The Politics Thread

[OzFrog]

Oh this has been a s**tshow over here in the UK for the past few days. Basically one of the Tory MPs was called out by the Standards committee for “egregious paid advocacy” - basically getting paid by private companies by using his MP credentials - and was facing a 30-day suspension from Parliament.

But instead of taking in on the chin and copping it, the whole Tory government passed a motion to not only amend the suspension but to throw out the whole Standards committee and process, to the point where Boris Johnson essentially forced his MPs to vote with the motion. It caused such a ruckus in the media and online that the government had to fully backtrack the following day.

And the worst thing is, the MP who was implicated ended up resigning anyway as a result of the whole debacle!

This article explains it well: https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/nov/04/the-guardian-view-on-the-paterson-case-enough-is-enough?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

Edited November 6, 2021 by OzFrog

[Vee]

I don't think they can on Afghanistan, bc the public doesn't buy it. I do think the public is often fickle, which is part of what led to the VA Governor's race and what often leads to brutal turnover against the incumbent in most midterms. But not always. I think what will matter a year from now is a big open question, but I do think this bill - and BBB - will have an impact with the base, among other things, as well as trickling down (haha) to the squishy middle for other advantages. There's so much to do between then and now that I am not going to assume anything, even though the media is absolutely gagging to see a revitalized, 'sensible' GOP run rampant.

[amybrickwallace]

There's an oxymoron for sure!

[dragonflies]

 

[amybrickwallace]

I wish I could be enthusiastic about this. Steve Bannon is still walking around free, isn't he?

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[Max]

 

I actually agree that Tuesday's election results don't necessarily spell doom for the Democrats in 2022. That said, the result in New Jersey was horrendous for the Dems. While a win is a win, the fact of the matter is that Phil Murphy won a very close race against a little known (and underfunded) opponent in a state with over one million more registered Democrats than Republicans. IMO, the result in New Jersey is a lot more embarrassing for Democrats than Virginia considering the former state is much bluer than the latter. (I also realize that Murphy defied the historical "curse" in becoming the first Democratic New Jersey governor to win re-election since 1977, but it's also important to consider that the state is more Democratic than when Jon Corzine lost re-election in 2009 and a lot more Democratic than when Jim Florio lost in 1993.)

And once again, we have another election in which the polling was absolute garbage. The final Real Clear Politics polling average gave Murphy a 7.8% lead, while the "respected" Monmouth University poll had Murphy up 11 points. Given the supposed "hopelessness" of the race, part of me figured that showing up to vote for Republican Jack Ciattarelli was a total waste of time. But now, I'm so glad I cast that vote for Ciattarelli, as I feel that my vote really meant something in spite of the fact that Murphy still won.

Edited November 6, 2021 by Max

[DramatistDreamer]

Thanks for the summary, @OzFrog. From the article I read this morning, I gathered that it was an ethics violation but your summary clarified matters.

[I Am A Swede]

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That's all

[Ponds]

I have to ask...why do Democrats NOT turn out for off year elections?  I have voted in every year since I turned 21 (that was the age limit then) and can't conceive anyone NOT wanting to vote.

[JaneAusten]

Good Question but they did when Trump was in office. One thing FEAR. The GOP keeps their base in a perpetual state of fear - 24 by 7 365 days a year. Notice how democrats did turn out when Trump was in office in all elections. FEAR.  

IMO January 6th needs to be focused on a lot more. They need to be talking about it regularly and the danger the GOP is to our democracy. The fact that republicans don't believe in it anymore and keep pounding it EVERY DAY. Thats what the GOP has done for 40 years. Willie Horton, Welfare Queens, Immigrants an array of people they have brainwashed their followers in to fear. Now they have moved it to democrats as the enemy not just opponents. Im shocked we as of yet haven't seen more attacks and shootings this year.

[OzFrog]

The situation is not all that great here unfortunately… The PM continually shows traits of T***p every day.

[Ponds]

I have to totally agree with you!

[JaneAusten]

Polling has been problematic for a while across the board. 

Last thing I read was democratic turnout in NJ was down.  As I mentioned to someone else, democrats sadly don't turn out generally as well because that party doesn't work to keep it's base in a constant state of fear as the GOP has done for years. Murphy did a lot of things democrats wanted. Min wage, pot legalization, family leave. Overall dems need to do better to support people who are delivering. Frankly I am not sure why a principled republican should be opposed to these things.

I also must say I am surprised you voted for Ciattarelli. The guy is refusing to concede even though he's behind by 65,000 votes. What's next a claim of voter fraud. Is that the playbook you support because that's the playbook the GOP seems to run for every race they lose. They were talking about potential voter fraud in Virginia before election day probably not confident they were going to win. Somehow there was none now since Youngkin won.  

[amybrickwallace]

Thank you!!!

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[Max]

 

I believe that Terry McAullife received more votes in VA than even in Ralph Northan received in his victorious 2017 bid, so that goes against your narrative that Democrats just didn't bother to show up on Tuesday. Maybe a lot of voters--even in a dark blue state such as New Jersey--wanted a change because the state is a very unaffordable place in which to live and do business. But you're so incredibly partisan that you have to tell yourself that whenever the GOP wins, it's because of fear. So thank goodness the Democrats always run such rosy, uplifting campaigs, right? Like when the Democrats trashed John McCain for being a war monger in 2008. Or when all sorts of very ugly, anti-Mormon smears were hurled at Mitt Romney in 2012. Or when age became a major issue against Reagan, McCain, and Dole, even though they were all a good four-plus years younger when they ran than when Biden got elected. (And don't even get me started about how Democrats always seem to "forgive" or "forget" any racism on the part of their own, whether it's Ralph Northam's infamous photo, Hillary's very racially charged 2008 primary campaign, Howard Dean's statement that he wanted to get the votes of "guys with Confederate flags on their pickup trucks," or the anti-Semitism of Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton.)

If I were Ciattarelli, I would have conceded by now. But there's quite a bit of Democratic hypocrisy on this matter, since the Democratic State Senate President, Steve Sweeney, lost by a margin that can't be overcome, and Governor Murphy has indicated Sweeney can concede on his own timetable. (I want to make clear that I am in no way supportive of the very bigoted GOP candidate who defeated Sweeney. I merely mentioned this race because I wanted to point out Democratic hypocrisy on this matter.)

Some liberals--and here I am not referring to you, as you specifically did not address this matter--seem to be shocked and under the impression that a person cannot be genuinely anti-Trump without voting Democratic up and down the ballot. Life is a hell of a lot more complicated than that, and as somebody who is on the center-right of the political spectrum, I'm not about to relinquish my political beliefs and instead give Democrats my unconditional and undying support simply because I despise Trump and the MAGA cult. I will evaluate each election and choose the person whom I genuinely believe is best for the job, and that doesn't make me an evil person.

Edited November 7, 2021 by Max