Y&R: Old Articles

[yrfan1983]

Great summary! I'm at May '96 in my chronological viewing and everything you said tracks to what I've seen.

I will only add that the slow diminishment of the character of Traci Abbott didn't help matters. I see the character in two phases: 80s Traci and 90s Traci. 

80s Traci was a well-written, well-rounded full character that propelled Beth Maitland to YR's first acting Emmy.

90s Traci was a one-note drag, singularly obsessed with winning back Brad's love and haranguing her sister Ashley, who she used to be so close to. Starting around Traci and Brad's second marriage, it became such a chore to watch Traci's scenes, which really pained me as a BethM fan.

Traci IMO was at a real nadir by her '95 return, when she ostensibly comes home to support John's recovery, but proceeds to sniff after Brad and berate Ashley... never mind that Traci has a studly husband Steve waiting at home for her!

I'm not saying there weren't some great moments, like Traci and Lauren's 94 catfight. But it wasn't until her 2001 return, when Traci took on more of a parental role, that I started to enjoy the character again.

[soapfan770]

There were some scenes in early 1993 where Traci was uncharacteristically extremely NASTY to Lauren even making a mockery of Lauren’s situation with her son Scott to the point that Lauren and Brad briefly suspected Traci of being the one who was behind the puzzle blackmail lol. Traci just seemed out of character 1991-1996, and tbh Steve was a dolt, especially after Traci revealed she was divorcing him because he was lost in the head or something?

Although I am surprised Steve and Traci never had kids themselves, they should’ve had at least two and had teen Colleen being jealous or something. But for whatever reason that just wasn’t the case. 

As for Ashley it was clear I think Bell loved the character that he kept on writing for her; but I think bad castings really hampered the storylines. Blade/Rick should have been played by a sexier and more dynamic actor. As for recasting Ashley a third time, nepotism should not have directed the casting. The castings for Adam Hunter and Kurt Costner were questionable too. As was casting Keith Dennison for Jill. I don’t know who Y&R’s casting director was at the time but a lot of the casting choices between 1994-98 were atrocious with a few exceptions like Shemar Moore, Sharon Case, Stafford, and Sandra Nelson etc. 

[kalbir]

@yrfan1983 Since you're watching May 1996, have you gotten to Who Shot Victor and the fallout?

I rewatched some of that storyline recently and there is a Nikki/Christine confrontation at the hospital I had forgotten about. I remember their confrontation at Legal Aid, that scene I haven't found online anywhere.

I still can't believe Bill Bell alluded to a Victor/Christine pairing in 1996. In the primetime episode it was set up as though something was going to happen between Victor and Christine and if it did, I probably would've lost my dinner 

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[yrfan1983]

I just watched that hospital confrontation! 5/24/96. Nikki says to her "what are YOU doing here?!" and I was totally on Nikki's side Christine feels completely shoehorned into the shooting story. It doesn't really track that she would work for Newman Enterprises, much less appear to Victor as a viable romantic option 

Granville Van Dusen... not the most charismatic actor!  Keith always felt like an afterthought.

[kalbir]

@yrfan1983 Nikki even accused Christine of being in love with Victor and also wanting his money. I couldn't believe Nikki would go that far. Christine held her ground though.

[soapfan770]

@yrfan1983 @kalbir I remember that scene originally and it was on YouTube several years back about Nikki’s confrontation with Christine which of course was much ado about nothing. Christine was already muddled deep into the Paul and Danny if anything her friendship with Victor and being kidnapped by Mari Jo gave her something different to do beside the get stalked by Phyllis that week lol. 
 

Victor and Nikki stories were weird during this period. Victor and Hope’s initial split and then reconcile was too much lol. Then we had silly crap like Victor being too late to stop Josh & Nikki and then Nikki and Hope being too late stop Victor & Diane from marrying and there was suspense & anguish with each one ceremony….completely unnecessary lol.

[kalbir]

@soapfan770Are you talking about the Legal Aid confrontation? The background for that confrontation is Nikki was outside Victor's office and witnessed Victor comforting Christine over Christine's broken engagement to Paul. Nikki in her mid-1990s snooty lady of the manor peak then proceeds to saunter over to Legal Aid and puts Christine on blast for getting too close to Victor. At least that's what I remember. If only that scene would surface again.

[Planet Soap]

Not sure if this is posted on here ready put some one just put Tricia raping Victor up again on YouTube. It feels strange seeing Victor in a vulnerable position like this, especially at the hands of a woman.

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RIP Jerry Douglas who should have never been killer off. I get a kick out of how aggressive he was with Jill during the original divorce storyline. He was really terrible at picking wives: Dina, Jill, Gloria. Jessica was probably his best choice.

 

Edited December 1, 2021 by ironlion

[SoapDope]

I always thought they should have paired Traci's daughter Colleen with Lauren's son Scotty for a future Traci/Lauren feud. Another idea would have had Lauren go after Steve at some point.

 

 

[Paul Raven]

These discussions about the storylines for the Abbotts and others in the mid 90's speak to the difficulty that writers (Bill Bell obviously included) have in providing satisfying stories for frontburner characters after about 10-15 years.

Bill never really faced this problem before as he was gone from ATWT by its 9th anni (did he start in 58?) and Days by 76? after 10 years.

He didn't have to deal with the aftermath resolution of the Bill/Laura/Mickey and Doug/Julie stories or the challenge of bringing equally compelling stories to the forefront. As we saw succeeding writers had difficulty with that.

And at Y&R, by eliminating the Brooks and Fosters , he didn't have to follow through with writing those characters for another decade or more.

Even Irna Phillips departed ATWT after 14 years and when she returned she eliminated the Stewart family as obviously she felt constricted and more inspired by other characters. The only main character that had any longevity at that point were Bob and Lisa.

Agnes Nixon did pretty much the same thing at AMC after 10 years or so.The Martin children, Phil,Linc and Kelly were all dropped. Only Chuck and Erica remained from the original concept.

So maybe Bill should have made some hard decisions around this time...

What story/character decisions might have benefitted the show moving forward??

[will81]

That is interesting and I never thought about it like that. I do believe you are right that Bell never spent 10+ years with a show before Y&R and I guess the Brooks/Fosters were gone just as Y&R turned 10.

In saying that, I would also say he made some odd moves. Ignoring Ashey/Brad and going for Blade/Ashley was a mistake. Bell seemed to be more interested in keeping Michael Tylo around rather than either recasting or ditching the character. Blade never worked, in large part because Bell never seemed to know what to do with him and Michael kinda of floundered. His chem with Brenda was okay, but not as scorching as Brenda and Don Diamont. I would have even been more than okay with another Nikki/Ashley rivalry, this time over Brad.

I did a post previously on my story ideas for Luan and her family. Make Luan a Dominique Devereaux (Dynasty) type against Jill's Alexis and let the fur fly in their quest for John. Make Mai slightly older and replace Amy with Mai, thus connecting the Abbotts (assuming Luan and John marry) to the Newman's story when Matt was shot and pit Jack and Keemo against each other for Mari-Jo. Let Jill loose and give her a red hot romance. I think Jill and Silva worked well, but it was so sporadic and unsatisfying. They should have gone with that romance full time. 

In saying that The Abbotts were not the only issue back then. I can't say I cared much for the Vikki/Ryan/Nina/Cole snooze fest and recasting Nathan with an actor ten years younger, giving him the Maxwell Sheffield special and placing him in a mid life crises affair was silly.

As a side note: None of Jill's pairings were great after John except Sean, and that ended before it began. Alden and or Smith then paired her with Larry Warton for some strange reason and her two big stories when she was with him were "Who stole my lighter" and "Let's train for a marathon" Her character was dead by that point. I know that was post Bell but I really hate what they did to her. 

I think there were options, but different choices were made. I think Phyllis and her story worked and I think outside of Adam Lazzare-White, the Winters/Hastings were still great to watch. The Newmans were doing well too, but I remember 1996 feeling such a chore to get through and I recently tried re-watching eps from that year and it is still a chore. 

[Paul Raven]

Great post -  much food for thought.

So you changed Luan to an old affair with John and made Keemo Jacks half brother? Definitely think that would have worked better.

Luan needed to be more than stereotyped maiden who died a noble death. That story had zero consequences apart from having Jack notch up another marriage and gain a son that never returned.

Dina returning also would be a great addition to the mix. 

You're right, Blade was a terrible character. At the very least, there was no need for him to marry Ashley as that was third time for her in 10 years. The obsession with marriage was ruinous in the long term. Blade could have been a serious relationship w/o marriage. It would have been quite natural for Ashley to be a little reluctant to wed after two trips to the altar already.

When Brenda left, maybe that was the time to rest Ashley rather than hiring Shari. Wait until Eileen returned and give the character a rest as the Cole/Ashley marriage was a dud.

Around mid 90's maybe was a good time for Patty to return. A lot of possibilities there.

She could want revenge on Jack and fall in love again. Danny could become involved with her again. That would give the Williams family more prominence.

How about Steve Williams returning? He had been involved with Jill and that could be explored. Or he could hook up with Ashley and re-ignite the Williams/Abbott grudges.

Matt Miller coming back could provide lots of drama for the Newmans as he was enamored of Nikki and had been close to Ashley.

I wonder why Bill didn't make use of those characters and the history that was there instead of trying to new characters that didn't work.

 

 

[will81]

Yeah I think Luan worked better with John. I agree, she needed to have more spark as a character too. Luan was too impossibly perfect, where else could the show take her but six feet under. Much like Jessica, those impossibly sweet characters rarely last (well except Cricket)

Honestly I would have given up Phyllis for Patty returning in 94. It is clear in 96 or so when Bell toyed with her return that they were setting her up to be a bit unstable, at least it seemed that way to me. Too bad they didn't decide to bring her back earlier and have her take Phyllis' place. Otherwise bring her back in 96 and yeah having Jack and Patty reunite with her wanting revenge and having Ashley with Steve Williams would have also been great. This could have resulted in a return to the Diane/Jack/Patty situation.

Otherwise yes I agree, Ashley should have been left in Paris. What did they really do with her between 96 - 99? Not much. 

Maybe Matt and Nikki, instead of Brad and Nikki? Possibly Veronica was an ex of Matt's and Matt and Nikki play out the Josh Landers story. Maybe Matt struck it rich while he was away. Also Veronica could have easily left Nikki for dead and taken Matt and we never see him again, but it keeps the door open for a possible return.

Edited November 15, 2021 by will81

[Forever8]

I would've loved it if Colleen and Scotty became a couple too, with Lauren and Traci going back and forth. Not to mention, Lauren formed a close bond with Colleen when Traci wasn't around either. 

 

Steve and Traci should've had a kid together. It would've given the Abbott's another family member. Perhaps Steve didn't want Colleen around his and Traci's kid because he began to see her as a bad influence on Johnny or Samantha. (making up names) 

[DramatistDreamer]

The idea of Colleen and Scotty dating might have been a good one if they dated briefly during a time when there was still strong dislike between Traci and Lauren but that has since been resolved and neither character has had the benefit of strong writing in recent years to hope to revive that history- talk about sailed ships.

The other unfortunate aspect of that is how underwritten Scotty has been written as an adult, to the point of neglect. Colleen, at least is a relatively well developed character (by today's standards) to be utilized without too much work but the recent characterization of Scotty is a mess and speaks to how poorly developed that generation of legacy characters truly are.