Members Darn Posted January 10, 2013 Members Share Posted January 10, 2013 I get feeling like you wasted your time (kind of) but you know, none of this is real in the first place so...now if they said some part of the story never happened in the first place I could understand feeling betrayed but to say the show was someone's in-universe fantasy? I don't see the problem. Bobby in the shower and the St. Elsewhere finales are two completely different animals to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members EricMontreal22 Posted January 10, 2013 Members Share Posted January 10, 2013 Right! I think the first time I heard this was in All Her Children (where's Sylph to pop in and mentione how obsessed I am with paraphrasing from that book?) And I *think* it's when the author asks about the character of Ann Tyler's past--some rich husband in Europe or something and why it's never mentioned. Agnes basically says that while they don't try to contradict it, or act like it didn't happen they also don't like to bring it up. After a while a character gets so much baggage. I mean, often using some examples of history enrich the story--but you can't have, when someone comes back from the dead, 12 other characters rolling their eyes and saying "that reminds me EXACTLY about what happened to me 22 years ago"! Soaps live in a weird world that way. They're richness is largely due to how characters grow (or don't) and the history a viewer brings to them, which if written well can add extra resonance to the show. But you also have to, to some extent, not aknowledge and use every single piece of history otherwise the characters really simply can't move on (unless they're in the loony bin). And I mean Vicki can't constantly bring up her time travel adventure... I remember some soap critic saying how soap operas more than other tv shows walk this weird tight rope of being more realistic, because they're a daily part of life, and wanting to be, while the audience at the same time completely accepts (mostly) that a number of things are extremely not realistic. If that makes sense. A tighter, well written cable drama can get away with a lot less if it's presented as largely realistic, for example. But it also has to be done carefully. An audience will accept a back from the dead storyline every few years--maybe even every year at this point. But now shows want to have more and more big moments and we seem to get back from the dead characters every other week--it breaks that tenuous suspension of disbelief an audience gives soaps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members EricMontreal22 Posted January 10, 2013 Members Share Posted January 10, 2013 I see your point but see Khan's too. Obviously all the crossovers using St Elsewher characters are largely done as injokes and winks anyway (ie when the doctors went to Cheers). And there are other simpler examples--I know there's a reason they're not directly connected but MASH and John Trapper had the same character but are vastly different. It started during MASH's run, but while MASH tried to sue, legally it was claimed to be a spin off of the movie the way MASH was a spin off of the movie. Mary Tyler Moore had several spin offs, but to me the drama Lou Grant feels like a different (similar) universe--and then there's that awful Mary and Rhoda tv drama movie. Of course The Brady Bunch had that depressing drama and tv movies as well... And I am so off topic. Still, I do get why fans felt betrayed. When you watch a tv show--especially a fairly realistic one, but I'd say even a fantasy or sci fi one with its clearly defined universe, you buy into that reality, and of course some people would feel it mean spirited to then be told that it wasn't "reality" but a made up story--especially in a show like Elsewhere which, despite some quirks, for nearly 6 yers tried hard to give a sense of existing in reality. I've not watched the later years of Dallas--were all the plot points brought back to the previous season or did they conveniently retcon some and keep some of the events of the season? It is too bad it seperated from Knots (though by that point they were very much their own show--and even early on the cameos from JR always felt a bit out of place). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members EricMontreal22 Posted January 10, 2013 Members Share Posted January 10, 2013 RC's time travel "tribute" to OLTL's history--and Delphina with that magic whatever thing made the largely writer's strike written 1988 plot it was referencing feel like genius in comparison. Because it didn't even really work in its own logic--and since it went to characters in 1968 who we largely knew from the present a bunch of plot points made sense, and oy my head hurts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members lovely_m Posted January 10, 2013 Members Share Posted January 10, 2013 This vampire stuff makes more sense than two beautiful woman wanting Spinelli. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Vee Posted January 10, 2013 Members Share Posted January 10, 2013 I don't think they're going to say it's Lucy's fantasy, is the thing. I think there's going to be another explanation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Marco Dane Posted January 10, 2013 Members Share Posted January 10, 2013 What was the last normal storyline on PC before the supernatural stuff started? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members cityfan01 Posted January 10, 2013 Members Share Posted January 10, 2013 Fate, the first of the "books" was the last normal storyline. It started out with Ian & Eve being blown up in a car and thought to be dead. It ended up that some evil mastermind had kidnapped them to save his life. There had been some flirtation between them, but nothing more than stolen glances and a few touches. Kevin & Eve were married at this point, and once he thought she was dead, he went back to Lucy. Once Ian & Eve returned home, there was some storyline with a rape victim from the Middle East who Ian married to protect her from her brother. He wanted to perform and "honor killing" because he felt it was her fault she was raped. In the end, Ian and Eve got together and Kevin and Lucy reunited. Sorry for the shabby recap, it was a long time ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DRW50 Posted January 10, 2013 Members Share Posted January 10, 2013 I felt like St. Elsewhere gave up any pretense of being true to reality after the season 5 finale where Auschlander being trapped inside a demolished building was hand-waved as a dream. I think St. Elsewhere taught viewers to choose their own reality, so that's what I did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Khan Posted January 10, 2013 Members Share Posted January 10, 2013 Neither did I. And I agree with you about everything else. I was providing the argument, not endorsing it. (My bad, though, if I came across otherwise.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Eric83 Posted January 10, 2013 Members Share Posted January 10, 2013 I'm sure I will change it eventually lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members applcin Posted January 10, 2013 Members Share Posted January 10, 2013 Lucy freaking out over Duke vis a vis the Port Charles storyline is silly considering she knew Duke before she knew Joshua Temple, his character on PC, so if anything, it should have happened on PC that she freaked at Joshua looking like Duke, not the other way around. Now, freaking out at Duke being alive at years of being presumed dead is a different story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members EricMontreal22 Posted January 10, 2013 Members Share Posted January 10, 2013 Wasn't that partly due to it being thought canceled at the time? Anyway, I think snow globe thing can be open to interpretation--the writer has never said if he meant it one way or not, though most people take it that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members JackPeyton Posted January 10, 2013 Members Share Posted January 10, 2013 What was the PC arc with Karen going like back in time? I loved that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members KMan101 Posted January 10, 2013 Members Share Posted January 10, 2013 Time in a Bottle. It featured Frank and Karen, I think. It's been awhile. I liked that arc. I think all Lynne likely means that "PC was ahead of it's time" was that it featured short arcs, it scaled production back, was a half hour, featured vampires ... etc. I personally don't think she meant it was some innovative amazing show but of course she's going to support the show she starred on for 6 years. She was very behind PC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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