DRW50

I remember reading that Morgan's character seduced every leading man on the show (who wasn't related to her). Did that happen quickly? It seems kind of unusual, but then, the early 80s were probably when the soaps were at their most risque.

Margaret Ladd is superb in the first season episodes I've watched so far (I'm up to around midseason or closer to the end than that). The episode where she was in a dreamlike state wandering around and Lance caused her to have a miscarriage was just some of the best acting I've seen in a primetime soap. I don't mind the episodes so much because they are setting things up but it annoys me how many times episodes end with the Giobertis being shocked that Angela is a schemer or had a conflict with Jason or might be keeping something secret. Then it's all dropped again. There's also a lot of repetition with Lance trying to learn the secret, or Julia, to no avail. What confuses me most is how Angela is desperate to keep this secret about Jason's death yet she starts going away all the time. Emma's a mess, Emma's saying things...bye everybody, I'm going to Rome for weeks! Really? Emma's falling apart, don't go near Emma...I'm going into town! Why didn't they have her like Elizabeth on Dark Shadows and she never leaves the estate? There are also the number of times Lance does horrible things (which he never pays for) and she either says, "Don't do that" but then smirks, or she never knows. It undercuts her. There was the episode where he was a dictator while she was away. Wouldn't it have made more sense if she told him she'd set all that up to test him, and he'd failed? I think Cole, Maggie, and Chase work well in their roles at this time but I still don't understand why they cast such a mature actress to play Vicky if Vicky was supposed to be an ingenue. I also get confused about her age - she never mentions any type of school and then suddenly they say she's in high school. Did I miss something? Then there's the story about her running off because Lance schemed to get her out of the way to cause strife with the family. The scenes got to be a little bizarre, and again I'm not sure about the actress being right, especially when Michael Zaslow (who should have been cast in a stronger role - why not Lance's father, or Chase?) basically tried to get her to start masturbating. Then you have Maggie and Chase wandering around looking for her as a kaleidoscope version of "Chuck E's in Love" plays softly. The whole episode about illegal immigrants and exploitation was ahead of its time, and I wish they'd kept Vicky's boyfriend, or the A Martinez character, around. I notice that these episodes seem to have to struggle to integrate the two families in the episodes. Their connections seem a little forced (like Lance getting Vicky to run away, or Angela promising to help with the illegal situation and then it's never mentioned again). What did you think of Angela's husband, Julia and Emma's father? I liked him, I wish he'd stayed longer, and that we'd seen more of him with his daughters, especially Julia. It was nice to see his relationship with Angela, which seems very complex, and romantic.

I guess I was thinking of Virginia Dwyer, as Lemay detailed her not being courteous enough to Hugh Marlowe in scenes - he also did the same with Val Dufour. I guess I wonder if on a show like L&F, if it would have helped if someone had been a bit of a spotlight hog and jumped out at viewers. Daytime TV Stars had surprisingly detailed and incisive soap critiques in the mid/late 70s. It's a bit startling to read now. SOD tended to move more and more away from criticism and in the last ten years or more has just had Carolyn Hinsey to sort of pretend to be critical. But it's amazing sometimes reading even SOD and seeing them be so openly critical or in some cases, like the Diva columns, nasty. I guess TPTB in daytime began to believe that soap magazines being negative affected the ratings (I doubt it did). I wonder if the Internet, which was often described as mean or negative by soap magazines in the late 90s, had an impact on their tone.

I'm sorry about your friend. I hadn't heard of this book Meredith is writing - that should be interesting. Did you see Andrea when she had a small role on GH last year? I have some other LiaMST stuff I will post when I get it together.

I'd forgotten Lee had been on soaps that early. So this was another lead role Susan inherited. I wonder if they should have kept the young couple - that might have brought in some of the younger demo who would soon be drawn in by shows like Dark Shadows.

Wow! This was unbelievable to read. How did they get all those screencaps? Are those episodes available? Or did they take them at the time? No wonder fans were upset. This makes the cliffhangers to Soap and Capitol seem tame. I can't believe that this was the last episode. This show sounds good, much better than what I thought based on the basic plot. A lot of this, like Ann torn between the men and her career struggles, seems very ahead of its time. It's a shame Susan Brown spent the last 25 years of her daytime career in a supporting role. She was the lead actress on so many soaps yet most of those didn't last.

I thought LL was fine as Jocelyn, and I like the idea of the toxic upbringing of Danny and Jocelyn and how it affected them (if The City was going to do "shocking" stories then I think an incest story between them might have made more sense than the stuff with Azure and with the racism story). I just didn't think she and Alex were a great match, they were both too droll and detached.

Thanks for sharing that with us. I posted an old article on her in the main soap section (in the thread about her passing) but hadn't seen that. The classic soap discussion here is such a fantastic experience - so many here have so many memories and so much information, it makes the soaps come alive again, even those we will never be able to see. Honestly I enjoy it more than anything on the existing soaps in quite some time. I and several others have posted a lot of story stuff and articles in various threads so I hope you can read it and share your own thoughts/memories. If there's anyone or any show you want to see more of let me know.

I think the problem for me was I never cared for Alex/Jocelyn and I thought Tess was sort of at loose ends much of the time (which I guess is why they threw her at Buck eventually). I remember they had it where Ava was keeping the kids from Alex, or whatever, and some fans were upset about that. The City was in such transition in those early months and I think they could have used more stability. It was something they didn't really get until Tracy arrived, which was too late. If they weren't going to have any of the old guard like Ava or Stacey then I would have kept Deborah around for a while.

Thanks. I asked because I never know what is out there, in terms of information, previously at WOST, or here (although I looked in the archives). I'd love to read more.

Willis was recast. So was Emma. I think Mac was also recast. That was about it I think, under Lemay. The only major one in that was Willis as Mac and Emma were smaller roles pre-recast. Bucky I am just fascinated by what you wrote. Do you think Daytime TV was more in the pocket than early Digest or were they all more free-minded? I know that soap history analysis said it was the Reinholt firing/Courtney leaving and all sides telling their stories that made the soap press grow up, as it were, but even before then the press seemed more mature than what we have now, which often seems like a press release. If you had cast L&F who would you have cast in the roles? The other thing I wonder about is that Rauch and Lemay seemed to have no time for actors who were not low-key and who did not keep a calm presence onset. Can a new soap have that and still continue? Or do they need some volatile, live-wire actors who communicate to the audience?

They did mention him at that time yes - I think he might not have been close to Ryder, I can't remember. He last appeared at Nancy's wedding to Mac in late 1988 (those episodes are on Youtube under Oakdalian). He was last mentioned in Lisa's 50th anniversary episode when they had Chris playing Don and Katie playing Lisa (which I thought was inappropriate and odd, but whatever). I still wish they had brought Penny back for Nancy's funeral.

I had the same thought. I kept thinking, "Where is Susan?" Thanks for confirming it. Robert Hogan seemed to be on just about everything, finally ending up at RH briefly. What happened to Mike Milker? Sorry if all this was already known - I had never seen it before so wanted to share it.

Faison. A great Guza story, huh I think he also wrote Dinah Lee/Ava on the run. I think it would have helped if they'd brought a few vets in for a while, because I think that they did get new viewers, but they also lost viewers IMO, as they gave Loving viewers little reason to want to stay tuned, and in some ways you might say they even sent a message to Loving viewers not to keep watching.

Thanks for all the extra information. I guess O'Keefe was after the boy in the episode where Tommy talks to Grandpa Hughes and then Bob. I thought he was a good little actor. Perhaps they should have kept him around. That ATWT tribute book last year interviewed Don Hastings about all the Toms. I'll have to read that part again. They should have had Don return as a widower and pursue Ellen in the early 90s. Why do you think Don never really clicked as a character?

Shana was an Alden right? Did she have a lot of interaction with them? Do you think they were right to fire her? I remember SOD saying that Lisa Peluso and Jean le Clerc had no chemistry the first time around and had no more the second. I never knew about Jeremy/Stacey. It seemed like Stacey was in a flux after Jack was written out. How long was it between then and Buck's arrival? Do you think the show should have considered putting Stacey on The City? I wonder if The City might have had more of a chance if they'd brought in more long-term vets. I remember that I resisted The City for a while when I knew Ava wasn't going to be there.

The August 1966 TV Picture Life has a one-page feature on the show's cancellation, and the protest mail they received. ABC gave the magazine resolutions to all the dangling plots: Susan and Dan Garrett (Peggy McCay-Paul Picerni) - Jerry Karr and Peter Houghton: After a strong emotional battle for all the four characters - Susan, because of the attraction for the first man she loved; Dan, because he senses this and even contemplates divorce to let Susan start out with her first family; Jerry, because he is torn between love for his real father and love for Dan, his only true image of solidarity and authoritative love; and Peter, because of his deep love for his son - Jerry would eventually have been left with the Garretts. Anne and Walker Reynolds Susan Brown-Mike Mikler): Not because of Walter's impending blindness, but because Anne would have realized that her love for Walter was all-important, she would attempt a reconciliation. She would at first be rejected, Walter being convinced she was motivated by pity rather than love. However, in the end she would convince him, and their marriage would be resumed. Gillie and Jill (Robert Hogan - Brenda Benet): After a fight between Jill and Anne, Jill would eventually have married Gillie. Their marriage would have been rocky in the beginning - Gillie expecting too much maturity from Jill. After she attends college at his suggestion, they would have found their way to a happier marriage, partly because of psychiatric guidance. Carol West (Susan Seaforth): Carol would withdraw from Walter's life and eventually marry Peter.

Running from October 5, 1964 to March 25, 1966, 3:30 to 4 PM EST, focusing on, to paraphrase Schemering, the marital problems of four couples in the suburbs. Written by Elward and Frances Rickett, produced by Richard Dunn and Eugene Burr, directed by Frank Pacelli and Livia Granito. Cast included future DAYS stars Susan Seaforth and Brenda Benet, and longtime soap vet Peggy McCay, along with Susan Brown, Norma Connolly, and others. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N5vxSvNuK_o

Thank you so much for all this information! Just fascinating. Colby and Rita Mae? Really? So I guess Babbin killed off Jim Vockek and his son with Shana? I wonder if that was a mistake. I remember that SOD said when Shana and Leo were fired that Alex and Ava replaced them, essentially, in the story. To me that seems odd because I thought Shana and Ava were very different. I'd like to see the story with Lily and the homeless people. I am always fascinated by truncated strike stories. I wonder if they had planned to write Lily out right after the crazy stuff and she just hung on or if they had plans which never happened.

I wonder if it's because the new soaps of the 70s - with the exception of How to Survive a Marriage - seemed to be strong right off the bat (I'm not sure if Somerset counts as 70s as it was mostly created in 1969). And then the high expectations on Lemay and Rauch. It's strange though that the Digest was this critical. Perhaps that was just the phase at the time, as they were often critical of Mary Hartman.

I never knew that either. I wonder if she helped him get his job at ATWT (probably not as that was a few years later). I wish we could see some of Secret Storm from that era. As you mentioned, I loved her on Ryan's Hope. She was the second Joanna - I think Audrey Landers was the first.

I wonder if they are even going to use the doctor. I think they wanted everyone to be shocked and amused that Sally was dating her daughter's pornographer, but I thought it made Sally look like a terrible mother and also made a joke of any idea that she was somehow "stronger" without Kevin. Strong doesn't = being with a man who lied to you and tried to get your daughter to get a boob job. They always seem to want us to laugh at Rosie whether it's actually funny or not. Half the time they just have her yell her lines. The only one at this point in the family I find believable is Sophie, mostly because she's the only one they haven't turned into a ha ha shoutfest.

I think that it would have been better if the show hadn't given Kym Marsh any dramatic material during her pregnancy. (Frankly I wouldn't give her any dramatic material ever, since she can't act, but that's something else entirely). I'm not entirely sure whether this story would have worked for anyone, but it makes no sense to me with Michelle or with Maria. It seems even more bizarre with Maria because they casually trashed many years of friendship between Maria and Audrey. This seems like generic woman in peril, with a large dollop of "she was asking for it," which is sad. I still don't understand why Collinson has such a need to degrade female characters. But at the very least give the story to someone who can act.

I will be happy to see Todd again but his return story sounds...odd, from the spoilers. Collinson seems to like to try wacky comedy but I don't know if it's ever worked (I am still confused as to why they had Sally get together with her daughter's pornographer). It will be nice to see Violet again, to make up for her exit story. I was wondering what you thought of the world's most lackadaisal attempted rape. Why they would give this story to Maria I don't know, as Samia Smith can't do terror or drama (she is much better at breezy comedy and one-liners, or was, when the show gave her that). They apparently planned to do this story with Michelle but that also makes no sense to me because why would you give this type of story to a pregnant actress who lost a baby a few years ago? The whole story is so rushed and as with a lot of the show now I think it lacks energy. I don't think Peter/Leanne will last long. The show choosing to reunite them the very same week they split up and have them deal with none of their issues seems telling. I just don't know what the options are. Carla/Peter probably, but I have never believed she loves him and it just seems like a lot of melodrama lifted from a 1943 women's picture.