Whatever it turns out to be, if TB is indeed playing Tres Philip and he indeed faked his death because he indeed is gay, that [!@#$%^&*] would make me scream at the top of my lungs. Extremely contrived BS, that's what it would be. I'd just keep his ass dead, to be honest. After watching Jesse Hubbard reveal that he faked his death for over 20 years, it would suck to see yet another character who died in a tragic way pop back up and say that he, too, faked his death for 20 years. Not cool.

If they can get it together and it makes sense, that'll be absolutely great. But somebody, ANYBODY, tell me a good, completely logical way that it would work.

Does she still SEEM like low-rent trailer trash to you? Her diction? Her dress? Her hair? Her self-presentation? Her dental work?

Yes, yes, yes, yes, and yes.

It's that old adage of "You can lead a horticulture, but you can't make her think".

I doupt that the return of a character who has been dead for over twenty years would please the Y&R audience. Especially if we are talking about a classic death. Y&R is not one of those soaps where you expect anything to happen. People don't come back from the dead and find out that they is related to everybody else just like that. I don't want Y&R to turn into DAYS, so I hope that the person we saw talk with Cane on the phone is not who we think he is. MAB is entering very dangerous territory with this, but I doupt she would introduce two characters with the same name at the same time.

MY problem with Gloria is that she doesn't look trailer-trash AT ALL.

Don't you think, with regard to Thom Bierdz, that if he comes back as not-Phillip that is going to be even worse. Another doppelganger?

(William Bardwell, Carmen Mesta's cousin, Allistair, Pheila). I only think this is not a total piece of sh!t if Bierdz is playing P3.

I'm going to assume that, if this is P3, it is the last of the "repair jobs" MAB needs to do, and that it relates more to Cane. After this, we'll be forward focused not past-repair focused.

As for Gloria, she is not trailer trash. Thus, I think we can assume she's managed to rise above, and actually improve her lot in life. I keep remembering that, for a brief time at Jabot, she was allowed to be smart with good ideas ("Perfume on the Glo" was a success). I wish they'd continue to let her develop in that direction.

If they can get it together and it makes sense, that'll be absolutely great. But somebody, ANYBODY, tell me a good, completely logical way that it would work.

Don't ask for speculation, because Sylph will savage it

What was the purpose of Billy getting involved with Lily??

Well you know that Lily can't be without a man for a few days.... the town would be in a state of shock....

Yes, yes, yes, yes, and yes.

It's that old adage of "You can lead a horticulture, but you can't make her think".

Good one, but I actually think it illuminates the core of Gloria, and part of what makes her so compelling.

She now carries many of the trappings of a "horticulture"...but she is still reckless and acquisitive and greedy and survival oriented. We see the damage at her core continuing to motivate reckless actions she could long since have left behind. Like Adam's "evil in a milquetoast package", Gloria's "desperation wrapped in the trappings of success" is a contradiction that makes her so riveting to study.

Don't you think, with regard to Thom Bierdz, that if he comes back as not-Phillip that is going to be even worse. Another doppelganger?

(William Bardwell, Carmen Mesta's cousin, Allistair, Pheila). I only think this is not a total piece of sh!t if Bierdz is playing P3.

I'm going to assume that, if this is P3, it is the last of the "repair jobs" MAB needs to do, and that it relates more to Cane. After this, we'll be forward focused not past-repair focused.

As for Gloria, she is not trailer trash. Thus, I think we can assume she's managed to rise above, and actually improve her lot in life. I keep remembering that, for a brief time at Jabot, she was allowed to be smart with good ideas ("Perfume on the Glo" was a success). I wish they'd continue to let her develop in that direction.

Let's just say that after watching Friday's episode I would prefer that we never hear another word about Langley again Summer's paternity seems like that something that needs to be fixed before this.

I hated it when Gloria was becoming Jill 2.

Well you know that Lily can't be without a man for a few days.... the town would be in a state of shock....

Lily is so wonderful that even her brother is in love with her. Who is Billy not to fall for her??

Let's just say that after watching Friday's episode I would prefer that we never hear another word about Langley again Summer's paternity seems like that something that needs to be fixed before this.

That would actually be FASCINATING. To use Friday's scene to launch a storyline reminding us Cane is a con...but to never show Langley again! Or, at least, not soon. To let that be a dangling twist that we suffer for a long time with before it is revealed. I actually like that very much.

And SHAME ON YOU for remotely MENTIONING Summer's paternity. That's SEALED. She's Nick's daughter. End of discussion . Any other option would threaten the integrity of the character of Nick, and I'm not interested in seeing that.

(And yes, in the post-Sharon era...until he started sleeping with her again...I believe Nick was the Y&R character with the highest integrity level on the show. At least since John died.)

Gloria's "desperation wrapped in the trappings of success" is a contradiction that makes her so riveting to study.

"Riveting to study" no, interesting to watch YES!!. Glo's a grifter and her actions say to me that she's proud of it. As far as being "trailer trash", because that term means different things to different people, I find it difficult to use.

I'd say-- she wanted IT all, she wanted IT immediately, and she went about getting IT the only way she knew how. IT of course being wealth. Glo is by no means un-intelligent and if she is to be kept on canvas she'll definitely need some kind of back story to explain what other than greed makes her tick.

Edited May 16, 200916 yr by JSROCKS

That would actually be FASCINATING. To use Friday's scene to launch a storyline reminding us Cane is a con...but to never show Langley again! Or, at least, not soon. To let that be a dangling twist that we suffer for a long time with before it is revealed. I actually like that very much.

And SHAME ON YOU for remotely MENTIONING Summer's paternity. That's SEALED. She's Nick's daughter. End of discussion . Any other option would threaten the integrity of the character of Nick, and I'm not interested in seeing that.

(And yes, in the post-Sharon era...until he started sleeping with her again...I believe Nick was the Y&R character with the highest integrity level on the show. At least since John died.)

If someone can bring back a character who died years ago in a way that makes sense, I am sure changing Summer's patternity without ruining Nick must be a piece of a cake.

BTW, I always liked Nick and I hated how the Jack/Sharon/Nick/Phyllis mess ruined his relationship with Jack who was like a father to him for years. The only time I hated the character was when Adam first showed up and there was a dinner party at the AC where Nick was not very nice to him.

Oh God no. If in 2009, we have a story about someone faking his death and abandoning his family cos of shame of being gay, I will puke my insides out and eat them. Eeeeeew.

His reasons, if this does happen, have to be completely separate.

Oh God yes! I too am starting to think this is the most likely scenario. I have come to realize one thing about these writers lately. They are not that "deep" and they have to make it simple or maybe it is the fact that we have become too smart at figuring this stuff out!! Maybe I watch to much CSI and Law & Order, I don't know. But about the only think that shocked me was just seeing TB's face again. I will reserve judgement until I see the s/l myself. Sort of like the Sharon s/l, started off well, hyped to the hilt only to get to where the writers think they were being so smart and twisty, a predictable 3 WTD s/l with 3 dumbasses!!

Oh God yes! I too am starting to think this is the most likely scenario. I have come to realize one thing about these writers lately. They are not that "deep" and they have to make it simple or maybe it is the fact that we have become too smart at figuring this stuff out!! Maybe I watch to much CSI and Law & Order, I don't know. But about the only think that shocked me was just seeing TB's face again. I will reserve judgement until I see the s/l myself. Sort of like the Sharon s/l, started off well, hyped to the hilt only to get to where the writers think they were being so smart and twisty, a predictable 3 WTD s/l with 3 dumbasses!!

:lol: :lol: :lol:

But all my theories (or Cashton's, or whomever's) can be roundly dismissed and pilloried. Who gives a sh!t. That's just fan-board discussion. I have no creative control over the show . Vis-a-vis the show, we can only judge when they tell us what they have put together.

I am just absolutely fascinated at the amount and speed of your speculations! That's all!

Don't ask for speculation, because Sylph will savage it

True! I don't really like speculation. Not even, actually: especially not on shows like Lost. When those people start talking about what that Island actually is. Go let those writers write; I am interested in their version and their version only. Meaning, the canon. Especially if those speculations are totally clichéd: aliens and all...

I am just absolutely fascinated at the amount and speed of your speculations! That's all!

Khan will accuse me of being pedantic again, but you should look into "narrative psychology". The gist of it "We need to give meaning to experience. We do so by creating a narrative within which it all makes sense".

As I have said ad nauseum, I have a 36-year history with show. Others have long durations as well.

So, when a "surprise" comes to the screen, we need to make it fit. Thus, we create the narrative.

That narrative serves as a placeholder until the show provides us with the "actual" narrative.

But surely this is commonplace. Actors do it all the time, for example, to "fill in the blanks" of character motivation until the writers offer them something more concrete.

Thus, the "amount and speed" of my speculations is nothing but the usual and normal cognitive tricks that most humans do in most situations.

If you are not doing this, it simply suggests you're less invested in Y&R, and care less. You're more "outside" the narrative.

Khan will accuse me of being pedantic again, but you should look into "narrative psychology". The gist of it "We need to give meaning to experience. We do so by creating a narrative within which it all makes sense".

As I have said ad nauseum, I have a 36-year history with show. Others have long durations as well.

So, when a "surprise" comes to the screen, we need to make it fit. Thus, we create the narrative.

That narrative serves as a placeholder until the show provides us with the "actual" narrative.

But surely this is commonplace. Actors do it all the time, for example, to "fill in the blanks" of character motivation until the writers offer them something more concrete.

Thus, the "amount and speed" of my speculations is nothing but the usual and normal cognitive tricks that most humans do in most situations.

If you are not doing this, it simply suggests you're less invested in Y&R, and care less. You're more "outside" the narrative.

I know all that. It's not about that at all.

I think what you have to know, or you already do but somehow I'm not entirely sure, your rationalisations and the way you fill in the blanks might, and actually is, totally different from the version a person sitting next to you might come up with.

Anyway, I want to ask you another thing: how's the mood on Usenet about Y&R? Many long-time viewers there...

Everyone's just jumping to one conclusion--that because P3 might be alive, Katherine didn't switch the babies. Who's to say that Katherine didn't switch the babies and Cane isn't still Jill's son? And after faking his death, P3 discovered this and helped send Cane to worm his way into their good graces?