GH: Classic Thread

[victorlord75]

I missed most of the early Phelps period, but I'm guessing you're saying the show was still good because, maybe, alot of Quartermaines were still left, as opposed to now?

[Planet Soap]

@victorlord75 The Phelps period can't compare to the Riche and Monty years at all, but it is certainly better than today. The Phelps era sucked in that it allowed mob violence to envelop the show, and it put a lot of veteran cast members on the back burner (Alan, Monica, Bobbie, Felicia) and it's erasure of the Quartermaines. By the end of her run it was apparent she needed to go.

 

However, the era was still better at having focused, interesting and fast paced story lines compared to Valentini. The show today could never pull off something as interesting as the Metro Court crisis or Rick locking Carly in the panic room. To their credit, the Valentini team attempts to use history and veteran actors, but suffers from an over bloated cast, unfocused convoluted plots, and stunt/looks based casting.

 

Overall, from what I've read, the soaps JFP writes for are left considerably worse after she leaves (GL, GH, OLTL Y&R) it's a mystery as to why she keeps getting hired.

Edited January 5, 2019 by ironlion

[titan1978]

Phelps/Guza had stronger scripts, better plots and stories, infinently better acting and characters and production values than we are seeing today.  However, the characters featured to the detriment of everybody else drove me away as a viewer. But I have enough distance from the product to see that while not for me, it was better written and acted and produced.

 

Their events and stunts were amazing.  The train crash, panic room, Metro Court crisis, contagion, all exciting stories and excellent episodes.

 

The problem was their orbit was Sonny, Jason, Carly, and to a lesser extent, Luke, Scrubs, and a female character of the moment (Courtney, Brenda, Lulu).  If you weren’t tied to those people, none of the stories had a point of view away from them.  And by the end of their time together, it was really Jason that everything revolved around.  He pushed Sonny from the central spot.  It was awfully hard to watch a soap daily when those are the only stories featured.

Edited January 5, 2019 by titan1978

[victorlord75]

While some people would call it "taking risks" for ratings, the reason why JFP was problematic as a producer was that she didn't make many of her story decisions with thought about long-term consequences to a show or its future.  She made her decisions solely in the moment.  Yes, killing off a long-term character can raise ratings during a sweeps period, such as Alan (GH), Maureen (GL), or Frankie (AW).  She sacrificed heart and soul of her shows for short-term ratings gains during Sweeps Periods, and I think that is the main reason why so many viewers dislike her, even if she did have her strengths in the production area.  I beg some forgiveness for saying what so many posters  have said far better than I have here.

[KMan101]

 

PREACH!!!!!

[BetterForgotten]

I think a lot of GH's problems started with Riche/Guza - I can't blame JFP for revolving the show around Sonny, Jason, and Carly as that had started long before she arrived. Sure she didn't help it, but the show was going in that direction regardless. 

[DRW50]

 

I'd agree. The show had huge problems from early into Guza's return. He was very eager to rot away GH's foundations - he seemed deeply contemptuous of the show, and of soap operas as a whole. 

 

Riche never should have allowed him to do what he did to the Quartermaines, or allowed the Jason worship, or allowed the rape revisitation story. Maybe those decisions were out of her hands, I don't know.

Edited January 5, 2019 by DRW50

[Planet Soap]

The Riche era was the second best in the show’s history (after the Monty 80s). It brought humanism and emotion to the  more the raw action packed and “sophisticated” tone of the 80s. Post 1996 Riche/Guza set the foundation for what we have now. Its also intresting that despite it’s greatness it also planted the seeds for the shows impending transformation (Sonny, Jason, Carly , mob etc..) Furthermore it commenced the excusing and sympathy toward Sonny & Jason’s mob activity. The charachters, though very compelling, are constanty shown in a moral heroic light despite both men killing people for a living.

 

The destruction of AJ was also upsetting. AJ admittedly was a screw up, but the only person that had a right to mess with AJ was Jason because of the accident. Otherwise his own family plus Sonny & Carly did a number on him. AJ didnt push Carly down the stairs, she jerked back and fell. And yet again Sonny killed an innocent AJ in 2014? for Connie’s murder. 

 

I might be in the minority here but I think the Liz rape/ Luke & Laura rehash in 1998 was one of the shows greatest plots. Powerful emotion from a young couple and the confirmation that Luke did rape Laura in 1979. The only part I hated is that once again Luke & Laura were driven apart. The writers just couldnt let the Spencers be a unit, and the biggest couple in soaps be together.

Edited October 25, 2020 by ironlion

[Efulton]

That is it in a nutshell!!

[titan1978]

Without a doubt.  I think she is the single most destructive person to have the EP position on a soap.  Which sucks, because her shows usually look great (except Y&R), and she knows how to produce heartbreaking material giving actors wonderful scenes.  But the cost is the show is weaker or destroyed when she exits the building.

[titan1978]

Anyone watching the show could see the considerable difference between Guza’s first round as HW, and his second after Sunset Beach.

 

Every major story was focused on a man, except for Brenda, who was just stuck between two men.  Even Elizabeth’s rape seemed to really be more about Lucky and Luke than Liz or Laura.

 

Also- his entire point of view as an writer was to deconstruct every relationship and character except Sonny, Carly, and Jason.

 

Alan on drugs.  Luke loses Lucky and Laura and is mired in misery.  Laura loses Luke and Lucky and is mired in misery.  Lucky hates his formerly beloved parents.  Tony is a kidnapper (including Robin).  Justus is a murderer.  The list goes on.

 

Riche let all this happen.  There have been rumors for years they had tension and did not get along.  But still, she produced all of this.

 

I still think Riche’s run from her arrival to the first six months of Culliton as HW was just about perfect.  Lots of highs after that too, but that first part was just so good.

Edited January 5, 2019 by titan1978

[victorlord75]

The thing about both JFP and Guza, Jr. that has me scratching my head to this day is that both of them were involved in one way or another on GH during its heyday, so one would think that both would have had the highest respect and esteem for GH history.  Phelps was there as a music director and Guza, Jr. was part of the writing team during the 80s.  So, I was shocked and really saddened by the horrible Heather Webber return where Heather was out to snag Luke (?) and how Rick Webber came back as an unrecognizable demon, only to get killed off.  I know that some posters here feel that Guza, Jr. was better than the current writers, but I don't agree.  I don't think the current writers have done as much damage, especially with revisionist history, like Guza, Jr. did.  The new writers seem to prefer to create new characters, but that's a subject for a different thread.  

[titan1978]

The only thing I can say is that the lessons they learned from Gloria Monty were all the bad ones.

 

Gritty is fine, but on a show that airs five days a week all year long you need balance.  They are not good with balance.  Pair that with the misogyny found in both of their work and the lack of respect for history and it’s pretty rough.  They also both seems to revel in being unlikeable- her in reputation and him in not writing a single likeable character for very long without trying to deconstruct them.

 

 

[Planet Soap]

Well, new charachters definately tops destroying legacy charachters indeed!

[titan1978]

Not sure if this has been talked about here or not.  On the ABC website and app they have 20 classic episodes of GH about Sonny & Carly.  Not a great couple for me, but it’s whole episodes with characters that I do love.  Plus Sarah as Carly.  And the Faces of the Heart open.

 

 

First episode has Felicia being held by Faison, Hannah, and Roy.  None of which I enjoyed back then.  Funny what you can tolerate after over a decade of Guza, JFP, and Valentini.  I long for the likes of Hannah on GH today lol.

 

Edited January 12, 2019 by titan1978