On 1/4/2018 at 12:08 AM, vetsoapfan said:

 

ITA. The series was seriously crippled by 1984, and limped through the 1980s on life support. It rebounded with the return of Roger and Holly, and much better writing, in 1989, and then had its last hurrah for the next few years. After they stupidly killed the heart of the show (Maureen Bauer) and Nancy Curlee left, TGL 's fate was sealed. Still, TGL was TGL from 1937 to 1983, and then again from about 1989 to 1994, so we had a good, long ride.

 

How the show staggered along for its final 15 years, I'll never understand.

 

I completely agree. It was amazing how much the show kept getting worse and worse in 1984. By the time 1985 came around, I completely stopped watching. I returned in 1988 once Maureen Garrett came back as Holly and was hooked once it was confirmed that Roger would be brought back from the dead. By 1995, I couldn't watch it anymore.

 

16 hours ago, Faulkner said:

For me, 1997 was sort of a strange outlier. You had Annie's awesome reign of terror, which almost by necessity couldn't be maintained. (They tried disastrously with Signy Coleman.) You had the accidental chemistry of Beth Ehlers and Grant Aleksander (before Beth Chamberlin came in and ate the show and Harley became the humorless harpy she was from then on). Abby and Rick could have re-ignited the Bauers, but again, they couldn't figure out how to build on it or simply didn't want to. For a moment, they presented us with shiny objects that masked deeper problems in the show in hindsight. And then shortly thereafter was Ben Warren, all Cassie all the time, the San Cristobal crew, the mob, Clone Reva, the list goes on, and everything went to hell.

 

I'm glad you brought this up. I had brief hope for the show at the beginning in 1997 for the reasons you stated above, especially when they started the year out by having a celebration for the 60th Anniversary (and finally brought back Mike Bauer!!!).

 

21 hours ago, vetsoapfan said:

 

I originally thought that was Joe Roberts. I'm glad you were here to clarify.

 

Not a problem! You've helped clarify a ton of items for me concerning TGL over the course of this thread, it was the least I could do .

35 minutes ago, zanereed said:

 

I completely agree. It was amazing how much the show kept getting worse and worse in 1984. By the time 1985 came around, I completely stopped watching. I returned in 1988 once Maureen Garrett came back as Holly and was hooked once it was confirmed that Roger would be brought back from the dead. By 1995, I couldn't watch it anymore.

 

 

I'm glad you brought this up. I had brief hope for the show at the beginning in 1997 for the reasons you stated above, especially when they started the year out by having a celebration for the 60th Anniversary (and finally brought back Mike Bauer!!!).

 

 

Not a problem! You've helped clarify a ton of items for me concerning TGL over the course of this thread, it was the least I could do .

 

 

So, Holly returned in 1988 and then Roger popped up in 1989? I was trying to remember for sure. I know I was tentatively hopeful about the show returning to its roots when I first saw Holly again, and then spastic with joy when Roger appeared. I just wish we had had Mart Hulswit playing Ed Bauer at the time. Then the show really would have felt like itself again.

 

After the mass slaughter of characters, I had a hard time stomaching what was passing for TGL throughout 1985, 86, and 87. 

IMO, GL's true savior in 1989 was Robert Calhoun, who had joined the show as EP after working at ATWT.  Just as he had done at his previous gig, Calhoun inaugurated an amazing, new "golden era" at GL, promoting Nancy Curlee to Co-HW and recommitting to the show's decades of rich history with the returns of Maureen Garrett and Michael Zaslow.  For the first time since the first year of Pam Long's first run as HW, GL, as a whole, felt reinvigorated -- and I say that as someone who enjoyed the show throughout the '80's.

 

Similarly, GL felt as reinvigorated in 1997, even if the quality wasn't as high as it had been during the peak years of Nancy Curlee's HW'ing stint.  It's just too bad even THAT run couldn't be sustained for very long.

Edited January 5, 20187 yr by Khan

To this day, Calhoun never gets the credit for his work at ATWT or GL. His ATWT is overshadowed by praise for Marland (and Marland's work was not as strong with Laurence Caso as EP, IMO), and he's overlooked for his GL contributions because JFP ended taking a lot of credit for things he help set in motion.  

Edited January 5, 20187 yr by BetterForgotten

I, for one, revere Calhoun and am grateful for the fine work he did on ATWT and TGL. We needed more EPs like him and fewer like JFP.

31 minutes ago, BetterForgotten said:

To this day, Calhoun never gets the credit for his work at ATWT or GL. His ATWT is overshadowed by praise for Marland (and Marland's work was not as strong with Laurence Caso as EP, IMO), and he's overlooked for his GL contributions because JFP ended taking a lot of credit for things he help set in motion.  

 

Calhoun gets credit from me.  I consider them to be a team.

Yes, Marland was out in front but perhaps Calhoun also preferred it that way.  In most forms of media entertainment the EP wasn't really out in front, that's a relatively contemporary phenomenon (and it hasn't been for the better IMHO).

Perhaps Calhoun was old-school in that particular way.

5 hours ago, Khan said:

IMO, GL's true savior in 1989 was Robert Calhoun

 

4 hours ago, BetterForgotten said:

To this day, Calhoun never gets the credit for his work at ATWT or GL. His ATWT is overshadowed by praise for Marland (and Marland's work was not as strong with Laurence Caso as EP, IMO), and he's overlooked for his GL contributions because JFP ended taking a lot of credit for things he help set in motion.  

 

4 hours ago, vetsoapfan said:

I, for one, revere Calhoun and am grateful for the fine work he did on ATWT and TGL. We needed more EPs like him and fewer like JFP.

 

4 hours ago, DramatistDreamer said:

Calhoun gets credit from me. 

 

Agree with all of this. If P&G were the ones behind replacing Robert Calhoun w/ JFP, then that was one of the worst decisions they ever made. Yes, JFP's first year saw a ratings increase, but as we all know she did long term damage that GL never really recovered from.

 

 

Calhoun likely retired because he was sick of network/corporate interference. I know Nancy Curlee once said he fought/went to bat for her on numerous occasions, perhaps he just got sick of fighting for his work. 

Holy sh!t - this week was the 25th anniversary of Maureen finding out about Ed/Lillian and the superbly written/acted confrontation scenes with Mo/Lillian in the Bauer kitchen (this Thursday will be the actual 25th anniversary of Maureen's death).

 

"You have reduced us to a ridiculous suburban joke and I WILL NEVER FORGIVE YOU FOR THIS!" will live with me forever. Bravo to Courtney Simon for the dialogue. 

 

 

Edited January 6, 20187 yr by BetterForgotten

That was a great scene. Remember those days when soaps actually used music effectively? Guess that was one skill JFP had. You never could tell watching her Y&R.

 

Sad to know it was all downhill for GL from there, but the entirety of Springfield mourned Maureen. It's different from these days when people on soaps die for easy shock value and are forgotten within weeks. I recall how angry I was when Nadine was killed by Brent Lawrence, and she was treated like a day player.

 

They gave Maureen the closing credits the day she died. Soaps only usually do that sort of thing when actors pass away in real life.

 

 

Edited January 7, 20187 yr by Faulkner

5 hours ago, Faulkner said:

That was a great scene. Remember those days when soaps actually used music effectively? Guess that was one skill JFP had. You never could tell watching her Y&R.

 

Sad to know it was all downhill for GL from there, but the entirety of Springfield mourned Maureen. It's different from these days when people on soaps die for easy shock value and are forgotten within weeks. I recall how angry I was when Nadine was killed by Brent Lawrence, and she was treated like a day player.

 

They gave Maureen the closing credits the day she died. Soaps only usually do that sort of thing when actors pass away in real life.

 

 

It's almost as if the show admitted even then that this was going to be a huge void that never was filled.

Maureen's death was such a long-term tragedy and I wish that more story would have come out of it so it didn't seem like such a waste, but damn was that week of shows brilliant. Knowing what came after this, maybe it was better for Maureen to go out this way. Ghost Maureen propping up Danny and Michelle was bad enough. 

 

Also, I don't think Victor Miller and Michael Conforti get enough credit for the uptick in quality in 1997. Besides the whole Amanda reveal, early 1997 was really quite good. Shame it didn't last very long. 

Maureen's death was what got the attention but JFP made many changes in the show in 1992 and 1993 and I don't think any of them were for the better. Killing Maureen and bringing in Buzz to smack his damn gum and use some bizarre hybrid accent told me most of what I needed to know about what GL was becoming.

2018 will also have two other sad GL-related anniversaries: May 2 will be 10 years since Beverlee McKinsey passed away, and December 6 will be 20 years since Michael Zaslow passed away.

On 08/01/2018 at 5:28 PM, DRW50 said:

Maureen's death was what got the attention but JFP made many changes in the show in 1992 and 1993 and I don't think any of them were for the better. Killing Maureen and bringing in Buzz to smack his damn gum and use some bizarre hybrid accent told me most of what I needed to know about what GL was becoming.

 

Buzz: UGH. Firing Ellen Parker as Maureen Bauer to free up money to pay for Justin Deas as Buzz (or so the rumor goes) is akin to axing Olivia Walton and replacing her on The Waltons with Zak Dingle.

Edited January 10, 20187 yr by vetsoapfan