February 14-18, 2011

[DRW50]

I don't know if there's the same type of synergy now. The ratings are closer than ATWT and GL were in their last years but I still wonder if it will be similar. ATWT's ratings didn't go down once GL left.

[TeamEric]

Luke and Laura made "General Hospital" into a household name. Their brand's been tarnished, etc. but it's still considered THE COOL SOAP - by folks like James Franco, etc. GH itself has very high recognition value.

Ask most folks to name a soap star and Susan Lucci comes first to mind. Ask why soap she's on and the answer isn't so quick. Lucci by herself has far larger recognition value than AMC. Which is why I believe Oprah will grab Lucci for some show on OWN.

Vanessa Marcil has a far higher recognition value than Burton or Benard.

[marceline]

None and that's true vice-versa. Any AMC fans who don't watch OLTL now won't start and OLTL fans who don't watch AMC now won't start. This isn't like ATWT and OLTL where they're competitors. Anybody watching one show who doesn't watch the other, isn't interested.

Also people who think that canceling one will help the other's budget need to understand that isn't the case. The budget for whatever show gets the axe will go to the talk show that replaces it. So if AMC gets canceled, OLTL won't see anymore money. That cash will go to Tori Spelling.

[Kylie]

I think you'll still be saying AMC is going, even if this announcement has nothing to do with a soap being canceled. We all know AMC is going and that OLTL is too. They'll both fall like domino, so I don't understand the bickering. OLTL think they're safe, AMC fans think AMC is doomed and everyone is sitting around beating that into the other side. We actually know nothing, despite some people being absolutely positive that they know.

[DRW50]

I think Baba will put Tori in a headlock for the cash. They might give Tori the old Fusion set though.

[EricMontreal22]

Even with the past crappy last few weeks, I still feel the show is more "AMC" than it was under Pratt (I did like his first few weeks, even months though--much to my shock). But Pratt did write BIG moments (that was ALL he wrote), which I think maybe made the viewers tune in? Plus the show was SOOO boring and focused all on those 4 dull characters under B/E (save for the Angie/Jesse stuff), that Pratt was a welcome reprieve.

[EricMontreal22]

And I think the P&G soap cancelations have proven that at this point, if "your" soap is canceled, you're not gonna bother trying a new one. Part of that is the sorry state of soaps right now, but I think the even more important part is that next to no one tunes into soaps now because they're "a lonely housewife stuck at home looking for a break from their kids and chores" (to use a cliche). Even in primetime, if one show goes people who watched that show won't blindly tune in to what replaced it, or a similar show at the same time--nobody watches tv like that anymore (and primetime still has the advantage, because, at least Mon-Thurs, maybe Sun-Thurs, millions do still have the habit of watching tv to unwind).

Re budgets--the extra money would surely go to the talk show, as you say, and whatever bonus extra money is there will go in ABC's pockets (and there will be extra money...) Sadly, canceling one show will do *nothing* to improve the remaining one.

[EricMontreal22]

I think all that's true, but I have been surprised at how many people know Susan Lucci is Erica Kane and she's on something called My Children... Actually, really surprised in a number of cases (business friends of my dad, "jock" type boyfriends of my sister, etc).

[EricMontreal22]

Exactly. And while things have changed, from what I've read about the era when so many soaps moved to an hour, an hour soap costs hardly anything more than a half hour soap (I think one reason they never tried to change Loving to an hour--besides it making no sense for such a loser ratings wise soap--is affiliates wanting the half hour for news). Two half hour soaps, again from what I've read, wouldn't mean significantly less budget wise, except for using less actors than two hour soaps would.

[LoyaltoAMC]

From purely a branding standpoint, and I think that does matter, I could see them dumping their red-headed stepchild, OLTL, giving 1pm to the affiliates or putting a talk show in place, and then moving AMC into OLTL's spot, followed by GH, for a 1-2 punch of their primary "legacy" soaps that they can then cross-promote the hell out of. That just might work for AMC, as it would get it away from being Y&R's competitor, which probably keeps AMC's numbers down. OLTL does get the slightly higher demos, but that's without any real soap competition. I really think both show's numbers come down to their time slots. You could swap their slots now, and I'd bet the farm that OLTL would do AMC's current demo numbers and vice versa. And just based on all the cross-promotion with Oprah, Hot in Cleveland, and Castle, that says to me that ABC is more invested in AMC than in OLTL and that ABC recognizes that it has better brand recognition. I just see ABC sticking with the show that has better recognition and that has the potential to pull in better numbers in a different time slot. Would Frons then move Carlivati over to AMC with the directive to do something no writer has done to that show in years...shake the hell out of it, turn it upside down, and do something innovative that would keep the show going, instead of telling the same stories year after year after year. AMC would really need to get its act together. Of course if that strategy didn't work, AMC would be toast soon after. Having said all of that, I don't think ABC is going to take any action for at least the next year or two. Just my two cents.

[EricMontreal22]

We're friends (LOL I feel like I have to say that) so I mean none of this personally, but it's no secret that you don't like AMC. To be honest, I think OLTL has been int he position to be needed to be saved at least as much as AMC, maybe even more. It being above AMC in the ratings (though they were virtually the same ratings wise for a long time--and IMHO still virtually are) is a very very new thing. I know execs have no sense of history, but I can't help thinking they have some memory of AMC being a top, and even middling, rated soap for a long time.

Oprah's show was a nostalgia fest, full stop. If they had had Vicki and all her alters there, it wouldn't have done anything for OLTL either.

[EricMontreal22]

I agree there. My friend actually said how much easier it was to get into than AMC (and GH the other show he's watching right now while he recovers--I don't watch so...) He instantly got nearly every story point and character.

[Soapsuds]

[Angela]

They did budge.

AMC

12/27/10.....6.....1.9.....05.....6) 0.9/05.....6) 2,637,000 (+.1/+279,000) <- Holiday

1/3/11.........5.....1.9.....06.....6) 0.8/05.....5) 2,467,000 (-170,000)

1/10/11.....*5.....2.0.....06...*4) 1.0/05.....5) 2,703,000 (+.2/+236,000) <- Snow

1/17/11.....*5.....1.9.....06...*5) 0.9/05.....2) 2,584,000 (-119,000)

1/31/11.....*4.....2.0.....06.....6) 0.9/05.....6) 2,653,000 (SAME/+148,000) <- Snow

2/7/11.......*5.....1.9.....06...*5) 0.8/05.....6) 2,570,000 (-083,000)

OLTL

12/27/10...*4.....2.0.....06...*3) 1.1/06.....4) 2,845,000 (+.2/+490,000) <- Holiday

1/3/11.........6.....1.8.....06.....5) 0.9/05.....6) 2,371,000 (-474,000)

1/10/11.....*5.....2.0.....06...*4) 1.0/05.....6) 2,681,000 (+.1/+310,000)<- Snow

1/17/11.....*5.....1.9.....06.....4) 1.0/06.....5) 2,643,000 (-38,000)

1/31/11.....*4.....2.0.....06...*4) 1.0/06.....5) 2,850,000 (+.1/+343,000) <- Snow

2/7/11.......*3.....2.0.....06.....4) 1.0/06.....3) 2,692,000 (-158,000)

Is AMC's ability to get 2.7 to 3 million viewers for patches of 3-5 months and OLTL inability to telling, too? Is OLTL's numbers being in the toilet (less than 2.4 million viewers on average) from March through December 2010 and AMC's only from August to December 2010 telling as well?

That.

It's like birds fighting over who gets to eat a corpse. The numbers are not so different here that AMC will long out-live OLTL, or OLTL will long out-live AMC. Even if they suck, I hope both shows get through this season and the next & I think they will.

[Cyberologist]

He's meticulously / systematically dismantled Luke and Laura IMO. Nothing shows me he's using their popularity on the screen you are right though re: promoing marketing the show having their pics on their website and all that but in story he's brutally harshly disseminated their history e.g., Ethan for one.