General Hospital: March 2023 Discussion Thread

[dragonflies]

 

[carolineg]

I somehow blocked out Luke's DID.  That might have done it.  I only said Kate/Connie because that's where I think the tide started to really turn for Ron as far as fan/critical praise. I think Ron really struggles with execution, but I see how his ideas on Days are decent in theory.  I don't think his ideas toward the end of his GH run were even passable.  I am not even sure Ron was ever the right fit for GH, but the beginning of his run was fantastic and exactly what GH needed to survive at the time. 

I agree about Guza.  Guza just ran out of ideas at the end and I think botching the Brenda return was really the final nail in the coffin for him.  But at least things happened and the show had excitement even if he was literally ripping off his own greatest hits at the end lol. 

[Liberty City]

I detect no lies.

What're your opinions on Garin Wolf's stints as head writer?

[carolineg]

I can only speak for 2011 because he's also listed as HW for 2008 briefly, but I have no idea what was happening at that time.  I thought it was okay after Guza.  I think it was slower paced and felt temporary.  I remember liking some things like the way Sonny was written_, and I think he finally ended the Lisa story which is great, but I think there were a lot of things that just ended up dropped like Shawn/Carly and both Abby/Siobhan getting killed off lol.  I hated the Franco/Sam/Jason honeymoon stuff, but I was interested in where he was going with Robin's HIV and Jason's illness.  But then he did things like make Johnny Claudia's son which was ridiculous.  I think it's just hard to say because it was so brief, but I still hear people say they enjoyed his stint.  I was pretty indifferent though. 

[Vee]

Kate/Connie was horrible, but it was also very much a car accident that people simply couldn't stop watching. You had no idea what Kelly Sullivan's extra ass would do on-camera from day to day. The other thing is that it was smack dab in the middle of a year full of some good or at least very engaging stories in 2012-2013. There was so much rocky shít in that timespan but also a lot of compulsively watchable stuff, be it good (the water crisis, Heather's baby swap, A.J.'s return), bad (Trey/Kristina) or very ugly like Connie.

That has always been the key to Ron's qualified successes: He knows how to make even a bad show often compulsively watchable.  I thought the show was a flaming Viking funeral for much of 2013-2015, but I could not stop watching to see what insane madness he did next, or for, yes, the few characters or stories I still did unequivocally enjoy. I would argue that DAYS fans today often feel the same as we did in those years, or at certain points in his equally variable OLTL run. You have no clue what crazy shít they'll put onscreen.

I think Ron could've worked at GH long term with a steady and most importantly equally powerful co-HW with more discipline and experience at the show (Karen Harris, Michele ValJean, etc). But since he seems to have disappeared Sheri Anderson at DAYS I can't see that ever happening. And yes, 2014-2015 and the Fluke saga, Denise, Franco/Nina, etc. was his worst.

Edited April 3, 2023 by Vee

[carolineg]

KSu was definitely also a hilarious train wreck.  I can't unsee her retelling of her rape/Trey's conception with the physical gyrations and hysterics lol.  I remember people touting her Broadway background and she sure was acting to the cheap seats on camera.  It was watchable in a car accident like way, but I really remember thinking it was going off the rails quickly for Ron there and it just kept going.

Yes, Ron probably could have been okay with a co-writer, but I could say the same for Guza.  If they had people reigning them in they could have been (more) successful.  

Days is so wacky on its own that I do think Ron fits better.  It's more his vibe.  That's not to say he does a great job, but a lot of his ideas feel like they actually could work better than they do and often shows are very watchable.  They are often very unwatchable as well.  I just feel like Ron comes in guns blazing and gets tired and lazy quickly which is common with soap writers.  I mean, how many times can Marlena beat death or John has to fight the crazy supervillian?  I just do think Ron used his best stuff immediately to save GH-and he did, but then was running on empty reusing old ideas and had no real plan for longevity. 

[Vee]

I think a lot of Ron's ideas (at many shows) are often good on paper. The problem is execution, taste and often pacing and/or budget. I think sci-fi and adventure at GH was absolutely in his wheelhouse, and I believe he dearly loves the show and the genre. I was among his very first boosters at OLTL, well before Daytime Confidential*, because I could tell from the first day he took over that the show had changed for the better. (I actually got banned from old Llanview Online for being 'too positive' about the show in the fall of 2007!)

But I think RC's ego, his taste and his belief in himself (puffed up by the online scene) that he is the last king of all daytime have atrophied a lot of his skills. You can love something as much as you want, but if your only view of how to create it or build it becomes super-tacky or devolves into lazy camp every time, that's the issue. And that's how it's been for Ron for a long time now.

(* - I'll just mention again that it took Jamey Giddens years to admit he'd never really paid attention much to OLTL before Ron took over, and only started watching in 2004. That always cracked me up.)

[carolineg]

The sci-fi stuff he did on GH didn't really work for me.  I still side eye the Lulu frozen by Stavros nonsense and the masks.  I can see how people would love Ron in the beginning too, but I already had my antennas up when he started on GH with him bringing the OLTL actors over and having Brenda fake sleep with Michael.   It worked fine, but it felt like he didn't get GH or the characters exactly and was doing what he wanted.

I actually agree with pretty much everything else you said.  I can tell he loves and knows the genre.  I can tell he does his research, but as @titan1978 said in their thread sometimes the use of history is just thrown around and not organic.  But I do think he is sadly one of the last good talents to write in this genre in the last decade or so.

[Vee]

Oh, that part was disgusting.

I think at the initial time, bringing the OLTL stars on was a wise gimmick to get more eyes on the show given the heat OLTL had even while going off the air. Everyone knew it was a disservice that the show got canned. Spinning the entire canvas around them or contorting existing GH characters for them (Carly would never have sided with Todd against Jason after discovering he'd stolen Jason's child) is what made it go south, but I thought they mostly worked in specific roles. It was bringing them back as completely different people that totally jumped the shark IMO, even if it gave us Ava.

[carolineg]

I don't disagree that bringing the OLTL characters in at first worked.  It just sparked my concern because it was clear it was going to be RC's show.  The focus was heavy on them, but the OLTL characters did fit okay.  It was reusing them right away that was the issue as you said.  I do think there is a way of capitalizing on a fanbase and not alienating GH's core fanbase and I think that line was crossed.   It felt very focused on OLTL characters when I had really no affection or care for them as that was never my soap.  It was all risky IMO.  I probably would have waited to introduce them because obviously it was a legal mess, but it could have been done without such a clear agenda.

[titan1978]

As Vee said- it’s his taste level that has gotten him into more issues with me.

[Taoboi]

3-28

 

Well, I'll say this much...it's nice to see villains actually do villain things on screen. I knew Eileen was going to sell out Anna and Valentin. They should have never brought her in. It would only wind up with her dead. And suuuure enough...but hey! It was satisfying seeing Victor toss her over the bridge. It shows he can be a threat. I also think his days are numbered. Especially now that he's onto Anna and Valentin.

 

And darn! They really made people work for that second Sprina kiss, didn't they? I was so annoyed Esme interrupted the other day. But it was just *swoons* And it seems AC is bulking up so they look great together. Speaking of which, I LOVE what TA was wearing. 

 

And I wanted to throw something at the tv for the Chase/BLQ flameout right when they are going to get back together. And now they are in scenes for the Nurses Ball showing nothing, but longing. If I didn't love the actors, I would be over it.

 

And with Lucy losing her S&*T over the Nurse Ball, I found this week so far has been well balanced with action, drama, AND humor. 

 

Sad to see Cameron go. Thankfully WL gave interviews saying he might be around during the summer. And I loved how they played up his exit by maybe he being the force to get Esme to work for some redemption. 

 

And that ending with Liz about Epiphany. Le sigh...

 

 

I might have been in the minority, but I at first liked his stuff. I felt the scenes were FINALLY given room to breath again and characters got to talk about their feelings, motivations, and stayed in character in a way not seen in ages. But I loved Liz with Ewen...just her getting a story with a hunk that was not Jason...and Jason being a bit jealous...was cute before they ruin that character.

 

And regardless of his faults...I loved Garin Wolf gave us THIS:

 

 

[carolineg]

That's a great Alexis/Carly scene.  Carly being her delusional worst and Alexis actually getting to call her on it.  Like I said I did like GW's stuff at first.  There is a scene where Sonny is off his meds, bedraggled and sitting on a stoop and a man walks by a puts change in his coffee like he's homeless and that absolutely cracked me up and I still remember it to this day even though it had no bearing on anything.  It was just a silly little scene where we got to see Sonny as a loser and that was a change.  Anyhow, I agree there was a lot more character development, but not a ton of movement and it got a little dull to me after a bit.  Maybe it was too much of a change after Guza.  I honestly don't think he got enough time to execute his vision, but GH didn't have time.  

[Taoboi]

And watching it live as *chef's kiss* Everyone was all over this scene in the message boards and blogs. 

 

I think I vaguely remember that scene.

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I agree with you. I thought potential was there at first, but he got a little too dark and of course, there was no time. 

[carolineg]

I feel like I can give my impression of how I felt back then and would probably feel differently about the material now.  You have to remember I was in a deep depression over the Queen's botched return and departure, so nothing would please me.  I just don't feel a lot of desire to revisit that time because I can't really think of anything I liked aside from specific scenes.  The only happy couple I remember during that period was Jasam and then she gets assaulted on her honeymoon.