Although, one thing about Y&R right now is that it's not at all that kid friendly. That's really struck me over the last week. Some people say kids should never watch soaps, but even now the audience is filled with stay at home moms. Thank god for DVR's because there is no explaining the bed hopping that is going on right now. It's really pretty scandalous for daytime. On the upside explaining gay characters in bed doesn't seem like the challenge to me that it once did.

IMO, viewers with kids will watch a gay storyline. Y&R viewers also watch Grey's Anatomy, House, ER, Will & Grace, etc. I do think the challenge with gay characters is that unless you have at least three on canvas, you are limited story-wise. I suspect that most viewers, especially straight ones, will roll their eyes if a character changes his or her sexuality over night. A story like Otalia takes a long long time to build and so far they've barely kissed [i am a couple weeks behind so I could have missed something]. Y&R is all about musical beds, which isn't really good for straight or gay romances. IMO, it's a lot easier to explain Nuke to a child viewer than the Quad.

Now, a dead baby... I don't want to get political at all [and I'm definitely a liberal feminist] but a recent gallup poll showed most American self-identified as pro-life. Take into account that soap viewers are allegedly more conservative and you can imagine how viewers with kids might feel about this story.

IMO, it's a lot easier to explain Nuke to a child viewer than the Quad.

It is. There really is no good way to explain the quad. Except to say this is something that bad, selfish people do when they feel sorry for themselves and have no self respect. Personally, I wouldn't even try to explain this horrible mess to anyone under 12.

I think for Y&R, in particular, the problem is the lead men. Victor, Jack...these are not Alan Alda men.

So, it is sort of in their nature that they subjugate their women...use and abuse them...and they have since the early 80s.

Thus, for this show, the "weak women" in the orbit of the show's two leading men is nothing new.

I think Jack has become more of an Alan Alda man over the years. Now he cries more than half the women on the show. Y&R has had domineering men for a long time but the big difference now, in my eyes, is the women have no identity of their own. Viewers used to be able to see how Ashley, or Nikki, or Victoria would react, and how their own decisions would shape Victor, or Jack, or other men in their lives. That doesn't happen now.

cara mia

A company that specializes in stem-cell research. I never thought I would say this but poor Victor. Even he doesn't deserve Adam for a son. And that's part of the problem with the writing. Would Adam Wilson really end up being a worse person than Victor Newman? I guess absolute Harvard corrupts absolutely.

I thought that was part of the point of the story starting from last year. Poor Victor was set up by Adam over the diaries. Now this with the gaslighting. I think viewers may not have had the sympathy for Victor which the show anticipated, so suddenly we have this stem cell company, which I'd say is out of character for the Victor of today (he'd just tell Adam to deal with his blindness, show some backbone, then maybe Victor would help).

Julijams

Although, one thing about Y&R right now is that it's not at all that kid friendly.

When I watched soaps as a kid, what I remember most were the distraught heroines and the crazy villains. Everything on Y&R now is very much in that venue, so I do wonder if they may end having some appeal to younger viewers. Someone like Mary Jane, who struggles to control herself and feels like everyone is out to get her, who struggles not to lash out -- that's the way a lot of younger people feel.

My soap love as a kid was Erica Kane. Conversely, I also loved "good girls" Brooke English and Maria Santos. You need both sides of the equation. The problem with Phyllis vs. Sharon is that they are both pathetic whiny nutcases.

Carl, I see your point about creating sympathy for Victor. And I did feel bad for Vashely talking to the dead baby. Though as long as CE's playing Adam, that's the character I am rooting for despite his monstrosity. One major silver lining with the recast I think will be Ashley becoming the clear & undisputed center of sympathy in this story, and that will be good, especially when she has be inevitable breakdown upon learning the truth. It will be a relief to just hate Adam and look forward to his comeuppance instead of worrying about him getting away with it.

I'm not sure if I can see Ashley ever being the center of the story, I think it's always going to be about how Adam uses people and how this hurts Victor, but maybe I'm just looking at this from too jaded a perspective. I still think this story would have worked better with Sabrina, or a Sabrina/Adam relationship.

I'll never be able to care about Adam again after this story, but I don't know if I can ever hate him. I'll just remember the potential which was lost.

When I started watching soaps I was drawn to over the top, complex women, like Lucinda and Barbara on ATWT, as well as more traditional matriarch figures, like Maureen Bauer on GL. Or, on the Bell soaps, Nikki, Jill, Sally Spectra. I didn't flinch at the more adult stories because I didn't know what they were representing. It's probably a good thing that the AMC or GH of the last decade weren't around then, I can see kids being traumatized by those shows.

MJ has truly lost her mind, but how hot was Stacy in those jeans...wow. MJ and JT? I'm intrigued..

So far I've loved the Adam story, but now I'm confused...How exactly is he going to manage to keep Ashley thinking she's got a baby in there? Won't that baby bumb eventually go away or what? I'm not really sure what happens in a miscarriage...Again..Nikki must stay on the canvas.

The only thing I can say about Victoria in this episode was that I loved watching crates fall on her in the previews?...Hopefully we get what her 3rd coma?

MJ has truly lost her mind, but how hot was Stacy in those jeans...wow. MJ and JT? I'm intrigued..

So far I've loved the Adam story, but now I'm confused...How exactly is he going to manage to keep Ashley thinking she's got a baby in there? Won't that baby bumb eventually go away or what? I'm not really sure what happens in a miscarriage...Again..Nikki must stay on the canvas.

The only thing I can say about Victoria in this episode was that I loved watching crates fall on her in the previews?...Hopefully we get what her 3rd coma?

You mean she isn't presently in a coma?

The only thing enticing me to watch today even just a bit is the fact that Chloe, Nina, Katherine, MJ, PAUL and Billy are on currently these characters stilll make sense to me but I'm sure that won't be for long.

Edited June 10, 200916 yr by classicmoment

Finally someone gives Billy a taste! Go Chloe! I wanna see someone bite his head off for the entire episode.

God I'm loving EH more and more especially with the added depths to Chloe. Loved that scene between her and BM and then her and JC.

double.

Edited June 10, 200916 yr by detroitpiston

OMG! A bunch of crates fell on Wannabebitchtoria's stunt double!

Seriously, MAB needs to stop using this show to take care of her art fetish.

Ugh, go away Thom Bierdz

Edited June 10, 200916 yr by detroitpiston

Ugh, go away Thom Bierdz

BITE YOUR TONGUE!

OMG self respect!!!!! What a novelty in Genoa City. It's too bad 90% of the women should use K as a sponsor. Damn, what a shame.

Can she remind Victoria of the brains she had when she ran a multi-billion dollar conglomerate for years and didn't make rash decisions based on the "principles" of her dead friend?

I think for Y&R, in particular, the problem is the lead men. Victor, Jack...these are not Alan Alda men.

So, it is sort of in their nature that they subjugate their women...use and abuse them...and they have since the early 80s.

Thus, for this show, the "weak women" in the orbit of the show's two leading men is nothing new.

I agree, the absence of men like Brock, John Abbott, and Stuart Brooks skew the show toward misogynistic.

I completely agree with all that. It's too bad that no one will approve a new daytime project because I think if some new soaps could start up without the built in conservative audience some of these issues could be addressed better. I think the conservative nature of the core soap watchers is part of what's killing the genre. Not because being conservative is bad, but because I think many people want something more edgy.

Although, one thing about Y&R right now is that it's not at all that kid friendly. That's really struck me over the last week. Some people say kids should never watch soaps, but even now the audience is filled with stay at home moms. Thank god for DVR's because there is no explaining the bed hopping that is going on right now. It's really pretty scandalous for daytime. On the upside explaining gay characters in bed doesn't seem like the challenge to me that it once did.

Religious conservatives DO make up a large number of daytime viewers, for two reasons:

1: More likely to be stay at home moms

2: Soaps are a way for them to live vicariously through the characters, fantasize about all the immoral things they won't dare do in real life.

They may say they don't want gay characters and bed hopping, but they secretly love it.