Things are certainly going to get worse before they get better. Seems like Putin now wants to burn Ukraine to the ground out of frustration. While no one wants a direct war with Putin, I wonder how long the west will sit by and watch Ukrainian cities be sieged and carpet bombed for weeks on end. 

59 minutes ago, wingwalker said:

Things are certainly going to get worse before they get better. Seems like Putin now wants to burn Ukraine to the ground out of frustration. While no one wants a direct war with Putin, I wonder how long the west will sit by and watch Ukrainian cities be sieged and carpet bombed for weeks on end. 

I know people tend to hate any comparison to Hitler, but towards the end Hitler also destroyed the country he claimed to love - his own. Much of the rubble seen across Germany then was done by the Germans.

I can't help think about Syria and how the world stood by while Aleppo was turned to ruins, as the Russians killed civilians and crushed hospitals and homes.

To think that in my lifetime, I saw both the fall of the Berlin Wall and the Russian invasion of Ukraine.

Life comes at you fast, folks.

4 hours ago, wingwalker said:

Things are certainly going to get worse before they get better. Seems like Putin now wants to burn Ukraine to the ground out of frustration. While no one wants a direct war with Putin, I wonder how long the west will sit by and watch Ukrainian cities be sieged and carpet bombed for weeks on end. 

 

3 hours ago, JaneAusten said:

I can't help think about Syria and how the world stood by while Aleppo was turned to ruins, as the Russians killed civilians and crushed hospitals and homes.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again: Putin has turned back the clock.  It's 1984 all over again.

Edited March 1, 20223 yr by Khan

 

 

Tweet from Ukraine President Zelensky:

 

Tweet from Dmytro Kuleba, Ukraine Minister of Foreign Affairs

 

 

 

Whatever happens I hope and pray that Zelensky comes out of it alive so he can continue to be a leader for the Ukrainians. He has really risen to the occasion.

A standing ovation is nice and all, but I wish that we could give Ukraine something a little more substantial.

 

Thread:

 

41 minutes ago, DRW50 said:

 

 

I read this whole thread.  The tweeter says he's describing millennial progressives.

All I can say is that I'm liberal? Left? progressive? (not sure of the modern label) and my friends of various ages who think like me ... are not isolationists.  Everything that happens in the world affects everything else, even if you've never met the people.  I mean, that's common sense, isn't it?  Shouldn't it be normal human compassion?

I love Obama but it was obvious we should have done something for Syria.  The people of Syria were asking for help.

Maybe I don't understand the label "progressive" ?

I grew up in the 1960s with a larger worldview.  I don't know how you'd label me? In the old days I'd be called left-wing, but in this whole SON politics thread it sound like leftwing means something different now than it did 50 years ago.

Edited March 1, 20223 yr by janea4old

I would agree with that. Progressivism online is very stratified, but unfortunately its banner is often upheld by the loudest and dumbest among us.

There's a difference between being an imperialist interventionist who thinks you know what's best for another country..
.... and being someone who genuinely cares and *listens* to the people of the country you want to help.

Sanctions against apartheid South Africa worked - because the people of South Africa wanted the rest of the world to boycott the apartheid South Africa government. 

Edited March 1, 20223 yr by janea4old

1 hour ago, janea4old said:

 

I read this whole thread.  The tweeter says he's describing millennial progressives.

All I can say is that I'm liberal? Left? progressive? (not sure of the modern label) and my friends of various ages who think like me ... are not isolationists.  Everything that happens in the world affects everything else, even if you've never met the people.  I mean, that's common sense, isn't it?  Shouldn't it be normal human compassion?

I love Obama but it was obvious we should have done something for Syria.  The people of Syria were asking for help.

Maybe I don't understand the label "progressive" ?

I grew up in the 1960s with a larger worldview.  I don't know how you'd label me? In the old days I'd be called left-wing, but in this whole SON politics thread it sound like leftwing means something different now than it did 50 years ago.

The term progressive has been taken over by the type of people he is referring to. They now  dominate the narrative. 

In other news:

 

If you need a laugh, here is today's trucker rally. Without trucks!

 

3 hours ago, janea4old said:

 

I read this whole thread.  The tweeter says he's describing millennial progressives.

All I can say is that I'm liberal? Left? progressive? (not sure of the modern label) and my friends of various ages who think like me ... are not isolationists.  Everything that happens in the world affects everything else, even if you've never met the people.  I mean, that's common sense, isn't it?  Shouldn't it be normal human compassion?

I love Obama but it was obvious we should have done something for Syria.  The people of Syria were asking for help.

Maybe I don't understand the label "progressive" ?

I grew up in the 1960s with a larger worldview.  I don't know how you'd label me? In the old days I'd be called left-wing, but in this whole SON politics thread it sound like leftwing means something different now than it did 50 years ago.

Here's how I define the difference between progressive and liberal.

The current incarnation of progressivism is focused on economic populism. Every policy position is about how they don't want to pay their bills. (See: cancel student debt.)

Liberals are focused on civil rights. Issues like reproductive rights, LGBTQ issues, police reform, etc...

Just as a disclaimer and for context, I consider myself a liberal not a progressive. I'm a pragmatic, liberal Democrat and I believe in the credo of the Congressional Black Caucus.

"We have no permanent friends, no permanent enemies—just permanent interests."

 

I think both sets of interests are more intertwined than the former Bernie wing would like to pretend they are - where they prefer to focus on economics because actually talking about social issues and/or Russia makes the white guys often at the center of the movement uncomfortable - but I am generally with marceline on these things.

12 minutes ago, Vee said:

but I am generally with marceline on these things.

All these years later, it still blows my mind when we agree. 😀