A mass firing would serve the arrogant producers and writers on this show right.

But something like this isn't realistic, though it would be nice to see happen.

Does Sony have any Writer Development Programs? This show needs to accept that it's a soap, but at least try to push the envelope again. Sony should try to force some experimental producer on this show or something, along with a filters writing team, but it would never happen.

If they're playing "safe", I have honestly no idea why they don't bring in Shaughnessy. He has proven himself in the Bell universe.

And yes, all that is very unrealistic and not helped by the fact that the budget got slashed and first-class, proven soap writers aren't really going to get hired. Unless they accept a smaller fee.

But then the question after a mass firing is, "and then what?" What do you do? Hire Heather Tom? Victoria Rowell? Fire Christel Khalil and get a proper Lily? What if Sony says no to all of that (especially Khalil, who I think functions for them as a 'safe' minority lead)? Use Jill? Victor? Nikki? What if Bloom pushes too hard? Y&R seems to have a company team now, and even if you got them out, I don't think Sony or Bloom would greenlight anyone or anything in which they could not continue to have a firm hand. That crucial ground for creator control was lost starting with Latham.

If they're playing "safe", I have honestly no idea why they don't bring in Shaughnessy. He has proven himself in the Bell universe.

And yes, all that is very unrealistic and not helped by the fact that the budget got slashed and first-class, proven soap writers aren't really going to get hired. Unless they accept a smaller fee.

I don't think they Bell's even care about this show, it's just a cash machine to them. They stopped caring when Bill died, at least he protected his shows.

I mean, who would put their INEXPERIENCED wife that hadn't written for a television show in almost two decades as both Head Writer and Executive Producer of their father's show, the show that defines their father's legacy? Also, and proceeds to allow her to have a million man writing team and a Co-EP that eats at the show's vulnerable budget, the same mistake that harmed the show with the creative regime before this one?

If they wanted people more qualified for the job, it would have happened, but they stopped caring. It's just about turning out a show to them, not turning out a show with substance or some form of stability and consistency.

I don't think they Bell's even care about this show, it's just a cash machine to them. They stopped caring when Bill died, at least he protected his shows.

If they wanted people more qualified for the job, it would have happened, but they stopped caring. It's just about turning out a show to them, not turning out a show with substance or some form of stability and consistency.

Yes. You're right.

I mean, who would put their INEXPERIENCED wife that hadn't written for a television show in almost two decades as both Head Writer and Executive Producer of their father's show, the show that defines their father's legacy? Also, and proceeds to allow her to have a million man writing team and a Co-EP that eats at the show's vulnerable budget, the same mistake that harmed the show with the creative regime before this one?

That is so hilarious, it's tragic!

Edited December 16, 200915 yr by Sylph

But then the question after a mass firing is, "and then what?" What do you do? Hire Heather Tom? Victoria Rowell? Fire Christel Khalil and get a proper Lily? What if Sony says no to all of that (especially Khalil, who I think functions for them as a 'safe' minority lead)? Use Jill? Victor? Nikki? What if Bloom pushes too hard? Y&R seems to have a company team now, and even if you got them out, I don't think Sony or Bloom would greenlight anyone or anything in which they could not continue to have a firm hand. That crucial ground for creator control was lost starting with Latham.

I think they need to hire someone who can do basic soap. That's what Y&R needs right now. That's what the show's best actors can play. Play the hell out of Nikki, Jack, Jill, Katherine, Paul, Michael. Write out the biggest problems, like Adam. Put Sharon and Nick back together and have Phyllis almost destroy herself until someone helps her pick up the pieces. Slap the core families back together (Abbotts, Chancellors, Newmans). Either bring back Victoria Rowell or recast her. If you won't do either, then write the Winters out and bring a new black family in.

If they have to do something to get attention then I would suggest they have Kevin snap, for good this time. They find Gloria and Jeffrey dead, propped up on the couch like dolls. He kills off or drives away various nuisance characters the show would be better off without. At the end of the story, Mackenzie has to choose between getting him help and letting him die. She lets him die, and, realizing how much of her way of life she has broken, decides to leave town to go on a long retreat.

This show wants to get canceled, I mean, look at it.

Half baked stories? Check

Piss poor character development? Check

Chemistry-less pairings? Check

Horrendous pacing? Check

Offensive portrayals of women and minorities? Check

Sloppy day to day writing? Check

And this is only off the top of my head.

This show is like a soda that's lost all of it's pop/fizz/gas. It's not enticing, or even recognizable anymore.

True.

But when are we going to find out about the cancellation? With the recent 2-year deal? September 2011?

True.

But when are we going to find out about the cancellation? With the recent 2-year deal? September 2011?

Actually, I believe they were renewed in like February/March of this year, so February/March 2011.

Actually, I believe they were renewed in like February/March of this year, so February/March 2011.

So... Wait. If they had contract negotiations in December 2008 saying they have 2 years from February/March 2010, that means we shall receive news on status in December 2010? How long in advance will they announce the cancellation?

Play the hell out of Nikki, Jack, Jill, Katherine, Paul, Michael. Write out the biggest problems, like Adam...Either bring back Victoria Rowell or recast her.

I doubt that either Sony or Barbara Bloom will allow that. They seem keen to emulate ABC and Frons.

I doubt that either Sony or Barbara Bloom will allow that. They seem keen to emulate ABC and Frons.

You're right, but LML did use Jack, Paul, and Nikki quite a bit. She didn't use Katherine or Jill enough. I guess it's different now though, with the license cut, but I think if they actually want to save Y&R then they need to at least keep these faces front and center while they are fixing the show and phasing new characters in. Bill Bell managed to do this.

I doubt that either Sony or Barbara Bloom will allow that. They seem keen to emulate ABC and Frons.

Exactly.

You're right, but LML did use Jack, Paul, and Nikki quite a bit.

And nearly destroyed two of the three.

sad how Frons has become some sort of model to emulate.

I never actually understood properly how people who are paid to have taste — have none. Costume and set designers, for example. Budget is not really an issue when you're good at what you do and know how to be creative with what you've got.

Last resort? But then you hinder the prospect of someone better coming along. I can't possibly understand your stance on this. You have your limits, don't you? How much longer would you have kept McTavish, for example?

So, I wasn't watching when she buried poor Ian Buchanan alive or killed Dixie with pancakes. That did sound rather extreme. But I was watching her AMC/OLTL cross-over babyswitch, and I loved it...addicted..watched everyday. Babyswitches are like crack cocaine for me anyway (I'm even watching DOOL for the first time since the early 80s because ot it), but I thought she did a fine job with that. I therefore don't run with the crowd, I suspect.

True.

But when are we going to find out about the cancellation? With the recent 2-year deal? September 2011?

Brad Bell said in this week's TVGuide to Michael Logan that BOTH Y&R and B&B renegotiated their deals this Fall (B&B in October, Y&R "around then") with 2-year contracts. From other sources, we also know there was a 40% license fee cut at this time.

Thus, both shows come up again in Fall 2011. Assuming that renewal decisions might be made up to 6 months in advance, I expect we'll hear word in Spring 2011.

I think when the shows are cancelled they'll both be cancelled together at this point. Depending on ratings, then, I think we're seeing the end of both shows in September 2012 or September 2013. That's a good guess now.

The only ameliorating factor is that Brad Bell says both shows are being sold to CBS "at a deficit" (implying that international sales and Soapnet make up the difference). Obviously, for as long as CBS can make more money than these shows cost (and it sounds like Brad Bell--at least--is willing to cut and cut for as long as needed to stay on the air), it does seem likely that we could stretch out this demise until 2015 or something.

I guess the next shoe to drop is when the Italians and the French and the Greeks get tired of B&B and Y&R. When that happens, I think the Bells will fold up their tent.

Any sign of European abandonment of the Bell shows??

So, I wasn't watching when she buried poor Ian Buchanan alive or killed Dixie with pancakes. That did sound rather extreme. But I was watching her AMC/OLTL cross-over babyswitch, and I loved it...addicted..watched everyday. Babyswitches are like crack cocaine for me anyway (I'm even watching DOOL for the first time since the early 80s because ot it), but I thought she did a fine job with that. I therefore don't run with the crowd, I suspect.

But you've admitted Y&R isn't the best creatively and hasn't been in a while, so why do you want this regime to stick around, when they can be replaced, and the show might be ending anyway in a few years? Don't you want to say at least they tried to better your favourite show by making some changes at the end of its run?

I don't understand your position on this, it seems like you have a bias for this writing team, and you constantly call B&B out for its flaws, but dwell less on Y&R's, when Y&R is hardly any better with its mistakes....

Brad Bell said in this week's TVGuide to Michael Logan that BOTH Y&R and B&B renegotiated their deals this Fall (B&B in October, Y&R "around then") with 2-year contracts. From other sources, we also know there was a 40% license fee cut at this time.

Thus, both shows come up again in Fall 2011. Assuming that renewal decisions might be made up to 6 months in advance, I expect we'll hear word in Spring 2011.

I think when the shows are cancelled they'll both be cancelled together at this point. Depending on ratings, then, I think we're seeing the end of both shows in September 2012 or September 2013. That's a good guess now.

The only ameliorating factor is that Brad Bell says both shows are being sold to CBS "at a deficit" (implying that international sales and Soapnet make up the difference). Obviously, for as long as CBS can make more money than these shows cost (and it sounds like Brad Bell--at least--is willing to cut and cut for as long as needed to stay on the air), it does seem likely that we could stretch out this demise until 2015 or something.

Brad also said in that interview that he thinks we're now down to the six soaps that will survive. Even soap-hating jackass Les Moonves thinks the "special soaps" will survive.

I find it very amusing that people assume that all soaps are dying just because CBS has trimmed the fat from their daytime line-up. Y&R and B&B both have international sales working in their favor (they get ample production money from international sales, allowing them to sell the shows to CBS at bargain basement prices) - something the P&G soaps didn't have. B&B has also (smartly) released a line of merchandise (DVDs, books, coffee mugs, calendars, etc) in Europe and Australia. Sony would be wise to do the same with Y&R and Days.

I guess the next shoe to drop is when the Italians and the French and the Greeks get tired of B&B and Y&R.

Good luck with that.

Any sign of European abandonment of the Bell shows??

Nope. They still rate their asses off in both Europe and Australia.