Janet was such an adorable baby girl. It's obvious that this documentary has been in the making for years. I am always fascinated by docs that have so much unseen archival footage. That someone who is among one of the most followed and photographed/filmed pop stars out there still has all that footage hidden away.

To hear how the "neighbors" didn't want the family in their neighborhood after the Jacksons moved to California. Being called racial epithets and the microaggressions- I shouldn't be surprised with this being America but my image of the Jackson family was one where, once they signed with Motown and were living in California was as celebrities. Seems that the reality was quite different.

It was obvious that her marriage to James was troubled and that James had problems. I would really like to know why he rode that hidden child rumor for so long, but that's really something only James can answer. This obviously still pains Janet. I wonder how much of that relationship she has managed to make piece with, and how much is still an open wound.

Janet's relationship with Rene always seemed mysterious but towards the end of their relationship (marriage but nobody knew then) there were ominous signs that he was a looming figure who might have had too much of a creative hand in her career. I was never sure if he was a boyfriend, bodyguard or some sort of manager or a collaborator. 

 

7 minutes ago, Khan said:

Jesus, that literally sounds like a lyric from a DeBarge song.  #whosholdingjanetnow

I'm not sure that the relationship was ever a right time or right relationship for Janet. Sound like his rampant drug use put her through hell.

Remember that Jackson family biopic from the 1990s? I don't think much of Janet's story was featured in it, that biopic seemed to focus more on the brothers.

12 minutes ago, DramatistDreamer said:

Janet was such an adorable baby girl. It's obvious that this documentary has been in the making for years. I am always fascinated by docs that have so much unseen archival footage. That someone who is among one of the most followed and photographed/filmed pop stars out there still has all that footage hidden away.

To hear how the "neighbors" didn't want the family in their neighborhood after the Jacksons moved to California. Being called racial epithets and the microaggressions- I shouldn't be surprised with this being America but my image of the Jackson family was one where, once they signed with Motown and were living in California was as celebrities. Seems that the reality was quite different.

It was obvious that her marriage to James was troubled and that James had problems. I would really like to know why he rode that hidden child rumor for so long, but that's really something only James can answer. This obviously still pains Janet. I wonder how much of that relationship she has managed to make piece with, and how much is still an open wound.

Janet's relationship with Rene always seemed mysterious but towards the end of their relationship (marriage but nobody knew then) there were ominous signs that he was a looming figure who might have had too much of a creative hand in her career. I was never sure if he was a boyfriend, bodyguard or some sort of manager or a collaborator. 

 

I'm not sure that the relationship was ever a right time or right relationship for Janet. Sound like his rampant drug use put her through hell.

I thought it was cute and sweet how she was playing/slapping hands with Randy in the footage from the studio. I like how close him and her are. We are often hear about how close she was with Michael, but it looks like she's pretty close with all her siblings including Randy. And that makes sense given that he's closer in age to her than the others. Though, it seems like she's close with her siblings in general including her big sisters. I do think that she looks out for Randy and I remember telling him to be quiet in a playful manner in a video I don't think too long ago and calling him her "big headed" brother very recently when she wished him a happy birthday on Twitter lol.

It's good to see they still have a nice bond. I like seeing her absorb information from him as he tells her about their families upbring in Gary. She was so young when they were there, she really doesn't remember it. And probably really only remembers when they were well off financially. It was interesting seeing her listen to him as he gave her insight into the upbringing that her and the other siblings remember.

Edited January 29, 20223 yr by xtr

I credit Janet for dealing with the press in a way that laid the groundwork for other female black performers like Beyonce and Kerry Washington.  She never gave interviews about her personal life.  So, there was always a lot of speculation and rumor, but she only spoke to the press to promote her music.  I always thought it was nuts that we knew the names of all of Katherine Hiegl's kids, when she was the second tier star of a few seasons of Grey's, but I could not name Kerry Washington's husband, nor tell you how many kids she has had. 

Janet was rich, popular, and powerful enough that she didn't need to release photos of her weddings or her kid.  There is something very respectable about that.  She knew instinctively about how the mainstream press would misuse the personal life stories of black women that made her an interesting model for how generations of women after her worked with the media. 

In the end, sadly, she was correct because she lost her career for less than what white performers like Madonna and Cher had already done.  So, why let the press into your life if they're only going to mistreat you later?

Edited January 29, 20223 yr by j swift

2 minutes ago, xtr said:

I thought it was cute and sweet how she was playing/slapping hands with Randy in the footage from the studio. I like how close him and her are. We are often hear about how close she was with Michael, but it looks like she's pretty close with all her siblings including Randy. And that makes sense given that he's closer in age to her than the others. Though, it seems like she's close with her siblings in general including her big sisters. 

TBH, I don't think she's as close with LaToya. I remember after her divorce with René, I got the distinct impression that LaToya didn't even know she had been married...for 9 years!

6 minutes ago, j swift said:

In the end, sadly, she was correct because she lost her career for less than what white performers like Madonna and Cher had already done.

Agree.  Never mind it was Justin Timberlake who made the fateful (and fatal) blunder.  He's a man, and he's white, so he gets a pass.  But the WOC who had to face the humiliation of having her breast exposed on live TV without her permission?  As Emily Dickinson would say, she's straightaway dangerous, and handled with a chain (and worse).

2 minutes ago, DramatistDreamer said:

TBH, I don't think she's as close with LaToya. I remember after her divorce with René, I got the distinct impression that LaToya didn't even know she had been married...for 9 years!

Let's be honest: who, among the remaining Jackson siblings, is LaToya really that close with?

Tell me, does Rebbie put in an appearance?  I've had "Centipede" on my mind so much lately, lol.

Edited January 29, 20223 yr by Khan

5 minutes ago, DramatistDreamer said:

TBH, I don't think she's as close with LaToya. I remember after her divorce with René, I got the distinct impression that LaToya didn't even know she had been married...for 9 years!

Maybe her and LaToya got closer/closer again later on. She did mention that LaToya encouraged her to marry James, because that's what she wanted to do. And she said that one of his brothers was interested in LaToya and that's factored into how she met James. But maybe there was a time where they weren't as close or at least didn't speak as much. She also mentioned how her and Michael even drifted apart for a moment when his career was really ascending.

It does seem like she's really quiet and a bit more secretive and at least some of her family didn't know much about more personal aspects of her life including her marriages. I think that Rebbie said something like she looked up one moment and Janet was married lol. And I think it was Rebbie who said she didn't really meet James until after Janet married him. Janet was keeping those marriages on the hush hush lol, even from family.  

Edited January 29, 20223 yr by xtr

8 minutes ago, DramatistDreamer said:

TBH, I don't think she's as close with LaToya. I remember after her divorce with René, I got the distinct impression that LaToya didn't even know she had been married...for 9 years!

I think you need to remember that La Toya spent the half the eighties and half the 90s in an abusive "relation"ship with her manager... then seemingly spent the rest of the 90s hidden away in an apartment in Las Vegas. I don't think it's surprising she doesn't have much of a clue what went on with Janet in the 90s. I don't think La Toya's reaction about her divorce from René back then says a lot about their relationship today.

Edited January 29, 20223 yr by te.

3 minutes ago, Khan said:

Agree.  Never mind it was Justin Timberlake who made the fateful (and fatal) blunder.  He's a man, and he's white, so he gets a pass.  But the WOC who had to face the humiliation of having her breast exposed on live TV without her permission?  As Emily Dickinson would say, she's straightaway dangerous, and handled with a chain (and worse).

Let's be honest: who, among the remaining Jackson siblings, is LaToya really that close with?

That's a good question for someone in the family to answer, lol. From what I have understood and inferred, Janet was not confiding in Latoya because she talked too much.

4 minutes ago, xtr said:

Maybe her and LaToya got closer/closer again later on. She did mention that LaToya encouraged her to marry James, because that's what she wanted to do. And she said that one of his brothers was interested in LaToya and that's factored into how she met James. But maybe there was a time where they weren't as close or at least didn't speak as much. She also mentioned how her and Michael even drifted apart for a moment when his career was really ascending.

It does seem like she's really quiet and a bit more secretive and at least some of her family didn't know much about more personal aspects of her life including her marriages. I think that Rebbie said something like she looked up one moment and Janet was married lol. And I think it was Rebbie who said she didn't really meet James until after Janet married him. Janet was keeping those marriages on the hush hush lol, even from family.  

Yeah, from what I gathered it wasn't a rift, it was that Michael was in a very different place, in that he literally wasn't around for much of the time because his career was becoming white hot. He no longer seemed to have the time or frame of mind for the simple things like hanging out with family. 

4 minutes ago, te. said:

I think you need to remember that La Toya spent the half the eighties and half the 90s in an abusive "relation"ship with her manager... then seemingly spent the rest of the 90s hidden away in an apartment in Las Vegas. I don't think it's surprising she doesn't have much of a clue what went on with Janet in the 90s. I don't think La Toya's reaction about her divorce from René back then says a lot about their relationship today.

Of course I remember Latoya talking about this. She had alienated the family and named her abusive husband as the reason for this.  Having said that Janet implied that she couldn't confide in her. You can love someone and repair the relationship and still feel cautious as to how much you can trust them.

It's not a great feeling but it's human nature.

18 minutes ago, Khan said:

Agree.  Never mind it was Justin Timberlake who made the fateful (and fatal) blunder.  He's a man, and he's white, so he gets a pass.  But the WOC who had to face the humiliation of having her breast exposed on live TV without her permission?  As Emily Dickinson would say, she's straightaway dangerous, and handled with a chain (and worse).

Let's be honest: who, among the remaining Jackson siblings, is LaToya really that close with?

Tell me, does Rebbie put in an appearance?  I've had "Centipede" on my mind so much lately, lol.

Rebbie is featured in the documentary and is shown talking quite a bit. She continues to age well and is happy. I have always like her and she's always come across as very grounded. Also, they showed some pictures of a couple of Janet's nieces when they were talking about the secret daughter rumors. Her nieces are pretty, especially Stevanna (Randy's daughter).

Stevanna does look like Janet IMHO.

 

 

Edited January 29, 20223 yr by xtr

I'll be watching this because I love Janet and I've been pleased with her recent resurgence (with IMO better material than much of the last two decades), but I suspected from the jump it would be what the reviews says it is: Compelling and emotional but still guarded. The Jacksons close ranks on certain stuff, period. It sounds like this doesn't give up too much on her and Elizondo or Wissam Al Mana either. I hope to be surprised.

I had heard years ago that it was difficult for Janet and Michael to connect even on "Scream," so it was interesting to hear that confirmed.

13 minutes ago, Vee said:

I'll be watching this because I love Janet and I've been pleased with her recent resurgence (with IMO better material than much of the last two decades), but I suspected from the jump it would be what the reviews says it is: Compelling and emotional but still guarded. The Jacksons close ranks on certain stuff, period. It sounds like this doesn't give up too much on her and Elizondo or Wissam Al Mana either. I hope to be surprised.

I had heard years ago that it was difficult for Janet and Michael to connect even on "Scream," so it was interesting to hear that confirmed.

From the clips I saw, Janet said it was always Michael's song and she was supporting him on that. I am always interested in how others engage in the writing and creative process, and it was interesting to see Janet on her laptop, typing away while Michael threw around the lyrics of "Scream", which Janet chided him for dropping an "F-bomb" in the lyrics (which would be replaced with the lyric "the whole system sucks" instead of the F-word). Honestly, the clip of Janet's session with Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis for the Rhythm Nation album looked a whole lot more contentious by comparison.

It’s hard to take a documentary that’s been tightly controlled by Janet herself as pure or balanced. The relationship with Rene Elizondo was very crucial to Janet’s career and the most successful part of it. He was there from her breakthrough with Control through The Velvet Rope. He was very much part of the direction of her music, the creative development of her videos, and promotion of her music during this time. Many fans have noted it for years, but the quality of her music waned significant after her relationship/marriage to Elizondo fell apart, Super Bowl incident or not.

It’s always been alleged that the marriage to Wissam was some type of business arrangement, the more she skirts around it, the more I believe it.

 

 

 

I don't think her music was ever the same after Velvet Rope struggled commercially. I thought it was a great album. I also felt she spent most of the next couple decades trying too hard to do light fluffy pop instead, or chasing trends vs. making them. I do think her recent comeback has felt a lot more organic and I've been happy about that.

Like BF I don't know how much of the doc's take I can fully invest in, and I don't know how candid she gets about Michael in Part 1 vs. Part 2, though I've read some quotes about their relationship that seem to pertain to the larger two-part doc, but I am glad she's telling her own story.

Edited January 29, 20223 yr by Vee

Seeing Julie Chen talking about the incident in that segment dealing with the Superbowl irritated me. I could feel a frown coming onto my mouth.

 

Knowing about how much vitriol she got from CBS and Moonves.

Edited January 30, 20223 yr by DramatistDreamer