Y&R Episodes Discussion, Week of October 26, 2009

[Sylph]

Episode talk. For Engen, Adam, Muhney - Potpourri.

[dm.]

Yeah, sorry about that. Again.

[Cheap21]

What the heck was the poin of the Victor flashback episode? As good as it is to see old pics it felt like filler and was overdone. Why was he making a tape for Faith saying all that stuff. He does realize she is too young to understand any of that stuff? He made it seem as if he were leaving her life for good as if she wont still be a baby when he returns

Congratulations Billy Abbott; you are officially the biggest douchebag in Genoa City. Why is Mac with him? He is just too sleazy for her and I dont see what she sees in him. Its not like his personality compliments hers and theres not much chemistry to even drive them as a couple. She has potential but he brings her down. And lets not forget he is still married and nothing is being done about that

Loving the new revitilized Ashley. Lets hope she stays strong like this

Thank whoever is in charge for keeping Lily off my screen at least for one week

[Juliajms]

This was before EB's contract dispute was settled so there was every chance Faith would be a grown up before Victor ever came back. Hell, there was every chance Victor would never come back as far as anyone knew when that was taped. That's why they played Nadia's theme. I actually thought they could have done a bit more, but it wasn't too bad, imo.

[MarkH]

I do think they have to pay residuals for these flashbacks. The selection of clips was, in your words "puzzling". Which I take directly as: We're meant to solve the puzzle. I'm increasingly sure those male antagonists (Rick, Derek, Michael Scott) were not selected randomly.

I agree regarding Ashley, by the way.

Episode talk: I like the softer Adam (with Sharon) this week. I perceive -- and the actor confirms this in his recent CBS interview -- that he is not playing these emotions as "fake". He's feeling a genuine connection with Sharon which -- admittedly -- is made sweeter by Nicholas' jealousy. Muhney is selling me. I also like that he's a wiseacre...I buy his growing "bullish" antagonistic chemistry with Nick. I think this rivalry will revitalize both characters.

[DRW50]

I don't see the softer side, but even if I did, I would wonder where exactly Sharon is in this. Is this story all about us feeling pity for a violator of women, because he's friendly with a woman after he convinced her she had a dead, deformed baby?

Is that why they have her already over her grief, so the viewers will not have to deal with the sight of Adam comforting a woman who would normally have fallen to pieces over such a loss?

Even if they are friendly now, what was the bonding moment? They're closer now because he told her he manipulated and then spurned a gay man?

As for the clips, I don't think it was a puzzle, I think they were just trying to show all the different sides of Victor. The noble Victor, action hero Victor, vengeful Victor, Victor's arrival, etc.

[Juliajms]

I think it's about setting up the most dramatic reveal possible. If Sharon has a relationship with Adam, it's going to be all the more of a shock when she finds out what he did. Both Ashley and Sharon will feel double betrayal because of their friendship with Adam. Plus, I have to believe this will lead to a Nick/Sharon reunion with Nick swooping in to save Sharon from his twisted brother.

[DRW50]

Will the reveal be worth it if you're only seeing pieces moving, and not feeling like you know the characters?

I know "plot-driven" is overused, but I think there were many ways to get drama out of this story without having to rush an Adam/Sharon pairing. I don't really see Sharon anywhere in this story.

[Juliajms]

I don't think any of this is worth what they've done to the Adam character. I've hated his story since at least June. It's really sad to me that they have completely ruined a legacy character that many people waited years to have surface

in GC. There was so much potential there. I'm one of the few people I know who is rooting for Adam to get some kind of redemption, but I just don't see how it's possible.

[MarkH]

Yup, in the interview, Muhney even calls it "reverse Stockholm". By which he means to say that his reaching out is initially motivated by guilty and pity...but it is turning into something more.

Actually a lot of work on alexithymia suggests that the sharing of disclosures can serve as a bonding agent between people. What Adam shared was a disturbed sexual history. Sharon, in turn, felt a kindred spirit for her own disturbed sexual history. Thus, there were two points of contact: A common history in which they "acted out" sexually, and the fact that they would disclose this to one another. Even in real life, those kinds of revelations would make walls fall very quickly.

Let us also not forget Adam is Nick's brother, and a Newman. At a possibly non-conscious level, Adam offers a continued tie to the Newman clan (something she has clung to for her entire adult life)...and he may even have some genetic similarities to Nick and Victor...both are strong and sometimes non-verbal men, both are capable of doing dastardly things. Even at the pheromone level, Adam and Nick may have similarity. Honestly, I truly buy this.

Even if it cases some discomfort to Nick -- that she is with Adam -- that may be part of the appeal of Adam that Sharon can't even vocalize to herself. Nothing here feels wrong to me.

I disagree with you about those clips re: Victor. There are so so so many other examples they could have used to illustrate your points -- Victor driving a pitchfork into crazy Veronica Landers, Victor carrying Diane Jenkins over the threshold...

I believe these clips--esp. of Rick or Michael--are very intentional. I believe we are to believe that one of those dudes are returning to the canvas soon...maybe in a different guise.

Yup. And this is a soap opera. There is absolutely nothing wrong with constructing a story because it will have a wicked, twisted payoff at the end. That's what soaps do...

I wouldn't call it "plot driven", because so many parts of this feel to me like they are plausibly rooted in the recent and distant pasts of these characters.

[DRW50]

Perhaps they are Emily Peterson with a sex change operation.

Have any of the stories since this team arrived had wicked payoffs? I keep thinking of the flat as a pancake Patty shoots Victor/Colleen dies stuff. Or the complete non-fallout of Katherine and Jill being unrelated. Or the flat reveal of Chloe having Billy's child, not Cane's. Or Phillip's return.

I do appreciate your analysis. I just wish the show put as much effort into it. I don't think they have any real idea beyond, "Hey, this is Nick's brother, and he took Sharon's baby, so that means they have to get involved." The rest is filler.

[BadZoe]

I thought the point of this was much simpler than some of you are reading into this, Sharon neeeeeds a man to cope with everything in life. Heaven forbid she find a girlfriend, maybe even befriending someone at her bereavement group to talk to.

[Cheap21]

that explains the behind the scenes stuff but within the context of what was actually written on the show, it made little sense. Victor is simply leaving to seek some additional therapy following his recent procedure. He has every intention of coming back and every intention of being there for her Faith's upbringing

Unfortunetly I dont think there are any women for her to be friends with on the show. Maybe Ashley could work but that will ventually get messy once the baby switch is revealed

[BadZoe]

Why does it have to be an existing character and not a cheap newbie who can be all MAB's creation?

As for Ashley, there I thought the purpose of soap writing is to make things as messy as possible by the climax. Having Sharon torn over having to break Ashley's heart could work. Instead Sharon will just have to be mad and divorce her new hubby Adam.

[Scryber96]

Adam planted evidence to make it look like Patty was the stalker, so everyone assumes the guilty party has been caught.