Members Y&RWorldTurner Posted September 20, 2009 Members Share Posted September 20, 2009 To say that at the end of the day it all comes down to stories, as Rauch said, and then be apart of shoveling this crap out to us for the last 4-6 months is just insane. Interesting stories don't have to become crazy, looney toons which is what we have now. But I guess that's more Maria, Hogan, and Scott's problem. Nelson's "armchair psychiatrist" comment was about the ambiguities in the Mac/Rachel/Iris non-traditional triangle. Not about a psycho villain that has no motivation for doing the things she's doing or even a hint as to why she's doing the things she's doing, which is soap opera 101. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Y&RWorldTurner Posted September 20, 2009 Members Share Posted September 20, 2009 You know it's bad when soaps made "heaven" look more real and aesthetically pleasing in the 80's than Y&R recently did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members bellcurve Posted September 20, 2009 Members Share Posted September 20, 2009 Or even in the 90's when Charlotte Savitz sent Vicky to be with Ryan in heaven. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Y&RWorldTurner Posted September 20, 2009 Members Share Posted September 20, 2009 Yep, and by the end, AW's budget was really crappy, and they still managed to do it better than the #1 soap in 2009. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bright Eyes Posted September 20, 2009 Members Share Posted September 20, 2009 Hell, OLTL just recently with Viki visiting heaven again for the 40th did it better! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator Toups Posted September 20, 2009 Administrator Share Posted September 20, 2009 Rauch needs to retire. Though I never watched Santa Barbara, I will always dislike him for the cigar stomp. And some people still like this guy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members alphanguy74 Posted September 20, 2009 Members Share Posted September 20, 2009 Did you not read the interview? Here's the exact quote from the first sentence of Nelson's statement: "Most soaps spell everything out for its viewers, which takes the fun out of playing armchair psychologist"...... now, does the phrase, "Most soaps" sound like he's only talking about Mac/Rachel/Iris? He simply gives that as an EXAMPLE. But anyway... I don't think his production values have been bad, EXCEPT Thursday's episode. After reading his interview, many things he says disturbs me, but overall, the production hasn't been bad, I even caught the last minute of Thursday's episode, and while the CGI garbage looked cheap and HORRIBLE, the music they chose was nice. Of course, production wise, I'd STILL prefer Y&R with LONG reaction shots, longer scenes, more camera sweeps, and more and better use of dramatic cues...like for instance, on Friday's show, when Jack looked up to ses Patty holding the gun on him, they should have used the cue in this clip that starts at 4:42. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2sCJ_Erropo&feature=channel But Interviewers NEVER want to talk background score, and it drives me batshit crazy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Y&RWorldTurner Posted September 20, 2009 Members Share Posted September 20, 2009 Yes, an EXAMPLE where the ambiguities in that storyline made SENSE. So, judging from his example, that rule can't be applied to every other storyline in soaps, at least not to me. The obsession Iris had with her father could have been perceived as being borderline incestuous, but underneath it all, she was wounded daddy's girl that longed for her father's approval and attention all throughout her life - that was the motivation driving her. The same logic cannot be applied to a psycho villain who murders people and animals and intentionally hurts innocent little girls. You can't have someone doing bad thing after bad thing for MONTHS without a hint as to what's really triggered it or what brought them to that place. No one is asking for everything to be laid out for them, but soaps are all about clues and groundwork, and there's been no real motivation in the Patty/Mary Jane storyline. Her motivations are nonexistent, and nothing has been hinted at as to what made her life go so wrong. All a lot of people will see is a psycho who intentionally murders people and animals for no apparent reason. What you seem to not understand is that people are not asking for everything to be laid out for them, the basic soap opera rules of teasing the audience and creating suspense in doing that is all people are asking for. Without any sort of motivation, character-driven storyline do not exist. You seem to be endorsing storylines that are plot-driven and and where characters can always be altered to suit the latest plot point for shock value. Megan McTavish would be proud. I can't believe we're even comparing the rotten crap written by Maria Arena Bell & Company to one of Harding Lemany's greatest stories. This should be illegal. But oh well, continue to come up with excuses for bad writing and why things are they way they ever. Never mind that if it's not actually written on the show, it simply doesn't EXIST on the show. Fans shouldn't be coming up with rationalizations that don't exist on the show or that aren't even HINTED at on the show. But whatever, this discussion is pathetic, and you always refuse to see things from other perspectives. Your imagination and what actually happens on the show are two seperate things, I don't need to tell you that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members alphanguy74 Posted September 20, 2009 Members Share Posted September 20, 2009 Two hints: "Kitty, where did you put my PILLS??!!" "When Victor Found her, she was practically homeless." One must wait for the rest to be revealed. But I'm NOT saying this is some fabulous SL, I just don't have a problem with this SPECIFIC ASPECT of it. There's alot of other problems with it. One thing that made me SMILE was his assertion that a 60 minute show costs mroe than TWICE to produce than a 30 minute show. This is what I've been screaming about for YEARS... CBS should have cut BOTH GL and ATWT to 30 minutes, that was you hedge your bets aginst something coming in it's place that is a COMPLETE failure, you free up your hour of extra time on the schedule, and you don't lose the fanbase of a guaranteed show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Y&RWorldTurner Posted September 20, 2009 Members Share Posted September 20, 2009 So all homeless people and people that possibly have a drug dependency makes them automatic psychos? Sorry, that is no trigger for why PATTY WILLIAMS ended up the way she did. I don't think either situation is enough to turn one person into a murderous lunatic. Also, both aspects have either been mentioned once or completely forgotten throughout the course of the storyline. But oh well, let's agree to disagree. Apparently soaps cost more to produce as 30 minute shows than half hour shows, which is why most went to an hour long format in the late 70's/early 80's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members bellcurve Posted September 20, 2009 Members Share Posted September 20, 2009 Patty was not some 16 year old scared to return home if she was "practically homeless." She was a grown ass woman who had gotten over Jack after she shot him. And you mean to tell me that if she was thisclose to being out on the street, she couldn't find a job? Call her mother or her brothers? Call Jack for a job at Jabot? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members y&r_fan Posted September 20, 2009 Author Members Share Posted September 20, 2009 Amen to that. It's the most assinine discussion currently circulating SON. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SFK Posted September 20, 2009 Members Share Posted September 20, 2009 Could someone PLEASE explain this to me, I just don't get it. Actors, for one, are paid by the day of work, not the episode these days, so that I don't get... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Darn Posted September 20, 2009 Members Share Posted September 20, 2009 You're going after the wrong story here (Patty's been off the canvas for what, 20 years? I can buy that in the intervening years she went off her rocker), Adam's story is the one that makes absolutely no sense. Next to no motivation, no purpose, no drive, inconsistent characterization from EVERYONE. Adam went from normal to insane after a few months in jail, he's got everyone fooled. People that have been playing the game for 30 years here. It's a crazy shitty story and it seems to have no end in sight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Y&RWorldTurner Posted September 20, 2009 Members Share Posted September 20, 2009 The thing is, Patty left town after she found peace with Jack and she was still sane. I don't doubt that something could have gone wrong during her time off the show, but they haven't given us a hint as to what caused her downward spiral and mental instability and why she's a totally different character from the person we knew in the 80's. Something had to have triggered her to become a murderous psycho. It's like she does all these bad things, but they haven't even tapped into her backstory from her time off the show, so it all looks like she's doing all these things for the sake of doing them. We don't know why she's doing the things she's doing. It's not enough to say she's insane, since this is Patty Williams, and not some new psycho of the week. I totally agree, there's tons more holes in the Adam story. His motivations are the most effed up of all. I don't quite understand their intentions with this character, and I don't know how he can be redeemed at this point. But nor do I think after all she's done to so many people at this point can Patty be redeemed. But then again, they've whitewashed all of Gloria's crimes (even if she did spend a few months in prison), so they can do the same with these characters, unfortunately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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