The Politics Thread

[KristinG79]

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[Vee]

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[Khan]

I guess this is the price Merrick Garland must pay for attempting to appear impartial?

[DramatistDreamer]

Currently, I am listening to a townhall on Spoutible with Representative Jasmine Crockett.

 

https://spoutible.com/pod/65c73ffe1db49c2a3f17765f
 

[I Am A Swede]

Anyone surprised? 

Jailed Russian opposition politician Alexei Navalny dead, says prison service

[DramatistDreamer]

Nope. 
Ideologically, I realize he felt compelled to return to Russia, after his miraculous recovery from having been poisoned, but his return really did seal his fate. He was arrested upon arrival, so I am not really sure whether or not he couldn’t have achieved his goals from exile in Germany-it certainly would have given him more time.

[DramatistDreamer]

Donald Trump must pay $354.9 million, barred from NY business for 3 years, judge rules

[Cat]

His argument was that he couldn't ask Russians at home to risk their lives and protest while he lived in safety abroad. But yes, returning to Russia made his fate almost inevitable, although I always hoped that he would make it through his prison sentence and return to his family. A dark day for democracy -- I had a lot of respect for this brave individual who seemed to know it might end this way but carried on, hopeful, that he might precipitate change against the odds.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/feb/16/alexei-navalny-exile-russia-putin-prison

[JaneAusten]

 I believe Navalny knew what would happen to him if he returned.  Including his death. Heck he could have died in Germany or anywhere else in exile as it was had he not returned as happened when they poisoned him and he was lucky enough to live.  Maybe he was hoping his death could set a trajectory that would lead to changes.  I am skeptical.

I follow Tom Nichols on twitter and have read his books and a lot of his writing. He used to be involved in the National Security apparatus and was a teacher at the Naval War College before he started his writing career. He now writes for The Atlantic primarily. He also spent several years in Moscow.

His perspective on the Russian people are that they believe themselves to be victims and looked down upon by the west. This preceeds current leadership and goes back many years. And keep in mind Russia is only to happy to continue to feed this paranoia in their own people.  I am guessing the population in the cities such as Moscow and St. Petersburg might be different because you are likely dealing with a better educated population. We'll see if anything changes but can anything really? time will tell.

[DRW50]

I saw someone saying that many want to assign values of nobility to many Russian decisions that can really be boiled down to just wanting savagery. That is probably not entirely fair, but I would say it is in the case of Putin and a number of other leaders before him. We see that over and over with so many in the West who hate their countries and cling to Putin as some embattled hero fighting for their future, only for him to say, over and over, it's not about any of that - he just wants to conquer and conquer and conquer. 

There is not going to be any moment of uprising or reckoning for Putin, especially not from his own people. I can understand why Navalny, who likely knew he and his family were facing death if he did stay away, may have wanted to return and possibly be part of that change, even at cost of his own life, but it won't happen. Putin waged decimation against millions of Ukranians and yet so many inside and outside of Russia still cheer him all the way.

This type of response, against Grandpa Bernie (who is now part of the evil establishment), sums up today's left:

 

Edited February 17, 2024 by DRW50

[Vee]

I think the American left, while often aggravating, is a lot more stratified and complicated than these creeps.

[DramatistDreamer]

From what I have been reading, between the $355 million judgement against Trump, including interest, the $83 million judgment against him in the E. Jean Carroll defamation case could wipe out all his cash on hand and liquidity. Good.

Also, what self respecting business would want to do business with a company that not only has to operate under a court appointed independent monitor, who has just been granted enhanced monitoring powers as well as an independent financial compliance director?

People are talking about Trump and his sons being banned for 3 and two years, but two of the company’s officers are banned for life. Not a good look. Real estate prospects can change in a New York minute. Reading the particulars of this judgement has been fun.

[DramatistDreamer]

Another problem is that the opposition itself in Russia is very fractured. I remember years ago when I first read about Navalny, I was hearing that he had association with people who espoused nationalist and anti-immigrant sentiment, which always made me view him somewhat skeptically but I was never sure whether that was Kremlin manufactured “dezinformatsiya” (and let’s face it, these elements exist in the Russian government, they exist in Ukraine as well) or even if Navalny personally espoused these beliefs. It did make me uncomfortable though. And maybe it might have dissuaded some from uniting as a larger opposition movement.

In movements worldwide, I know that people like to focus on one charismatic leader but it has shown not to work in Russia when it comes to democracy or anything resembling a democratic movement. And there seems to be no signs of coalition politics, at least from the outside.

Edited February 17, 2024 by DramatistDreamer

[JaneAusten]

Yeah I know Navalny had a following but some of his views from years past are really awful and I think the only reason the people in the West embraced him was he was a foe to Putin. Did it even matter that some of his views were shared by Putin and his entourage?

The only real opposition in Russia today is the Communist Party and with that I believe they only hold 125 seats in the Duma out of around 400-450. Most of the remainder are held by United Russia which is the Party Putin is a member of.

Last year when Prigozhin and his contingent were on the march to wherever with alleged designs on overthrowing the current gvmt(who knows), people were celebrating in the West. Prigozhin is as bad if not worse than Putin. What does that say.

[Vee]