Somerset Discussion Thread

[toml1962]

@ VET Hopeully this will put the issue to bed. Please take note that Steve is in March 28 episode - good Friday, which angered the fans as they hated the show making Mary die on that day - and that his last line (EXIT LINE) means it is his last appearance until he came back from the dead many years later. He was NOT off the show before this. This can all be found on the amazing AW website here:

http://www.igs.net/~awhp/aw1975d.html

MARCH 21, 1975 (EP. #2703)

Steve told Alice about the "new city" in Australia, and she excitedly planned to have Robert and Lenore come live there with her and Steve. Steve was eager to draw up papers delineating the new lines of authority for Frame Enterprises. Mary and Jim finalized their St. Croix plans. Willis told Rachel Jamie will be able to choose between the publishing business and the construction business when he grows up. A reluctant Alice escorted Mac home to Rachel's apartment when Linda, his assigned nurse, was called away. Mac confided to Alice that before Iris was born, his wife and he lost a baby son. He had refused to think about it for years, but Jamie has made it less painful.

Steve: "I'd like to settle the future of the firm."

Willis: "You mean I might take it over some day."

Steve: "Yeah, maybe..."

Steve: "As you said, looks like you've got two fathers now, huh?"

Jamie: "Well, he's only my step-father... [bEAT] I'll always have just one father and that's you."

MARCH 24, 1975 (EP. #2704)

Mac threw in some kisses while Rachel coached his exercises. Vic told an upset Lenore her furniture requisition was missing some papers. Carol hid the papers when Lenore asked if she had them.

MARCH 25, 1975 (EP. #2705)

Helen passed on Liz's message that she was having a wonderful time with Mary and Jim in St. Croix. Helen told Richard she and Liz would like to do some volunteer work at the hospital. Jim and Mary relaxed at the beach house and reminisced about the past. Steve told Robert about the Australian deal, and reassured Vic he was the senior man in the firm.

Jim: "We've been very lucky, Mary."

Mary: "[KISSING HIM] Because we've had each other."

MARCH 26, 1975 (EP. #2706)

Carol asked Russ to recommend a NY cardiologist for her mother, but it was just an excuse to let it "slip" that poor Lenore was mentally unwell. Philip told Iris they can use Clarice to make friends with Rachel, giving Rachel a reason to come to Philip's cottage (to see Clarice). Helen asked Richard to see if he could help a troubled Lenore. Iris took Rachel's hand and asked for her forgiveness, and agreed to be executrix of Mac's will.

MARCH 27, 1975 (EP. #2707)

Lenore didn't appreciate Richard dropping by to see how she was doing. Jamie, Dennis, Ada, and Gil had a picnic on the floor of the half-furnished living room. Carol made it a point to tell Lenore that Robert would be going to Australia before Robert could tell her first. Barbara and Vic hesitated outside the door as they heard Robert and Lenore arguing about moving to Australia.

MARCH 28, 1975 (EP. #2708)

Rachel wished Steve a good journey when he phoned to arrange to say goodbye to Jamie. Steve told Alice the project was his opportunity to leave his mark on the world when she was sad about leaving their house, even if it was only temporary. Steve and Alice phoned Mary and Jim with their news. Jamie told Steve the house wouldn't be the same without him. Steve said goodbye to Jamie, then Alice made ready to take Steve to the airport. Jim woke up from a nap to find Mary had passed away in a chair on the terrace.

Jamie: "[THROWS HIMSELF IN HIS ARMS] I'll miss you, Dad."

Steve: "And I'll miss you."

Jamie: "[HE LOOKS AT STEVE] Bye, Dad..."

Steve: "Bye, son... [JAMIE TURNS QUICKLY AND GOES OUT]

Jim: "[HE KISSES HER] Thank you, darling..."

Mary: "For what?"

Jim: "For sharing my life... I've been wondering what I would have done without you."

Mary: "We don't have to wonder things like that, do we? Now, you get your rest-"

Jim: "I'll just give Pat a ring. You want to talk to her?"

Mary: "Yes, I'll be right in. [JIM GOES INSIDE. MARY RISES AND LIZ GOES TO HER]"

Liz: "Oh, Mary."

Mary: "What is it?"

Liz: "Do you realize what a lucky woman you are?"

Mary: (Exit Line) "Yes, I do... And I'm grateful to Jim for making my life so much easier than most people's. Now, do you want to say hello to Pat?"

Liz: "No, you and Jim talk to her. I'll go find some more shells for that necklace for Marianne. Give them all my love, will you. [sHE HURRIES OUT, AND MARY STARES AFTER HER THOUGHTFULLY, THEN GOES INTO THE HOUSE]"

Alice: "Darling, can we just walk around the house once before we leave?"

Steve: (Exit Line) "Sure... I'm going to miss this as much as Jamie will. [HE TAKES HER HAND AND THEY GO OUT]"

'ST. CROIX TERRACE. THE SUNSET IS REFLECTED ON THE TERRACE. JIM ENTERS, STRETCHING.'

Jim: "Mary, I didn't mean to sleep so long... I thought you were going to wake me. [HE LOOKS AT HER. SHE'S IN THE CHAIR, WITH HER BACK TO HIM, HER HEAD TURNED TO ONE SIDE.] Mary? We should get ready for dinner. [HE GOES TOWARD HER AND THEN STOPS, STARING AT HER. HE SEES HER MAGAZINE FALLEN TO THE FLOOR AND THE TEA GLASS SHATTERED BY IT.] Oh, no! Mary! Mary! [HE GOES TO HER, AND THEN TURNS TO LIZ, WHO'S COME TO THE DOOR]

Liz: "What is it, Jim?"

Jim: "Call a doctor, Liz... Something's wrong with Mary! [HE LEANS OVER MARY, AND LIZ BACKS AWAY SLOWLY, THEN TURNS AND HURRIES INTO THE HOUSE]"

Note: First mention of Cory Publishers.

MARCH 31, 1975 (EP. #2709)

Liz tried to comfort a heartbroken Jim after she told him the doctor said Mary had died of heart failure. John brought Alice to his home so she and Pat could seek solace from each other. Then he went to Iris's with Dave to break the news to Russ.

APRIL 1, 1975 (EP. #2710)

Jamie showed Dennis his new game room, but complained to an irritated Carol it looked too much like a girl's room. Pat came to tell Ada the news. Rachel happened by and Pat believed her when she said she was genuinely sorry.

Ada: (About Mary) "I loved her. She was my friend. Things won't ever be the same without her."

APRIL 2, 1975 (EP. #2711)

Marianne cried in Pat's arms about Mary. Robert and Helen tried to console Lenore, who was slowly going to pieces. Willis told Angie that Mary's funeral brought back memories of attending his mother's funeral at age seven. His father had died long before, and they were both buried in the same cemetery on a little hill just past the Ordway silo. Jim told Ada he had no intention of leaving his house.

APRIL 3, 1975 (EP. #2712)

Carol visited Lenore at home to gaslight her some more. Philip and Clarice, in the midst of a seeming marathon of lovemaking, were relieved neither was interested in marriage. An improved Marianne put her arms around Pat when she saw her crying on Jim's shoulder.

Note: First reference to Cory Publishing.

APRIL 4, 1975 (EP. #2713)

Mac was very impressed with the renovations when he and Rachel moved into the mansion, but was upset by the elevator chair installed for his use. Mac told Angie to run an ad for domestic help. Lenore ripped up her and Walter's wedding invitation. Lenore thwarted Robert's attempt to question her about Walter. Dennis and Iris came over to take part in the first dinner with Mac and Rachel at the Cory mansion. Clarice and Phillip brought Mac and Rachel a lava lamp as a housewarming gift.

Clarice: "Well, Mac, how's your back? Say, that rhymes, doesn't it? [sHE LAUGHS, BUT NO ONE ELSE DOES]

APRIL 7, 1975 (EP. #2714)

Barbara told John her mother died while she was in college. John gave Barbara time off so she could have lunch with Dave. Lenore confided to Pat she's been having nightmares of something dire about to happen. Neil told Willis he looks at home behind Steve's desk. John worried about Barbara's headaches. Angie told Neil that Willis was just projecting a tough exterior and he needed her.

APRIL 9, 1975 (EP. #2715)

Russ was worried that Jim intended to keep the house as if Mary were still alive. Neil offered to let Willis room at his place. Vic didn't approve of Willis's unethical work practices, so he phoned Steve and had him tell Willis that Vic was in charge.

Note: A hand-written note next to the Willis/Vic argument: "Willis - no "Son of a bitch'"

APRIL 10, 1975 (EP. #2716)

Mac advised Lenore not to let her jealousy get the better of her. John urged Vic and Willis to work out their differences. Philip found he was starting to respect Rachel. Jim was slightly cheered by Marianne's visit. Angie and Ada mulled over the guest list to the surprise housewarming party for Rachel.

APRIL 11, 1975 (EP. #2717)

Vic warned Carol she would regret hurting Lenore in any way. Lenore wasn't convinced by Neil's suspicions that Carol was behind her mistakes at work. Louise panicked when Iris caught her talking to Ada. Dave tried to diagnose the cause of Barbara's headaches. Pat talked Jim into going back to work.

APRIL 14, 1975 (EP. #2718)

Robert wouldn't listen to Vic's accusations about Carol, and she used the opportunity to tell Robert her suspicions of Vic and Lenore. Rachel begged Carol to stop her pursuit of Robert, but Carol insisted she loved Robert and raged that Rachel had turned against her.

APRIL 15, 1975 (EP. #2714)

Vic kissed Barbara in hopes of convincing her to cancel her lunch date with Dave. Mac vowed to Dave he will be able to walk in time for Rachel's party. Jim refused to move in with Pat and John. Rachel told Ada she's uneasy about the prospect of servants living in the mansion with her and Mac. Dave told Barbara he was the only son of an only son of an old, old New England family.

Ada: "Nancy said Daddy this morning, but Rachel doesn't believe me-"

Rachel: "It was probably a hiccup."

Ada: "It was not!"

Dave: "I'm the doctor son of a doctor son of a doctor son."

Barbara: "My, my, your family seems to have established a pattern."

Notes: Matt Fowler, Cory board member.

APRIL 16, 1975 (EP. #2720)

Lenore told Alice she didn't want Robert to go to Australia because she was frightened of making any major changes. Carol chastised Robert for letting Lenore influence him into not taking the Australian job. Dave told Alice they have a ten-year-old girl in the emergency room whose parents, "Peter R. (35) and Janet (27) Spencer," were just killed in a car crash on Route 43. Wally was upset that Lenore couldn't produce a photograph of Walter.

APRIL 17, 1975 (EP. #2721)

Liz made peace with Rachel, and Rachel assured her she didn't have any hard feelings. Gil teased Ada about being nervous about interviewing Beatrice Gordon for the Cory housekeeping position. Beatrice told Ada she'd last worked for the Wilbur DeWitts, who owned the Bay View Bank, before he retired and they moved to the West Coast where their daughter lives. Orphan Sally Spencer told Gil she and her parents had been en route from New York to San Francisco. Jim came for dinner at Gil and Ada's, and bounced Nancy on his knee.

Mac: (To Liz and Rachel) "Some day, we'll all be sitting here as old friends."

Beatrice: (Intro Line) "How do you do, Mrs. McGowan?"

'HOSPITAL ROOM. SALLY SPENCER IS LYING ON HER BED, HER FACE TURNED TO THE WALL. HER HEAD IS BANDAGED AND SHE HAS SEVERAL BRUISES ON HER FACE. THE DOOR OPENS AND DAVE ENTERS, FOLLOWED BY ALICE.'

Dave: "Sally? [sHE TURNS SLOWLY AND LOOKS AT HIM BLANKLY] Hello..."

Sally: (Intro Line) "Hello."

Note: A hand-written note next to Jamie's name instructing him not to pronounce Clarice's name "Clorox."

APRIL 18, 1975 (EP. #2722)

Angie found Willis's old dog-eared photo from 1950 of his parents, and he explained Pa died before he started school, and Ma worked herself to death not long afterwards. Dennis was fascinated watching Clarice apply her makeup. Dennis threw a tantrum when Iris forbade him from taking riding lessons with Philip. Willis and Neil worked out the schematics of living together. Louise tried to warn Iris she might lose Russ if she continues her scheming with Philip, so later, Iris asked Russ to marry her.

Note: A hand-written note next to the Willis/Neil scene: "Neil - try not to wiggle hat stand".

APRIL 21, 1975 (EP. #2723)

Vic pressed Carol for the final sketches on the Cory library and dining room. Alice told John she'd spoken to Steve about delaying her joining him because of Sally. Marianne introduced herself to Mac and Rachel, then Mac chided Rachel for not being friendly to her. Marianne was disappointed when Jamie and Dennis told her Willis no longer worked at the mansion. Mac and Rachel quickly hired Beatrice when Ada brought her over. Lenore had a nightmare in which Carol told Wally his father was a murderer. Carol smiled secretly to herself after sobbing in Robert's arms that everyone had abandoned her her whole life.

APRIL 22, 1975 (EP. #2724)

Mac told Beatrice to remove the little silver dinner bell as it reminded him of his grandmother, who used to lie in bed in her later years, ringing a little bell causing servants to race up and down stairs all day. Mac was excited that he was able to stand up and walk a short distance on his own. Ms. Veasey warned Mac that Henry Renfrew and Talbot Scott planned a proxy fight at the stockholders meeting in NY. Barbara was embarrassed when John grinned at her about Dave. Angie informed Willis that Marianne had a crush on him and warned him not to encourage her.

APRIL 23, 1975 (EP. #2725)

Gil told Dave it looked like Sally's parents were hiding something. During questioning, Sally revealed she'd met with her parents at different motels, while attending different schools. Lenore had a session with Richard and described her nightmares. Carol was greatly satisfied to overhear Richard phone Robert about Lenore's session. Alice rocked Sally in her arms after the girl leaned her parents were dead.

Dave: "You were thrown out of the car when they hit a tree."

Sally: "They... [sHE STOPS AND LOOKS AT ALICE] Where's Mummy?"

Richard: "Your mother died on the way to the hospital."

Sally: "No! [ALICE TAKES HER IN HER ARMS] Alice, my Mummy couldn't... [sHE STOPS A MOMENT AND THEN TURNS TO DAVE] Where's Daddy?"

Dave: "He's with your mother, Sally. [HE BRUSHES HER HAIR BACK]"

Sally: "You mean... they're both... [sHE BEGINS TO CRY SOFTLY]"

APRIL 24, 1975 (EP. #2726)

Jim instructed Liz and Pat to unpack the boxes of Mary's clothes they had packed away without asking him. Barbara offered to help Rachel design a garden for the estate. Marianne visited Willis's apartment, put a record on his turntable, and Willis joined her in a friendly dance.

APRIL 25, 1975 (EP. #2727)

Zack told Gil his investigation into the Spencers hit a dead end. Pat complained to John that Marianne had been in a strange man's apartment. Robert got angry when Lenore resisted his advances.

APRIL 28, 1975 (EP. #2728)

Iris told Philip that Beatrice can be a witness Mac will believe. Neil encouraged Lenore to give Rachel the benefit of the doubt. Robert warned Vic to stay away from Lenore. Sally told Alice her mother had had a photograph of an older woman. Lenore told Rachel she hoped she and Mac would be very happy when Rachel said she was sorry for causing her any unhappiness. Carol turned right around and stormed out in a huff when she stumbled upon Lenore and Rachel talking. Carol told a dejected Robert she wouldn't stand in the way of his career the way Lenore did. She kissed him, but he broke off when the phone rang. She pulled him away from the ringing phone and he allowed her to lead him toward the office bedroom, as Lenore hung up the phone in tears.

APRIL 29, 1975 (EP. #2729)

Robert told Carol last night should never have happened. Lenore was pleased when Vic told her about Robert's jealousy. Carol made sure Vic saw her and Robert's night clothes on the bed. Barbara helped Rachel restore the gardens to how Rachel remembered seeing them as a girl. Barbara rebuffed Dave's kisses.

APRIL 30, 1975 (EP. #2730)

Sally was excited when Gil promised to introduce her to Nancy. Clarice practiced her French with the help of a French language record. Linda and Zack talked about buying a house. Jamie brought Clarice over to Ada's so Ada could help her with her tomato plants. Clarice mentioned her kid brothers, and that her mother was long dead.

Clarice: "Ada... you really are something, you know that. I wish you could have known Mama..."

Ada: "Same here, but I'm glad I've got to know you..."

MAY 1, 1975 (EP. #2731)

Michael told Pat Marianne's listless attitude was the cause of her poor grades. Jim advised Barbara to be wary of Rachel. Gil asked Barbara for help in the Spencer investigation. Michael dropped in to meet Sally and say hello. Jim gave Iris Mary's cameo brooch, and was delighted when she and Russ told him they were getting married.

Iris: "[HOLDING HER GLASS] "To Mary... may I make Russ as happy as Mary made you. [JIM SMILES AT HER]"

MAY 2, 1975 (EP. #2732)

Michael tried to get Marianne on the right track but she told him to mind his own business. Neil showed Clarice his apartment after meeting her at the Steak House and got her to pose for a photograph. Michael told Willis to leave his sister alone. Lenore screamed when Robert kissed her as it made her remember her dream in which Robert told her he'd killed Wayne Addison for her sake.

MAY 5, 1975 (EP. #2733)

Rachel welcomed Mac back from NY. Rachel realized it was a mistake to sermonize Carol. Philip got Clarice to chase Iris out of his cottage. Rachel admitted to Mac she had encouraged Carol to hurt Lenore, but wouldn't let Mac convince her to get further involved by trying to clear things up. Russ told Alice she was becoming too involved with Sally. Russ and Iris told Mac and Rachel their news.

MAY 6, 1975 (EP. #2734)

Philip told Clarice everything when she threatened to leave him, which she did anyway. Neil felt bad for Lenore when she stumbled across the night clothes in the office bedroom. Iris wouldn't let Philip back out of their deal. Lenore visited Carol in her hotel room and flung her night gown and negligee at her.

MAY 7, 1975 (EP. #2735)

Helen couldn't believe Lenore's suspicions about Robert. Beatrice mentioned her son Charles lives in Tulsa and her son Raymond lives in Scranton. Neil enjoyed watching Rachel blow up at Carol. Neil helped Clarice move her things out of Philip's place. Robert admitted his indiscretion to Lenore but blamed it on the fact that she wasn't a real wife to him because she kept things from him.

Neil: (To Carol) "You're not as good a liar as you used to be. Just goes to prove that practice doesn't always make perfect."

Lenore: "You can't deny it, can you?"

Robert: "I'm sorry!"

Lenore: "Sorry! Oh, Robert, all these months, I've been wondering if I was losing my mind..."

Robert: "I made a mistake..."

Lenore: "It's more than a mistake..."

MAY 8, 1975 (EP. #2736)

Carol freely admitted to Robert she'd been deliberately trying to break up his marriage to Lenore. Philip backed down on his threats to leave Bay City when Iris phoned Loretta and began dropping hints about how he earns his income. Alice asked Barbara to get the judge to let Sally stay with her until something was worked out. Vic promised to help Lenore fight for Robert. Clarice accepted Iris's bribe but said she was keeping the check only as proof against Iris. Lenore told Carol she would never get Robert.

MAY 9, 1975 (EP. #2737)

Michael told Pat Marianne might be going to the campus to check out the college boys. Helen told Lenore her father had been indiscreet as well. Carol was amused to meet Clarice.

MAY 12, 1975 (EP. #2738)

Russ and Iris threw a party and announced their engagement to Alice, Pat, John, Liz, Richard, Dave, and Barbara. Iris asked Liz to be her matron of honor, and Russ planned to ask Jim. Rachel quizzed a repentant Philip, then hid when Ada and Gil came over looking for her after Beatrice told them she went to Philip's. Ada dragged Rachel out of there and warned her people were just looking for her to screw up. Mac became suspicious when Rachel said she'd been to see Philip.

MAY 13, 1975 (EP. #2739)

Trevor Harvey, the supervisor for the Australian project, arrived in Bay City for a visit. Helen confronted Carol.

MAY 14, 1975 (EP. #2740)

Vic complained to Alice about Willis trying to run the firm on his own. Beatrice reminisced about her daughter, whom she hasn't heard from in 10 years, when Ada showed her a photo of Nancy. Alice told Trevor Robert had designed her house, and he gave her a present from Steve, an opal pendant.

Notes: Pencilled-in on the script cover: "Question from Vicky Wyndham: Mac has said several times he wanted to help with the garden, but in this scene, Rachel asks for help and he leaves. What to do?"

MAY 15, 1975 (EP. #2741)

Alice told Barbara she's considering adopting Sally. Marianne ran out when Pat and John insisted she was going to college. Trevor let it slip to Lenore that Carol was in contact with Robert, who was in NY on business.

MAY 16, 1975 (EP. #2742)

Iris told Mac Clarice told her Philip had betrayed her with another woman. Jim had Russ and Iris over to dinner. Carol found a dupe at a single's bar to phone Lenore and say he was an old friend of Walter's who wanted to talk to Wally.

MAY 19, 1975 (EP. #2743)

Lenore told Richard she has no choice but to take Wally and go away. Neil advised Clarice on choosing less flashy dresses. Alice brought Sally home and introduced her to Willis. Lenore told Vic she was leaving Robert because they should never have gotten married.

MAY 20, 1975 (EP. #2744)

Lenore panicked when the mailman delivered a manila envelope for Wally. Vic insisted on setting Lenore up in Washington when he couldn't talk her out of leaving. Willis criticized Vic to Trevor. Jamie told Rachel he got a letter from Steve saying he was coming home soon. Barbara flung her earrings to the floor when Vic canceled their dinner date. Lenore and Helen both got emotional when Lenore came over to say she was leaving town.

Lenore: "Robert needs someone who is completely his."

Vic: "And you're not?"

Lenore: "No, I belong to the past... to memories and nightmares and fears."

Lenore: (To Helen) "I am leaving Bay City."

MAY 21, 1975 (EP. #2745)

Iris told Mac she's considering a June wedding on her terrace. Iris told Philip they can use Barbara to concoct a misunderstanding between her and Rachel about a riding date to give Philip an opportunity to be alone with Rachel. Beatrice told Ada her daughter was named Jennifer, after Beatrice's grandmother. Ada and Gil couldn't decipher Louise's veiled warnings about Philip.

MAY 22, 1975 (EP. #2746)

Lenore was too busy packing to agree to talk to Marianne on Pat's behalf. Carol tried to get in touch with Robert when Willis insisted on speaking to him about a business matter. Then Neil traced Carol's phone call to learn Robert's location. Barbara convinced Marianne college would be a good idea. Alice told Pat that Steve was gungho to adopt Sally. Vic phoned Lenore to say he found her an apartment and a job in a law office.

MAY 28, 1975 (EP. #2750)

Mac was happy to hear Barbara planned to join Rachel in taking riding lessons from Philip. Lenore and Wally settled into their new apartment in Washington. Gil broke it to Rachel that Steve was killed in a helicopter crash on the way to the airport in Sydney, and she regretted that Steve will never know she regrets the things she did. Willis told John that Emma wants to bury Steve beside their parents, who were buried beside their parents. Willis blamed Vic for losing the Australian project.

Rachel: "I'm so ashamed of what I was."

Mac: "Don't be... because it led us to each other."

Jamie: "I wish it had been me!"

Ada: "Don't say that, Jamie."

Jamie: "I do. [HE THROWS HIMSELF IN TO HER ARMS.]"

'RACHEL ENTERS, WITH CORY BEHIND HER. SHE LOOKS FROM GIL TO ADA.'

Rachel: "Jamie? Are you all right?"

Jamie: "Mom? [HE LOOKS AT HER. SHE HESITATES AND THEN HOLDS OUT HER ARMS AND JAMIE RUNS INTO THEM. SHE HOLDS HIM CLOSELY AS CORY COMES TO THEM AND PUTS BOTH ARMS AROUND THEM.]"

'RACHEL PICKS UP ONE OF JAMIE'S BOOKS. THE WRITER SUGGESTS "AUSTRALIA" PUBLISHED BY THE NATIONAL GEOGRAPHIC SOCIETY, WHICH HAS AN EXCELLENT DUST JACKET FOR OUR USE.'

MAY 29, 1975 (EP. #2751)

Alice agreed to let Steve be buried in Chadwell, since he had sometimes talked about going back. Gil asked Dennis to go over and see Jamie. Robert apologized to Vic for his suspicions of him and Lenore. Robert threw Carol out of his life and his business. Alice told Liz she wants Sally to know Steve's family since she will soon have his name. Willis told Alice Janice will be flying in for the funeral.

Carol: "Robert, I love you!"

Robert: "If you do, I hope you suffer the way Lenore has suffered because of it! Now, get your things together and don't come back here again."

Alice: "Oh, Steven... my Steven... [sHE SOBS QUIETLY. A MOMENT LATER, SALLY COMES DOWN THE STAIRS IN HER NIGHTGOWN. SHE STOPS WHEN SHE SEES ALICE, AND THEN GOES TO HER SLOWLY AND, WITHOUT SPEAKING, NESTLES IN HER ARMS.]"

Edited May 29, 2012 by toml1962

[vetsoapfan]

P&G was notorious for being conservative, long after other soaps started pushing the envelope. Very possibly certain executives wanted the story dropped for other reasons, and used this "explicit" scene as an excuse. Of course you are free to believe or disbelief any reference to the incident you like, but personally, I'll take Jameson Parker's take on it.

[vetsoapfan]

Of course, careful reading on the thread would allow you to know that Carl had asked me about Roy Winsor's reign, and that's the point in the show's history to which I was referring. Lahoma was gone by then, and as were most of the other characters you referred to. In general, Winsor allowed "normal", everyday characters to have fun and express humor, which not all soap writers do or did. It worked very well.

[vetsoapfan]

The idea of what constitutes quality writing is a personal interpretation. Even writers who are generally considered giants of the genre, like William J. Bell, Douglas Marland, or Harding Lemay have had their detractors. Even comments like "most critics will agree that the show was well written" is subjective; certainly the ones I read during the show's run did not approve of the weaker writers.

Ratings alone do not prove or disprove the quality of the writing either. Henry Slesar was very good at both TEON and SOMERSET. Contrary to your erroneous comments about my previous posts, I never labeled him a "bad headwriter". Rick Edelestein's tenure on HOW TO SURVIVE A MARRIAGE was brilliant, but the ratings tanked. Pamela Long's work on TEXAS was actually quite good, but the ratings never went up enough to keep the show alive. Winsor, an old master at creating successful soap stories, knew what he was doing, and if he had been given a longer time to lure an audience in, he probably would have succeeded. Regardless of great writing, it took Bill Bell a few years to pull in viewers at Y&R, or Claire Labine to attract an audience at RYAN'S HOPE.

Edited May 29, 2012 by vetsoapfan

[vetsoapfan]

I have already addressed this in the correct, ANOTHER WORLD thread, but I'll be happy to explain again. Steven left Bay City for Australia first. Then Mary Matthews passed away in St. Croix. When the family found out about and dealt with Mary's passing, Steve was already gone. Alice had to call him to let him know what had happened. The timeline of events as I have outlined them does not contradict the summary posted on Eddie Drueding's AW homepage, which you are quoting, so I'm not sure why and what you fail to understand.

[toml1962]

LOL. My point is that what you wrote suggests the character was "off the show" which, to be specific, he wasn't, as the character left the show on the same day.

[toml1962]

Again, LOL. I will end it here with saying calling a show badly written does indicate a bad writer - that is my point.

As to good or bad writing being subjective, I would agree insomuch as it depends on personal taste, but then again, many people simply have bad taste, or cannot differentiate good writing/bad writing versus preference. Case in point the British series Eastenders. Many dislike its theme and content, but no one who paid attention could fail to realize how well-written the show has always been.

Oh brother. End chat.

[vetsoapfan]

Reviewing my original commentary on the AW thread, I realize that I had phrased it poorly. I said that George Reinholt had already been fired, and his character was already gone, when Mary Matthews passed away. That was, and is, accurate, but while Steve's leaving did indeed occur before Mary's dying, we saw both actors on that same, last day. Steve left earlier, and Mary's death was the ending cliffhanger. I hope this makes it clearer. I wouldn't want any confusion to ferment.

Edited May 29, 2012 by vetsoapfan

[vetsoapfan]

"I will end it here with saying calling a show badly written does indicate a bad writer - that is my point"

I'll be happy to explain again.

Saying a show is badly written when writer A is in charge, but that the quality is significantly better when writer B takes over, does NOT by any stretch of the imagination, indicate that the second scribe is a bad writer. Particularly when you specifically acknowledge his excellence. It's the nature of the beast that soaps' quality of writing rises and falls depending on who is in charge. Henry Slesar was excellent. During his tenure, Somerset was well written. That is what what I wrote, which I hope and trust most people who read the thread will understand.

Edited May 29, 2012 by vetsoapfan

[vetsoapfan]

"As to good or bad writing being subjective, I would agree insomuch as it depends on personal taste, but then again, many people simply have bad taste, or cannot differentiate good writing/bad writing versus preference. Case in point the British series Eastenders. Many dislike its theme and content, but no one who paid attention could fail to realize how well-written the show has always been."--Toml1962

Of course, claiming that other people have bad taste and cannot differentiate between quality and trash is an easy way to proclaim one's own supposedly superior opinion, but again, opinion is subjective and open to interpretation. Some of Somerset's writers were better than others; that's just the way it goes on soaps or any long-running series with a variety of creative personnel in charge.

Edited May 29, 2012 by vetsoapfan

[toml1962]

Am trying to find my copy of the shows original story bible. It makes for interesting reading. For example, Missy was to be the show's version of Alice; Pammy the show's Rachel, and Robert was supposed to die in about six months.

[Matt]

::scoots up next to Tom:: You'd be my new best friend.

[toml1962]

I like sharing information. Seems a shame to have all this just to myself. I know others feel differently. Once I set up photo bucket will be able to scan and share a lot more.

[toml1962]

Despite the fact that I did like much of what Roy did, he didn't exactly make a huge change to the show at first. All he did is what every other new head writer does - out with some of the old, in with HIS characters.

Slesar was on the show from January 1971 through early 1973. It was a year before he began to purge characters and bring in his own, and then largely due to the fall in ratings after the summer of 1971. IMO it would have made more sense to make those Moore/Matson characters Delaneys. This way he could have folded Robert, India and Jessica into the storyline and only let go of the lesser characters like Peter and the Davis family.

Edited May 29, 2012 by toml1962

[Susan Hunter]

I would love to read anything that you have to share Tom.

Can you provide any insight on how the show began? Was it PG's idea to do a spin-off or were they approached by NBC? How long was the spin-off in the works? Based on the first year, it seems as though they were just trying to do an hour version of Another World without calling it an hour and setting it 50 miles up the road. Were Sam and Lahoma that popular as to build an entire show around them? Was anyone else considered?