The Politics Thread

[DRW50]

 

I often hear people in the UK say that there is more of a pretense of being anti-racism but in reality it is out there. In the US these days the pretense seems to be long gone. 

 

I don't think anyone believes the US has moral ground over the UK. It's just until recent years there was no real question that the UK was a superior place. I feel like, even with some of their history of toxic leaders, it wasn't that long ago that a man who joked about pickaninnies, bum boys, and called burqas mail slots would not be worshiped as a god by so many. The veneer of respectability is well and truly gon.

[DramatistDreamer]

 

Pretense?  Which people say that?  

I would say that there is a veneer of politeness and wit but the racism and xenophobia are always there and it's always made plain.  

 

When I was studying in London. I saw a play about a young black man, a teenager, who had died in police custody after being beaten nearly to death by a horde of white youths.  This was based on a true story and as it would turn out, years later, I discovered that the guy who died was born the same year and from the same ethnic group as me.

I remember as a child in the '80s there was a case of a young black man, a teenager, who had died after being beaten nearly to death by a horde of white youths in Queens, NY.  It was the talk of every public affairs show.

 

In the U.K. and the U.S., it's like what flavour of racism can you expect.  A death in police custody after being beaten to death by truncheons or a death in police custody after being shot in the back.  And both use the n-word.

A Bangladeshi friend once told me about England "they never let you forget that you are a guest in their country, you could have lived there for decades and they'd never let you forget".  I'd say that in America, you are led to believe that you belong until you claim that you belong, then you will be put in your place to show that, actually you don't belong here, even if you were born here.

 

And I personally met a lot of people who lacked a modicum of respectability in England, lol, same as in the good 'ole US of A.

[Vee]

 

 

[DramatistDreamer]

Is it any wonder that the Trump administration has been in such a frenzy to try to remake the courts? The courts are literally the only institution standing in the way of the country's complete undoing, at this point.  Of course, someone might make the claim that the courts started this mess in the first place with Citizen's United. 

I just hope that Republicans don't figure out a way to disenfranchise Samoans some other way, like at the ballot box now that they can actually vote in elections.

[JaneAusten]

I have said from day 1, get a democrat in office who will pack the courts I don't care. Biden promising a return to normalcy, forgetting what these people have been doing for 30 plus years ain't it. I've been encouraged by a couple of things coming from him, finally denouncing our support for the Saudi's, a much bolder healthcare plan to build on the ACA than I expected, but none of this will matter with the current senate. And we know the GOP is going to hang Hunter Biden around his neck and the media will play along without a peep about Ivanka, Jared etc just like they did with Hillary's emails.

 

But get someone in who will stack the courts. I don't care. Time to play the same games these clowns are.

 

@DramatistDreamer

 

I am curious what you think about DUP losing in Northern Ireland. Does it really matter? The Tories don't need them anymore for the majority but why do you think they lost seats to Sinn Fein and what does this all mean for Northern Ireland?

[Khan]

 

ICAM.  The gloves have LONG needed to come off on the Democrats.  Bill and Hillary can't be the ONLY Dems who are willing to get their hands dirty.

[DramatistDreamer]

 

Okay, I had to go back and do a bit of reading because I admit to being less than fully conscientious in paying attention to Northern Ireland.  (True story: I used to watch a weekly broadcast of RTE years ago, but since dropping cable, I haven't really watched on a regular basis.  I'll have to try to catch a regular livestream in the immediate future.)

From what I remember, the DUP seemed to have tied their party and the fate of their party to a semi-partnership with the Tories.  It didn't work out, to put it mildly.  From what I've been reading, Ireland pretty much rejected parties that were not in the center.  Both the DUP and Sinn Fein (fun fact: a member of Sinn Fein once spoke to my class when I was a student in London, but that's whole n'other story) lost seats overall (DUP was the biggest loser of all) in yesterday's elections, while the Alliance party took the most gains.  So the parties that were considered either extreme right or extreme left actually lost ground and the party in the center gained seats.  We'll have to see how it impacts Northern Ireland going forward but based on this article in The Irish Times, the results seem to suggest that most Northern Irish prioritized looking toward the EU over the possibility of a united Ireland, which, tbh, I never truly thought a united Ireland was actually a genuine possibility, despite mulling it over in my mind a couple times in the past. 

 

 

 

By the way, here is the article in The Irish Times that I was referencing.

 

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/editorial/the-irish-times-view-on-the-northern-ireland-election-heartening-results-1.4114734

Despite the fact that it's an Op-Ed, I thought it gave a concise summary without too much prognostication.

[DramatistDreamer]

Hm.

 

[JaneAusten]

These statements from Cenk were not new. It's not believable to me that Sanders campaign didn't know before the endorsement

Edited December 13, 2019 by JaneAusten

[JaneAusten]

@DramatistDreamer

 

I don't know if you have seen this article. Thought you'd be interested. The SNP wants another referendum - said it was promised to them - Boris right now says no - says he will work to win Scotland over. Good luck. They detest him there and is one of the reasons from what I have been reading SNP picked up all those seats.

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/12/13/boris-johnson-launch-scotland-charm-offensive-telling-nicola/

[DramatistDreamer]

 

Looks like Johnson has decided to change his tone.  As recently as yesterday there were reports that he was practically ordering Scotland to get with the program.  He must have realized that orders won't work with the Scots, so now he's attempting a charm offensive.  Well, he usually gets the offensive part down pat.

[ReddFoxx]

Scotland is by far the most liberal of the UK countries so it will be interesting exactly how a clearly right-wing Prime Minister like Johnson will appeal to them.

[Khan]

Which reminds me, I really need to check out that "Braveheart" movie everyone's going on about.

[DRW50]

 

I imagine it will be Thatcher all over again. They loathed her and that loathing has been a key part of their relationship with the Tories ever since. The only real difference is Johnson is less of a hardline conservative and more of an opportunist. He just wants power and money. 

 

And Northern Ireland has had no government for two years now. Some think voters decided to punish the major parties to tell them to get back to work. 

 

Absolutely. All this came up when Cenk made his announcement and the response from his fan club was usually "Oh he apologized." Which was interesting, as that never seems to be enough for people who are opposed by TYT or their fan club. 

 

(my favorites are the people who say he made those comments in his 20s yet no one cares that Elizabeth Warren was a Republican in her 40s. Plenty of people care, and he did not make all the comments when he was in his 20s.)

 

It will also be interesting to see how the Bernie bros react to their messiah "selling out" and being part of "the establishment," as this is a classic move of someone who is trying to be part of the establishment rather than staying with the dregs.

Edited December 14, 2019 by DRW50

[DramatistDreamer]