Alex Marshall Days.

He went from general menace to a more misunderstood anti hero destined to reignite love flames with Marie and make happy family with Jessica .

Then the Horton connection was dropped and Alex went back to assistant bad guy to various villians and comedy relief before getting arrested and never heard of again.

An 8 year stint.

On 11/11/2021 at 4:24 PM, Soaplovers said:

John Black Days

He worked well in the 80s and 90s, but [...] he's [...] stagnated as a character. 

That's what happens when 1) the man who portrays him isn't the world's greatest actor (sorry, fellow Drake fans, but you know I'm telling the truth) and 2) you take away the character's identity and reason for being, then spend the next 30-or-so years rewriting and rewriting and re-rewriting his backstory to the point where it's convoluted, illogical and simply not worth mentioning or even thinking about anymore.  To put it another way: John Black has stagnated as a character, because, thanks to that idiotic show we call DAYS OF OUR LIVES, he has none.

In retrospect, I think TPTB were better off turning John into a villain, or at least an anti-hero, once they decided he wasn't the real Roman Brady.  Maybe, that way, WN's Roman might have retained some relevance, who knows?  Because, as it is, John Black's impostor Roman turned out to be a better Roman than the genuine article himself.

Edited December 5, 20214 yr by Khan

12 minutes ago, Khan said:

That's what happens when 1) the man who portrays him isn't the world's greatest actor (sorry, fellow Drake fans, but you know I'm telling the truth) and 2) you take away the character's identity and reason for being, then spend the next 30-or-so years rewriting and rewriting and re-rewriting his backstory to the point where it's convoluted, illogical and simply not worth mentioning or even thinking about anymore.  To put it another way: John Black has stagnated as a character, because, thanks to that idiotic show we call DAYS OF OUR LIVES, he has none.

In retrospect, I think TPTB were better off turning John into a villain, or at least an anti-hero, once they decided he wasn't the real Roman Brady.  Maybe, that way, WN's Roman might have retained some relevance, who knows?  Because, as it is, John Black's impostor Roman turned out to be a better Roman than the genuine article himself.

THIS.  And then the two characters became redundant.   There isn't anything to truly differentiate the two characters.  They fill almost the exact same role on the canvas.

The John backstories are crazy.  I think him being an Alamain or related to Stefano were my two favorites.  I am actually not sure why Days never just did a Jason/Drew twin story with Roman and John.  Except everyone would be related.

Drake's lasted because he's likable, charming, and has good chemistry with his costars.  He's a horrible actor and wouldn't have lasted past 1993 if he didn't have better chemistry with Deidre than Wayne did and wasn't JER's fave.

5 minutes ago, carolineg said:

I am actually not sure why Days never just did a Jason/Drew twin story with Roman and John.  Except everyone would be related.

What, they aren't already?  (God, I hate that show so [!@#$%^&*] much.)

I've said it before, I'll say it again, and I'll keep on saying it 'til Errol has the good sense to ban me I'm on this lonely planet no more: the only John Black backstory that will ever make sense to me -- aside, of course, from him being the real Roman Brady after all -- is that he is Stefano's (illegitimate) son, whom daddy employed to impersonate Roman (probably to keep him from some great love that Stefano either felt was unworthy of the DiMera name, or wanted for himself, or both).  DAYS can continue to dance around what is so obvious until it fades to black forever, but I'm stubborn and plain don't give a [!@#$%^&*].

15 minutes ago, Khan said:

What, they aren't already?  (God, I hate that show so [!@#$%^&*] much.)

I've said it before, I'll say it again, and I'll keep on saying it 'til Errol has the good sense to ban me I'm on this lonely planet no more: the only John Black backstory that will ever make sense to me -- aside, of course, from him being the real Roman Brady after all -- is that he is Stefano's (illegitimate) son, whom daddy employed to impersonate Roman (probably to keep him from some great love that Stefano either felt was unworthy of the DiMera name, or wanted for himself, or both).  DAYS can continue to dance around what is so obvious until it fades to black forever, but I'm stubborn and plain don't give a [!@#$%^&*].

Well, the show should have made John the real Roman after they ditched Wayne, but that ship has sailed since it would make Shawn/Belle cousins and Theresa and Brady as well.

Making John Stefano's son seems like a lot to me.  I can't imagine Stefano doing that to his own kid, but I had no problem with him being his illegitimate brother.  There has to be a better reason for Stefano to have tortured John for so long and in such a complicated way.  I am not buying he knew too much or whatever the story is now.

9 minutes ago, carolineg said:

Making John Stefano's son seems like a lot to me.  I can't imagine Stefano doing that to his own kid

Stefano DiMera would do just about anything to anyone, including his own children, if it served his purposes.  That's what made him so powerful as a supervillain...and so frustrating to me, too, if I'm being honest.

4 minutes ago, Khan said:

Stefano DiMera would do just about anything to anyone, including his own children, if it served his purposes.  That's what made him so powerful as a supervillain...and so frustrating to me, too, if I'm being honest.

The one thing I always thought about Stefano is that he was weirdly obsessive/protective of all his children.  YMMV on the children stuff, but I definitely think they should be related in some way since it was such an elaborate, bizarre plan for him to brainwash John to make him into Roman, hope no one ever finds out, hope no one finds the real Roman, hope Marlena doesn't notice the difference, and just fingers crossed it works out lol.  There is really no way at this point to make it all make sense.

14 minutes ago, carolineg said:

The one thing I always thought about Stefano is that he was weirdly obsessive/protective of all his children.

Unless, that is, they betrayed him -- because, to a man like Stefano, loyalty was everything.  So, if there was a situation where John, as Stefano's son, had gone against daddy in some, significant way...?  Yeah, I could see Stef "punishing" him by brainwashing him into thinking he was someone else.

(Or...John went along with the brainwashing, because he desired Marlena.  It's just that the brainwashing ended up working a little too well for Stefano's liking, lol.)

6 minutes ago, Khan said:

Unless, that is, they betrayed him -- because, to a man like Stefano, loyalty was everything.  So, if there was a situation where John, as Stefano's son, had gone against daddy in some, significant way...?  Yeah, I could see Stef "punishing" him by brainwashing him into thinking he was someone else.

(Or...John went along with the brainwashing, because he desired Marlena.  It's just that the brainwashing ended up working a little too well for Stefano's liking, lol.)

 

Okay, I can buy what your selling on this.   It's much more well thought out than some of his backstories.  Especially if John was low key evil and wanted Marlena for himself.  Interesting....

John as a priest really made so little sense and was the true end for the character for me.  He’s just a plot cypher and Drake doesn’t bring enough acting chops to fill that out.

All the talk about Mac in the GH spoiler thread kind of makes me think how did he last as long as he did?  He’s not a good enough actor to go as dark as Guza would want, and he had more failed relationships than successful ones.  Even Robin and Felicia were gone for years at a time and Mac was still there.  And I don’t dislike Mac, I just can see he was just there and not treated as a major character for most of his run.

It's like the joke about CBS always forgetting to cancel KNOTS LANDING.  JJY has stayed as long as he has on GH, because they keep forgetting to write him out.

9 minutes ago, titan1978 said:

John as a priest really made so little sense and was the true end for the character for me.

John as anything other than Roman Brady was the end for me.

12 hours ago, titan1978 said:

All the talk about Mac in the GH spoiler thread kind of makes me think how did he last as long as he did?  He’s not a good enough actor to go as dark as Guza would want, and he had more failed relationships than successful ones.  Even Robin and Felicia were gone for years at a time and Mac was still there.  And I don’t dislike Mac, I just can see he was just there and not treated as a major character for most of his run.

I think I figured it out.

Kids. Anna and Robert were gone, the actors weren't coming back anytime soon and the show was very invested in Robin as a young heroine and needed some sort of parental figure to keep her on the show. And Mac as her uncle made sense. Then by pairing him with Felicia he became the father figure to Maxie and Georgie, KW left but the show was again invested in her girls (Maxie anyway) for future story. John J. York is a team player, wasn't going anywhere so Mac became the next best thing to a father for characters they actually cared about writing for.

Works for me!

37 minutes ago, Darn said:

I think I figured it out.

Kids. Anna and Robert were gone, the actors weren't coming back anytime soon and the show was very invested in Robin as a young heroine and needed some sort of parental figure to keep her on the show. And Mac as her uncle made sense. Then by pairing him with Felicia he became the father figure to Maxie and Georgie, KW left but the show was again invested in her girls (Maxie anyway) for future story. John J. York is a team player, wasn't going anywhere so Mac became the next best thing to a father for characters they actually cared about writing for.

That was my first thought as well.  The kids.  Robin needed someone to raise her.  The show was invested in her.  Sean and Tiffany would have been the only other logical options to raise her and they were being phased out.

Plus, I think being the Police Commissioner and owning the Outback gave him several easy things to do to be involved in plot, even peripherally.  Mac always had things to do it the 90's whether it be raising Robin/Maxie/Georgie, Stone's story, The Kevin/Ryan story, or Katherine Bell.  He's just really the epitome of a solid supporting character.

John should've remained Forest Alamain and let that be that. He didn't need any more backstories or retcon pasts at 65 with Tobin Bell playing his Asian father.