On 9/28/2022 at 5:23 PM, Melroser said:

I've recently started streaming this show from the beginning.

Whenever someone mentions streaming the series from the beginning, I am always interested in their experience of Miss Ellie.

Because when I re-watched the early seasons it was interesting to see that she was written a bit more sinister at first (sinister may be a reach but I couldn't think of a more appropriate adjective).  I really enjoyed how she played into Sue Ellen's insecurities and warned her to have a baby before Pam was able to worm her way into Jock's heart by giving birth to the first grandson.  Ellie was still prim and proper around the poolside breakfast table, but she wasn't as benign as she was written in later seasons.   

It also fun to see the tonal shifts as writers and production changes.  The costumes become more glamorous.  The scripts contain more humor.  And there's far less sweat, Ray and Bobby are drenched in those first few seasons, until they give up the manual labor and move into management and there's that early hostage episode when Pam and Sue Ellen are glistening until the pressure. 

Edited September 30, 20223 yr by j swift

25 minutes ago, j swift said:

Whenever someone mentions streaming the series from the beginning, I am always interested in their experience of Miss Ellie.

Because when I re-watched the early seasons it was interesting to see that she was written a bit more sinister at first (sinister may be a reach but I couldn't think of a more appropriate adjective).  I really enjoyed how she played into Sue Ellen's insecurities and warned her to have a baby before Pam was able to worm her way into Jock's heart by giving birth to the first grandson.  Ellie was still prim and proper around the poolside breakfast table, but she wasn't as benign as she was written in later seasons.   

It also fun to see the tonal shifts as writers and production changes.  The costumes become more glamorous.  The scripts contain more humor.  And there's far less sweat, Ray and Bobby are drenched in those first few seasons, until they give up the manual labor and move into management and there's that early hostage episode when Pam and Sue Ellen are glistening until the pressure. 

Manipulative, I'd say. It was usually more stealth, but every so often, she got childish. For the love of God, woman, Bobby's an adult here. It's not like he's either you or Jock's caregiver.

 

Someone might have posted here before that the early years of Dallas were influenced by films like Giant, Hud, Cat on a Hot Tin Roof.

The more I think about it, the more it makes sense that Dallas was the most male-focused of the primetime soaps and drew a larger male audience than the other primetime soaps because Dallas at its heart and roots was really a western.

Edited October 6, 20223 yr by kalbir

23 minutes ago, kalbir said:

Someone might have posted here before that the early years of Dallas were influenced by films like Giant, Hud, Cat on a Hot Tin Roof.

Written on the Wind was another influence.

 

On 9/30/2022 at 3:44 AM, j swift said:

Whenever someone mentions streaming the series from the beginning, I am always interested in their experience of Miss Ellie.

Because when I re-watched the early seasons it was interesting to see that she was written a bit more sinister at first (sinister may be a reach but I couldn't think of a more appropriate adjective).  I really enjoyed how she played into Sue Ellen's insecurities and warned her to have a baby before Pam was able to worm her way into Jock's heart by giving birth to the first grandson.  Ellie was still prim and proper around the poolside breakfast table, but she wasn't as benign as she was written in later seasons.  

And let's not forget that she had obviously also been quite happy to go along with keeping baby Lucy from her mother.

Ellie was cold and manipulative.  During her scenes with Digger, she seems to enjoy toying with him a bit as Jock looked on in jealousy.  

While I liked that Pam sometimes was Switzerland, I did love anytime she would spar with JR and the rest of the Ewings.  In fact JR vs Pam was the central conflict... shame that the producers undervalued her and let her walk away without at least trying to give Victoria Principal what she wanted.  

 

So, Rebecca Wentworth was hiding in plain sight?

When Pam goes to find her mother and mistakes her for the maid it makes sense because she was so young when Rebecca took off.

However, Cliff was a state official tasked with regulating the oil industry.  So, how is it that he never ran into Mrs. and Mr. Wentworth. 

Were the Barnes kids incapable of traveling outside of Dallas to Houston?  Were Rebecca and Katherine never photographed for the society columns of Texas?  Given their mutual professional endeavors, did Wentworth Tool and Dye never buy a table at the annual Oil Barron's Ball or get an invitation to the Ewing BBQ?

Did Rebecca have any scenes with Miss Ellie?  Because I would like to know how she felt about Digger's infatuation with the Queen of Ewing Ranch.

I get why they killed off the character relatively quickly because her backstory (including the small age difference between Pam and Katherine) does not hold up to much scrutiny.  And the idea that a tool and dye company would suddenly start producing oil is like asking Home Depot to start building condos just because they sell hammers.  It would make far more sense to have Cliff stick it to JR by withholding the means of production, rather than being in direct competition.

Rebecca Barnes Wentworth abandoned her husband and children, remarried a wealthy man, became widowed, and inherited her late husband's business. Sound familiar?

I could always buy the concept that Cliff didn't know Rebecca Wentworth.  He was only 4 or 5 when she flew the coop, so he likely wouldn't have recognized her, had he crossed paths with her twenty or thirty years later.  Any business dealings Cliff might've had with the Wentworth family (as an adult) would've likely been with Herbert Wentworth, who'd only been dead a little while when Pam found Rebecca in Houston.  

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On 9/29/2022 at 9:44 PM, j swift said:

Whenever someone mentions streaming the series from the beginning, I am always interested in their experience of Miss Ellie.

Because when I re-watched the early seasons it was interesting to see that she was written a bit more sinister at first (sinister may be a reach but I couldn't think of a more appropriate adjective).  I really enjoyed how she played into Sue Ellen's insecurities and warned her to have a baby before Pam was able to worm her way into Jock's heart by giving birth to the first grandson.  Ellie was still prim and proper around the poolside breakfast table, but she wasn't as benign as she was written in later seasons.   

It also fun to see the tonal shifts as writers and production changes.  The costumes become more glamorous.  The scripts contain more humor.  And there's far less sweat, Ray and Bobby are drenched in those first few seasons, until they give up the manual labor and move into management and there's that early hostage episode when Pam and Sue Ellen are glistening until the pressure. 

I've taken a break but need to get back into it.

Miss Ellie definitely has more of an edge in the beginning of the series than I remember her in later seasons. I like how she doesn't let Jock boss her around and stands up to him. I initially started watching after Jock had left and I always assumed he was the iron fist. It was welcomed to see Miss Ellie stand up to him. 

Sue Ellen's affair with Cliff and treatment of John Ross has made me very unsympathetic to her as a character now. I had always like Sue Ellen when I watched the initial run's later years. 

I agree with others in wishing that Pam vs. JR had been the through-line of the series. I'm enjoying it very much. It's a well-developed rivalry and the two (Victoria and Larry) work great off each other! 

I'm only halfway through S3 and I'm looking forward to the set up for JR's shooting. I hope it lives up to all the hype it's had. (Yes, I know who shot him. Doesn't everyone by now?)