Yes. 100%.

Listen, we dont need to be treated like idiots and talked down to, but if that was the story then they missed not only a huge beat, but the story itself.

+1

Not challenging you--really. But I really want to know my answer to the question above.

You SAW Nick profoundly damaged (both by Cassie's death...and by his 'doormat' treatment by Victor). Even if the writers aren't saying it explicitly everyday ('oooh, Nick, you're so damaged'), why do you not see this as part of the backstory/subtext that informs Nick's current choices? I'm really interested in this. In all other literature/drama, we certainly wouldn't ignore the backstory. Why--just because the writers aren't signalling it--do we assume the backstory isn't important here?

I'm just very interested in the interpretive filter that folks are bringing to their soaps.

Nick's motivations are hardly ever delved into. All we've known for the better part of a 4 years is that he's "torn" between two women who will degrade themselves to "win" him.

I think he's past using Sharon for sex as a mechanism to deal with Cassie and their broken marriage. He genuinely loves Sharon, whether any of the Phick fanbois and fangurls want to admit it, that's why he can't shake her out of his system. If Cassie didn't die and Nick and Sharon were divorced and separated, it would be the same way. He might love Phyllis too, but obviously it does not cut as deep if he's always running to Sharon and constantly trying to be her "hero."

We never see Nick's mental process, his dialogue and the way he comes off is as one big frat boy. There's no character writing on Y&R anymore, it's all ambiguous plot writing.

And if we're to care about this supposed backstory, why isn't it touched upon? The way it looks to most people is that Nick and Sharon use Cassie's death as a pathetic excuse to f.uck.

We never see any real conversations on this show anymore where characters eliminate some of their hidden motivations and tendencies. In the old days, the most gripping part about Y&R would be conversations between characters, even when nothing HUGE was happening.

The problem with the backstory is that it can vanish on a whim no matter how we use it to interpret.

For instance, last year we learned that Sharon had been stealing since she was a teenager, and that her breakdown was caused by Brad's death. Then we learned her breakdown was actually about Cassie's death, not about her teenage problems or Brad, and that everything would be better if she had a baby. Then we learned that she didn't need the baby after all.

Are we supposed to apply any of our knowledge of her past to this?

Or with Billy. The people who run this show now truly do seem to believe that Billy barely knew his father, Billy was dumped at birth by Jill and grew up all alone, with only the Abbotts as distant relations. This flies in the face of his actual history on the show. So how can we think about Billy's backstory when the show has rewritten all of it anyway?

Yep.

Exactly.

If Jana does die maybe Kevin will marry Mac like in Billy's nightmare.

Ew.

Neil has enough time to babysit Lily Of The Valley & her pet ostrich, comfort Ashley & meet with Giggly Heffa but not enough to be a businessman.

Whatever Maria.

Carl and Turner already said it better than I ever could.

Bottom line is that the writers do not know what they want/write and Morrow just does not play any subtext anymore. I am willing to believe that he still deeply and truly loves Sharon, and I can see that as motivation for his actions because the writing has, in some ways, supported that. BUT, that love is used to excuse endless back and forths between Sharon and Nick, lots of gratuitous sex, WTD with 100 candidates, and just cheap, tacky stuff.

Edited February 3, 201015 yr by YRBB

Nick's motivations are hardly ever delved into. All we've known for the better part of a 4 years is that he's "torn" between two women who will degrade themselves to "win" him.

I think he's past using Sharon for sex as a mechanism to deal with Cassie and their broken marriage. He genuinely loves Sharon, whether any of the Phick fanbois and fangurls want to admit it, that's why he can't shake her out of his system. If Cassie didn't die and Nick and Sharon were divorced and separated, it would be the same way. He might love Phyllis too, but obviously it does not cut as deep if he's always running to Sharon and constantly trying to be her "hero."

We never see Nick's mental process, his dialogue and the way he comes off is as one big frat boy. There's no character writing on Y&R anymore, it's all ambiguous plot writing.

Yep.

TPTB & their agendas.

We never see any real conversations on this show anymore where characters eliminate some of their hidden motivations and tendencies. In the old days, the most gripping part about Y&R would be conversations between characters, even when nothing HUGE was happening.

Who needs character motivation when there's sweeps paced stunts?

Bottom line is that the writers do not know what they want/write and Morrow just does not play any subtext anymore.

Morrow is EXTREMELY lazy.

Nick is NOT Nick like Lauren is NOT Lauren.

I am willing to believe that he still deeply and truly loves Sharon, and I can see that as motivation for his actions because the writing has, in some ways, supported that. BUT, that love is used to excuse endless back and forths between Sharon and Nick, lots of gratuitous sex, WTD with 100 candidates, and just cheap, tacky stuff.

TPTB wanted their three way WTD so bad they equated Nick's feelings for Sharon with Jack's & Billy's.

HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAATE.

Neil has enough time to babysit Lily Of The Valley & her pet ostrich, comfort Ashley & meet with Giggly Heffa but not enough to be a businessman.

Whatever Maria.

He has time when they need to blame him for bad decisions.

Neil has enough time to babysit Lily Of The Valley & her pet ostrich, comfort Ashley & meet with Giggly Heffa but not enough to be a businessman.

Whatever Maria.

It's strange to see Neil talk to Phyllis after what happened with Dru and the cliff. I'm sorry but Phyllis should not be the one to find out about Adam and his misdeeds. That should be Ashley and Sharon. Phyllis is out of place in this storyline.

Morrow is EXTREMELY lazy.

Nick is NOT Nick like Lauren is NOT Lauren.

Exactly. Morrow has let this show down just like the writers have.

TPTB wanted their three way WTD so bad they equated Nick's feelings for Sharon with Jack's & Billy's.

HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAATE.

Horrid. Just bottom of the barrel.

Um, no more triangles...

This awful writing team doesn't know how to write them or when to stop them.

Especially when Mac, who would be at the center of it, has been directionless as a character with no personality and purpose since she came back.

Mac has not been a defined character with any layers since she was brought back, and Clementine has no chemistry with Rikkart. She has some spark with Luckinbill, but the girl DOES NOT EXUDE ANY SEXUAL CHEMISTRY. This is why they'll never see her as any romantic lead and this is they excuse they'll use to marginalize her further.

Well, putting Mac in a front burner story and DEFINING her through her behavior with JT...and possibly in a triangle...would be a way to fix that. Just sayin'....

The problem with the backstory is that it can vanish on a whim no matter how we use it to interpret.

For instance, last year we learned that Sharon had been stealing since she was a teenager, and that her breakdown was caused by Brad's death. Then we learned her breakdown was actually about Cassie's death, not about her teenage problems or Brad, and that everything would be better if she had a baby. Then we learned that she didn't need the baby after all.

Are we supposed to apply any of our knowledge of her past to this?

Or with Billy. The people who run this show now truly do seem to believe that Billy barely knew his father, Billy was dumped at birth by Jill and grew up all alone, with only the Abbotts as distant relations. This flies in the face of his actual history on the show. So how can we think about Billy's backstory when the show has rewritten all of it anyway?

So, I know the Sharon backstory bothers you, . It's not quite as egregious as Brad's Nazi backstory. But the two share a commonality (and I know I'm risking bricks for saying something good about the start of Brad's last big story): They filled in blanks...they didn't contradict or erase things we knew to be true. Indeed, Sharon's sluttery this last year plays well with her Diego and Cameron affairs. (Now, Brad's story was worse...because he lived openly...he didn't seem to be afraid of Nazis until LML made him Jewish).

I have zero problem with these 'backfill retcons' UNLESS THEY CONTRADICT WHAT WE PREVIOUSLY LEARNED. A perfect example of that is bringing P3 back from the dead. That was patently ridiculous on every level--and "unnecessary".

As a side note, I was irritated with LML when she used to script all these "childhood memories" for Nick and Victoria. It was actually nice to deepen that relationship...but we SAW those kids. They didn't overlap much, and both got shipped off to boarding school and Nick NEVER lived with his dad. That kind of retcon bothered me more, because it contradicted what we watched.

Sharon's stuff--from before we met her--not so much.

He has time when they need to blame him for bad decisions.

And NICK is responsible for Grambo & Adam's plan.

UGH.

It's strange to see Neil talk to Phyllis after what happened with Dru and the cliff.

EXACTLY.

I'm sorry but Phyllis should not be the one to find out about Adam and his misdeeds. That should be Ashley and Sharon. Phyllis is out of place in this storyline.

Giggly Heffa like Grambo must NEVER lose.

It's strange to see Neil talk to Phyllis after what happened with Dru and the cliff. I'm sorry but Phyllis should not be the one to find out about Adam and his misdeeds. That should be Ashley and Sharon. Phyllis is out of place in this storyline.

Yeah! That is an important oversight, and they do it all the time. For "killing" Dru, nobody from the Winters clan or Sharon should ever give Phyllis a moment of kindness.

Well, putting Mac in a front burner story and DEFINING her through her behavior with JT...and possibly in a triangle...would be a way to fix that. Just sayin'....

No it wouldn't, because like she's been an extension of Billy since she came back, she'll be an extension of JT/Kevin with no personality or life of her own without the longing for a man.

Why does Mac need to be defined through her behaviour with a man? Isn't there enough misogyny on this show?

And not like these writers ever think outside of the box, you give them way too much credit.

We need to cool this though, NO WAY IN HELL will this regime be giving JT and Mac a FRONTBURNER story, they're not the favourites of this regime.

Edited February 3, 201015 yr by Y&RWorldTurner

And NICK is responsible for Grambo & Adam's plan.

UGH.

That pisses me off so badly. This show has asked me to suspense my disbelief many times ( P3 coming back from the dead and chipmunks), but this is one thing that I can't accept. Nick is not smart enough to outwit Tucker. We have to see how Nick is the good son compared to Adam.