that children should have, imperfect but all the better for being imperfect, and if women ever keep children away from them, it's something they regret and pay for.

Yeah, but if you choose to have a child with someone than you shouldn't try to keep that child away from them, unless you can get the court to agree they are unfit. All these women knew what the guy was like before they popped out a kid. I hate Sonny, but I thought it was so strange that Alexis thought she had the right to keep Kristina away from him. She was his MOB lawyer for god's sake! And the strangest thing of all is that the men act like it's all up to the woman if she keeps a their kid from them. Like Victor just letting hope walk off with Adam. At least Ryan makes little noises about it not all being up to Madison.

Yeah, but if you choose to have a child with someone than you shouldn't try to keep that child away from them, unless you can get the court to agree they are unfit. All these women knew what the guy was like before they popped out a kid. I hate Sonny, but I thought it was so strange that Alexis thought she had the right to keep Kristina away from him. She was his MOB lawyer for god's sake! And the strangest thing of all is that the men act like it's all up to the woman if she keeps a their kid from them. Like Victor just letting hope walk off with Adam. At least Ryan makes little noises about it not all being up to Madison.

This is why I don't believe the soaps act like men have no rights. The women in these stories are repeatedly written as being in the wrong if they ever forget the priority the father is supposed to take - which is, the top priority. Alexis was always written as being wrong and she has been trashed as a mother for years, and Kristina now worships her father. Even the Adam story was turned around to glorify Victor, as the show claimed Adam was screwed up because Victor wasn't in his life, and that was Hope's fault.

The only time a soap will tell a story about a woman who is right to keep a child away is something like AJ on GH, and that was only because Jason and Sonny were the ideal fathers, not because a man wasn't taking the main role in the story.

Edited March 30, 201114 yr by CarlD2

I think if John and Natalie had been married and he had been a father to Liam for six months or more than I could understand Natalie's position better. John would have loved the child, but due to how quickly he found out that didn't happen. That's why her "Liam loves you" stuff falls completely flat.

It doesn't just fall flat to me, it's completely manipulative. I was rolling my eyes when she said that. Soaps really love to shove the idea that biology doesn't matter down our throats, but it does matter. If you have a biological child that you want and you are a fit parent, you have rights, even if you are a male. Jess and Brody had no right to agree that they would raise Ryder "as their own", just like Natalie has no right to act like John is anything more than a potential step dad.

This is why I don't believe the soaps act like men have no rights. The women in these stories are repeatedly written as being in the wrong if they ever forget the priority the father is supposed to take - which is, the top priority. Alexis was always written as being wrong and she has been trashed as a mother for years, and Kristina now worships her father. Even the Adam story was turned around to glorify Victor, as the show claimed Adam was screwed up because Victor wasn't in his life, and that was Hope's fault.

The only time a soap will tell a story about a woman who is right to keep a child away is something like AJ on GH, and that was only because Jason and Sonny were the ideal fathers, not because a man wasn't taking the main role in the story.

You are comparing apples to oranges. I'm not talking about who is written as being right, I'm talking about who is written as having rights. It's a completely different issue.

You are comparing apples to oranges. I'm not talking about who is written as being right, I'm talking about who is written as having rights. It's a completely different issue.

We can agree to disagree, but I don't see why it's a different issue. The stories are almost always written with the man being in the right. That undercuts any story about any rights, because in these types of stories it is rare to end in a mother having most of the power and the father having none. The father will always find some way to become dominant, even if it's in a disgusting and ludicrous situation like what they've done with Ford.

Just now watching today's episode and I'm simply revolted by Ford and his selfishness.

IMO, the writing is on the wall. There is no way Ryder is his kid. I think he's being set up for a huge fall.

We can agree to disagree, but I don't see why it's a different issue. The stories are almost always written with the man being in the right. That undercuts any story about any rights, because in these types of stories it is rare to end in a mother having most of the power and the father having none. The father will always find some way to become dominant, even if it's in a disgusting and ludicrous situation like what they've done with Ford.

Or Todd The Wonder Rapist.

New Robin Strasser Hotline:

212-414-5300

"I'm working so little, but I guess that's the nature of the business. They've gone in another direction. The train has left the station."

"They've done a perfectly marvelous story, trouble for Viki, and they're not making me the person to make the trouble, they gave that to someone else. With all due respect to someone with huge talent and a huge fan following, they threw everything to her. I love her, but it's all about me [laughs]. I don't have anything coming up either."

LMAO! Robin said that someone told her "I haven't heard you talk about anything this way since Jill Farren Phelps"

She says someone (TPTB) told her that there is no more story for her and she lost her luminescence.

New Robin Strasser Hotline:

212-414-5300

"I'm working so little, but I guess that's the nature of the business. They've gone in another direction. The train has left the station."

"They've done a perfectly marvelous story, trouble for Viki, and they're not making me the person to make the trouble, they gave that to someone else. With all due respect to someone with huge talent and a huge fan following, they threw everything to her. I love her, but it's all about me [laughs]. I don't have anything coming up either."

LMAO! Robin said that someone told her "I haven't heard you talk about anything this way since Jill Farren Phelps"

She says someone (TPTB) told her that there is no more story for her and she lost her luminescence.

Waits for her to be called crazy.

Starr and James get WAY too much airtime. We do not need 4 episodes a week of them on MyFace.

Edited March 30, 201114 yr by AlexElizabeth