AW: The longest transition in history?

[MichaelGL]

I've heard people mention that until Swajeski arrived at the helm, AW had a revolving door of writers that earned it the title as one of "the longest transition in history". However didn't Margaret Depriest serve as HW for three years; 1986-1988? Was her tenure on AW known as a an successful one or a failure?

[dm.]

It's a tiny bit off-topic but...

Margaret was a HW for 8 different soaps. Is that a record? I don't believe there was anyone else that worked on more soaps as a HW...

[Tonksadora]

About Swajeski, it's complicated. For one thing Swajeski jumped the network (or ad agency) line from there over to writing on the show - during the strike at the end of the 80s. She wrote as a scab. Just before that, AW was getting ready to have Lemay BACK!! We had him only briefly. After the strike ... we the fans were cheated out of a second tenure with Pete Lemay. Hard to forgive. But, frankly, she changed so many things during the strike! It was a long, bitter strike, and I don't have a particularly pleasant view of scabs even under the best circumstances.

Anna Stuart, the consummate Donna Love (and serious professional actress on THE DOCTORS before, GH before & AMC after) seemed to always feel that during that time Donna was weakened, made less powerful in her own right, more needy. I can see it. And, Swajeski certainly tried to introduce unnecessary confusion to the character, plucked out of the air.

That said, she told some good story. I think at that time that AW would have been better served by more character-based writing, overall.

And, in terms of the AW EP & HW turnover, you have to look to P&G too. They began a fruitbasket turnover approach to those positions & they had previously done so at SFT!

And, that strike is also a point where you can mark off & look to one side & look to the other & you may see movement between the studio level vision to the suits at corporate & controlling that from above.

I'm not sure I could put a sold yes or no on Maggie that earlier time. I think of roughly 1985-87 as Caitlin & Sally and Carl & Ellen Wheeler as Vicky & Marley & Tom ... It was in July of 1987 that Anne Heche stepped into first Vicky, then Marley.

Not that I know what overall effect it had on things - except morale & onscreen talent - but NBC went on a witch hunt & a purge in the 80s, but I think most of it was done bu 85 or 86.

But, if you want to compare Maggie's first tenure with her second, ... her first was award winning!

But, it is one of those points where I personally have to compare my reaction to the Sin Stalker and to Fax Neuman.

[brimike]

But, it is one of those points where I personally have to compare my reaction to the Sin Stalker and to Fax Neuman.

I can't even compare the two. It's like comparing the Salem Strangler with Reilly's Salem Serial Killer. One was disturbing, compelling and suspenseful, and the other was a joke. Other than the ATROCIOUS Frankie episode, the rest of that story was a caricature.

[Tonksadora]

Well said. It is hard even now for me to talk about - unless I focus on what was going on behind the scenes.

But, I'm still out for the members of that focus group who said they didn't think fans would miss Frankie.

[brimike]

Well said. It is hard even now for me to talk about - unless I focus on what was going on behind the scenes.

But, I'm still out for the members of that focus group who said they didn't think fans would miss Frankie.

I heard a story once that one of them was dressed head to toe in faux-dalmatian fur, with a matching purse.

In all of my travels, somewhere in the back of my mind, I've always kept an eye out for that woman... :lol:

[Tonksadora]

Yeee-es, I think I saw her in Manhattan, just turning a corner up ahead of me, on a Friday afternoon, and although I couldn't catch up with her, I recall this odd laugh.

[brimike]

Yeee-es, I think I saw her in Manhattan, just turning a corner up ahead of me, on a Friday afternoon, and although I couldn't catch up with her, I recall this odd laugh.

Oh, Donna B... I'm not kidding. I know it sounds like I'm making a Cruella DeVille joke, but I'm not. I've heard it from a few people over the years. Dalmatian fur. No lie.

[sungrey]

Well said. It is hard even now for me to talk about - unless I focus on what was going on behind the scenes.

But, I'm still out for the members of that focus group who said they didn't think fans would miss Frankie.

Well, put it this way. I wouldn't miss Frankie, or so I told myself when she was written off. I didn't like what Cass had become. (I was a Cass/Kathleen fan, and I didn't like the way Kathleen got thrown under the bus during Swajeski's tenure, full disclosure.) Anyhow, I was among those who wanted to see Cass go back to his old ways, so I cheered when Frankie got it. (Yes, I'm not afraid to admit it.)

A short while later, I realized the meaning of "be careful what you wish for". AW's ratings fell after that, even worse than they had been before, and I realized a lot of AW fans simply got up, walked away from their TV sets and didn't come back.

On another topic, I absolutely loved the Sin Stalker story. AW in late 1985 and early 1986 under Sam Hall was absolutely plodding, slow and boring. Margaret juiced the story up immediately and did a marvelous job weaving history into some of the plots (Mitch returning, etc.) Even Vicky Wyndham, at the time, thought the writing team knew what it was doing.

[Tonksadora]

Oh, no, I thought we were having fun & it turns out that it's the bitterest of real life!

[Tonksadora]

I didn't know anyone had cheered. I'm glad I didn't. But, listen, I mean, I was a Cass fan. Cass & Cecile, Cass & Felicia & Wally, Cass & Kathleen, Cass & Frankie, Cass & Lila.

That serial killer storyline was so misogynistic & so brutal & for Frankie to be the victim, with her background & ability to fight back, it was just too much. Of course, originally it was planned to have been Donna that was the victim. See, that's the thing about Jill, she thought up this whole idea for a storyline where a whole lot of characters would be killed off & then, whether it fit or not, she found a time & a justification & a writer, and there, you go, she cut the cast size down even more!!

[sungrey]

Donna, I wasn't really a Frankie fan and I never really had been. I never got the magic of that pairing. But that's just me. I've been wrong before and I'll probably be wrong again on chemistry. But if ever a mistake (and yes, I now admit the killing of Frankie was a mistake) brought down a soap, this was it.

[brimike]

I still (don't hate me Donna) think that Maureen Bauer on GL is the #1 slot in terms of a character's death bringing down a soap. But Frankie is a VERY close second. If Frankie had been ON the show for more than 7 years, she'd be #1. Maureen "wins" (isn't that a sad choice of words) purely on seniority.

And thank you, sungrey, for being honest, even though you (admittedly so) are in the minority. I'm glad you explained why you didn't mind, and your reasons. I know that posting something like that on a message board can always be a little stressful. Rest assured, this long term FRANKIE/AW/CASS AND FRANKIE fan holds no ill will at all. Thanks for being so clear and honest.

[Paul Raven]

De Priest's stint as HW was from March 86 to Jan 88.

The show was in a sorry state when she took over as the merry go round of writers had sent it in so many different directions and the cast was a fragmented composite of many headwriters visions.

John Whitesell had taken over as EP and Donna Swajeski was the new director of daytime at NBC.

Here are some excerpts from a SOD article promoying the changes ahead.

De Priest -"AW has a lot of things going for it.DOOL and GH had very low ratings when I came on,too.It'll be a challenge to see if we can work some kind of magic .But whatever we do,it's important not to lose the audience that's been with AW all along while trying to attract new audience. It's a balancing act."

Whitesell-"Maggie and I both believe the show has been unfocused.We want to restructure AW around the 3 Bay City families: Corys,Loves and McKinnons.We also want to pick up the emotional stakes.My feeling is that,in the past,it has been more an observer type show.We hope to change that-to invite the audience to become a participant.To me, that means character conflict.A good plot is a good plot,but when it becomes caper and ceases to be an emotional story,when the character conflit is secondary,it loses.We'll be staying away from that."

Swajeski - "Look for more Cory family members to return.Jamie will be returning and Amanda and Matthew may be aged.We're going to restore Sharon Gabet(Brittany)to the sexy,flirtatious type of character she plays so well:we're going for more star crossed lovers.

DePriest -"The Corys and the Loves have grown very thin.We want to define the differences between them.They're both wealthy,society families,but when I first came on,I didn't see much distinction between them.I want there to be.The Loves are aristocratic and proud of it.Mac is a self-made man .He and Rachel aren't concerned with this kind of snobbery.they have different values,different problems....With the McKinnons,we want a contrast between a middle class family and these upper class ones.Then,we want crossover stories between them."

Swajeski -"We're cutting characters who have no real links to any of the three families.In the case of Neal Cory,he'd played out his story.We traded him for a romantic,sexy lead,Adam.

Whitesell -"It was ridiculuos it (Marley/Vicky)went on for so long.Ellen did a terrific job,but you were going to ruin the actress...the audience was staying away because of the trickery.it was obvious one actress was playing both roles.It was difficult to shoot and make believable."

DePriest-"Anna(Stuart-Donna) and Kale(Brown-Michael) are very good together.We're very lucky to have them positioned where they are at a time when we want to flesh out the Love stories.They'll be getting into a lot of funny situations which,however comedic.will not be slapstick.It'll be more sophisticated humor because they as characters are."

Whitesell-"Mac and Rachel need a story.They have been very ill used as characters."

Swajeski -"Mac and Rachel are proven,popular characters.It's important to get some of the heart of the show back to them."

DePriest - "We hope to take advantage of the success of Days,but it took a lot of talented people five years to get Days where it is."

Swajeski-"Nothing happens overnight.It takes time for an actor to hit his stride,foe writers to find their best working partnerships,to cultivate audience loyalty.We're all in a race for the ratings,and loke everyone else,we're hoping to win".

[Tonksadora]

Oh, I don't think I could ever hate you even if it were my thing to hate other posters, which it is not. I'm not even sure I disagree with you if it comes to that, but I just am not very focused on teasing out one reason for things, when I find it's almost always a complex set of things. I continue to think that the death of Mo on Guiding Light was a blow that the show has never gotten over. And, in a way it began a cascade toward death, if you will. Frankie's death - no, her vicious murder - on Another World instead came near the end, after many assaults had already passed & more were still underway. Things that Maureen & Frankie had in common were an aspect of being 'heart of the show' characters during a particular time, being very steeped in old core families, ... I'm not sure what else.

And, yes, I'm always glad to hear someone else's view, sungrey. I know lots of Kathleen fans who could never get those of us who were both Kathleen and Frankie fans!! But, I was deeply involved in fan activism before & after Frankie's death & we worked so hard to get that changed from being Donna as final victim. Then, we were faced with the final victim being Frankie! Leaving very young Charlie without a mother & my beloved Cass, grieving, as I grieved along with him. We even got to JFP to the point that she was going to have the shooting of it offscreen so we never saw the actual event or a body, so ... Frankie could be brought back. (Why do they think we want that?) But, by that time, JFP's power had waned enough, because she was about to be fired & head to OLTL, and Maggie's power filled the vacuum. She was asked afterward about how she felt about how brutal & misogynistic the killing was & she said that she hadn't seen it, that she never watched soaps & that once she let go of the page, her work was done.