News & Gossip from the mid-1980s per The Soaps of Yesterday

[gimmetoo]

 

Your post sent me on a rewatch of early 84 last night...

Yes some of the stories were too far from the GH we knew, but the cast is what really made it all work.  I can't say I disliked any of the actors of that era.  Too bad more didn't go onto the success that Stamos and Demi Moore achieved, but I guess that would've kept us from enjoying them in Port Charles for as long as we did.  

 

And yes, the dance school w/ sleazy Barry Williams deserves an eye-roll...but it did cement Holly as the show's heroine, so purpose served.  

Edited March 21, 2021 by gimmetoo

[Franko]

Now that I'm caught up:

-- Don't worry, readers, Jon-Michael Reed assures you that Matthew Cowles and Christine Baranski (oddly enough, not identified by their actual names) aren't really white trash! "Billy Clyde and Jewell" join Peter Bergman's wife-to-be, only identified as a non-actress and not Christine Ebersole.

-- I know actors are different than the roles they play, but am I the only one who's a little squicked out that Genie Francis was dating John Martinuzzi, who played Laura's "sadistic rapist husband" Stavros? That's doubly so, considering the baggage of Luke & Laura's rape to romance. Oh well, apparently Genie and John had a happy relationship, although I did smirk at the mention that she'd be filming North and South (where she'd reunite with Jonathan Frakes).

-- Different Times: 'Veteran dancer Lola Falana storms the 'Capitol'" If that wasn't awkward enough, we have Colleen Zenk and Mark Pinter's "strictly professional" mutual admiration.

-- As for Reed, don't worry: A. Martinez certainly won't be sliding out of view as SB enters 1985. And yes, Don Diamont didn't have much trouble finding another soap role.

-- Speaking of musicals, oh, how I'd have loved to have been in the audience when the Hayes headlined Oliver! Fun fact: Jed Allan was in the original U.S. production.

-- Quite the up and down career path for Christopher Holder. First he's dropped from Y&R, then he's cast in nearing-the-end EDGE, then he's cast on AW, but he sadly won't go the distance with that show. Of course, that's nothing compared to Terri VandenBosch's array of traumas: having a hospitalized fiancé, getting hit by a car, having $100 stole out of her purse while knocked out, getting hospitalized herself and then losing her job on ATWT.

-- Interesting blooper from Robin Mattson (or possibly a misunderstanding Reed), who said playing Delia was her first East Coast gig. I guess even she wasn't that impressed by her work as Hope Bauer on GL. In that same column: how can John James and Ted McGinley be alumni of ABC's Talent Development Program if it started in July 1982? By that time, John was on Dynasty and Ted was on Happy Days.

-- TIL Peter Fonda (!) was considered for DALLAS. I'm curious if it was for the role of Jack Ewing or somebody else. To be honest, of all the nighttime soaps, I feel like he'd be most at home on KNOTS LANDING. Poor Charlene Tilton, though, being rejected by KL.

-- C.C. from Baton Rouge was sorta close. David Hartman never acted opposite Denise Alexander, but they were a couple. I was also amused by J.L. from Greensboro wanting to know if CAPITOL would expand to an hour. Evidently they don't read Reed and don't know he finds the show so dull.

-- The hottest controversy of winter 1984-85: Was Jack Wagner fired from GH? Nearly fired? (He doesn't want to talk about it.) And who are these two "Jack-haters" who were bitter at having their popularity exceeded?

-- All this and the return of the "What's Dorothy Lyman up to?" questions.

[j swift]

I am constantly amused when I find out that actors are using their middle name as their stage name.  As pointed out in that article John James's father and brother had the last name Anderson.  Now, maybe it was John's stepfather, but still I never stop to think when someone has a first name for a surname that it is fake (e.g. Lea Michelle & Chuck Todd)

 

It is a good thing that Lynda and JMR went into soap reporting and not psychic predictions because from assuring us not to worry that Paper Dolls will return, to their hopes for the future of Berringers, they sucked at prognostication.

 

Whether it was 1985 or 1991, Jack Wagner's contract seems to always be an issue. 

 

Would You Rather? (1984 edition) - Attend Ann Flood and Forrest Compton's finale party for Edge of Night, Search for Tomorrow's holiday gala with surprise couple Lisa Peluso and Perry Stephens,  GL's Christmas party where Grant Alexander wore his "trademark" tux and an anonymous source remarked that he's a "weird bird, hot one minute, cold the next", or Bob Mackie's birthday bash for Brad Maule?

Edited March 22, 2021 by j swift

[Franko]

Bob Mackie's birthday bash for Brad Maule! I might get the chance to meet Cher or Carol Burnett.

[vetsoapfan]

 

I loved and was rabidly addicted to TEON throughout its run, until the dreadful Lee Sheldon replaced Henry Slesar (who can never get too much praise, as far as I am concerned; he was brilliant), and so many veteran characters like Bill Marceau were dropped. I would have been thrilled to attend the series' farewell party and say goodbye to Monticello. I still miss it.

 

Paul the Roach, UGH! Getting rid of Ellen Holly, Al Freeman, Jr., and Lilliam Hayman was EGREGIOUS! The slaughtering of the cast and the dumbing down of the show with asinine sci-fi crap destroyed OLTL.

 

Stewart reportedly complained about the ages of some of his romantic leads, but not all them because they were "too old." I recall an interview in which he commented that Trish Lewis was too young, about Hope's age of 24-ish. TPTB's quest for going "hot and young" has always been a disaster for soaps. The audiences love the vets, and we do not want or need everyone to be a 25-year-old himbo or bimbo. Imagine firing Jeanne Cooper or Frances Reid or Helen Wagner because they were "too old." Pffft. The audience would have gone APE-SH*T. Firing Stewart was a major mistake, a blow to a show that was already being stripped of its identity and losing all continuity from the pre-Long/Kobe reign of terror. And they canned Tom O'Rourke just when there was so much story for Justin to sink his teeth into. Unreal incompetence, all around. (Replacing him with Christopher Pennock was a disaster. Ditto, hiring Richard Van Fleet as another fake Ed.)

[vetsoapfan]

 

No show can sustain itself with only one beloved, tentpole, recognizable character. The fact that Long and Kobe did not understand this boggles the mind. No soap fan wants huge, sweeping turnovers in the cast overnight. We want and depend upon seeing a variety of familiar faces over time. It's comforting and keeps us involved.

 

While I loathe how Long initially helped decimate the show, I will give her credit for the comments she made in one interview. Regarding all the fantasy/sci-fi crap she had inflicted on TGL, she said that in the end, she realized it was not the way to go, and it was "better to get real." It shocked the heck of me when she remarked, "I'd like to see one of the original characters, Meta Bauer, appear. She had so much happen to her." That gave me a temporary burst of hope that the show might honor its past and start improving, but that was not to be. Long departed as head writer, and the scribes that followed her were even weaker than she was. The mid-to-late 1980s were a wasteland in Springfield. Meta did not reappear until, what, 1996?

 

Gail Kobe was also quoted as saying (something like), "Writing the Bauers out of the show proved highly unpopular with the audience, so don't be surprised to see Mike and Hope written back into the story."

 

More BS, alas.

[KMan101]

 

Well, ATWT *did* fire Helen Wagner, right? I'm still shocked they got away with it back then. But your point remains. Viewers DO love the vets. They WANT to see them. They just don't get it. Soaps have been chasing this mysterious young demo instead of just writing what has always worked. Multi-layered generational storytelling.

 

Pennock was awful as Justin.

 

Mike, Justin and Hope are three glaring absences for me throughout the years. It seemed so crazy not to tap into them (really tap into them). I guess they figured they had Ed "why do we need Mike?" and they had Hope's son so why do they need her? Instead it should be, we have A-M, we NEED Hope. But nope.

 

Though, after Nola's messy return, sometimes I'm ok with characters being 'left in the past' LOL under certain regimes. Who the heck knows the damage that would be done. It's sad because Nola easily writes herself. They seemed to just want Lisa Brown as Nola again and didn't really have a plan. It didn't help that Lisa Brown and Justin Deas had no chemistry (IMO). And wasn't Nola also supposed to be paired with Ed and Peter Simon wasn't a fan? (But what did he think of the Eve pairing? LMAO)

 

Trish was definitely too young for Mike. I liked him with Lillian and Alex but I can't say he had fire chemistry with them. He feels kind of checked out towards the end of his run. Justin/Alex could have written iteself ... Justin had so many opportunites. Sigh. 

Edited March 23, 2021 by KMan101

[Mitch]

They didn't fire her..they offered her a contract she didn't like..one day a week, so she left...a week before the 25th anniversary...(which the show ignored and just had a Kim/Nick wedding, which just makes me think they were trying to replace Nancy and Chris with them...)  Up to that point after Christmas of that year she was rarely seen..was it the Dobsons..or the producer or both. At least they didn't kill her off.

 

I think a Nola/Ed pairing had potential..did Brown and Simon have chemistry? She could light a fire under dour Ed and Ed would ground her. Actually..Nola as new kooky matriarch made a weird kind of sense...McTavish had good ideas but then she would screw them up.  When Brown first came on she was on recurring so there was no story...which is fine..Nola was a character who could have been the Lisa on this show, getting in everyone's biz and connecting everything together.  And no, she and Deas had no chemistry and please don't throw poor Nola under the Buzz buss! Ugh

[KMan101]

 

Thanks for clarifying on Wagner, I wasn't entirely sure. So they forced her out, basically.

 

Nola had loads of potential exactly as you said, the 'Lisa' if you will of GL. They could have recast her son and brought on her daughter. Them plus Bridget and random Reardons, you'd be set for her. Bridget and Nola were massive missed opportunities.

 

I didn't mind the idea of Buzz and Nola, I suppose, but what I've seen it doesn't feel like the writing is there and sometimes Brown felt like she was still playing depressed Iva. And Deas is already becoming shouty. So ... no thanks. LOL.

 

They also seemed to abandon it (the less about the horrid amnesia the better) as soon as Fiona came back as Jenna. Of course we then had two years of Buzz shouting and Jenna crying about Jeffrey. 

Edited March 24, 2021 by KMan101

[Mitch]

Nola was supposed to be the spoiler in Jenna and Buzz..Jeffery was gone by then, but Jenna was cooking his baby by that time unknown to Buzz and somehow Nola found out, which was a good twist as that was Nola's iconic trick. I think I could tolerate Nola and Buzz if they started things slow, with them being buddies and having a beer..which would have been different then he and Jenna..maybe she is just friends with both of them and then she finds out Jennas secret and instead of woman against woman, she advices Jenna that it will blow up in her face..Jenna lies, Buzz finds out, then he and Nola get together for a bit. I just did not want Nola to be the sad third party who will be dumped or the bad third scheming either. Rauch/MADD and EB thought every triangle had to have a bad third which was lazy. But then Deas would have to keep his screaming arms flailing to a min.

 

Actually, I would much rather Buzz and Jenna just got written out happy after Jeffery. There was no more story for them or Buzz..why kill her off?

[KMan101]

 

Thanks again Mitch. The 1995/1996/1997 time period is a bit of a blur to me and unfortunately we lost so much on YouTube.

 

I agree there was no more story for them. I assumed that's why they offed Jenna but then I was reminded Fiona stood up for Zaslow and was likely punished so there ya go. I remember watching her death in 1998 and being pissed about it.

 

It always bugs me when they fire the female co-star but the male co-star in the pairing gets to stay. I never understood their desire to hold onto Buzz and Deas. He was nowhere near the hot property he had been in the 70s and 80s.

Edited March 24, 2021 by KMan101

[Mitch]

Yea..I think Deas is an industry darling but that's about it. I also think he just wanted a steady check so Colin could do what she wanted and he was around for the kids, etc, so he and Dicipolous probably just took the pay cuts and decided to shut his big mouth (off screen.) But okay, you want to get rid of Fiona..just write em both off..(but Rauch and MADD loved to take it out on the characters when they had a thing for the actors...killing Hart and having Dinah do it was a f*ck you to them...same as killing Jenna.)

[zanereed]

 

Stewart was definitely fired by Kobe, allegedly due to his resistance to Mike Bauer's involvement in the Alexandra/Mike/Lillian triangle, which would have essentially put Mike Bauer back into a front burner storyline. From the conversations from TGL thread in this forum, along with other input I've found, I guess Stewart was always resistant to whomever he was potentially being paired with (Jackie, Elizabeth, Jennifer, etc.). It seemed he liked Rebecca Holland (Trish Lewis), but he thought that Trish was too young for Mike. There was also Renee Dubois (Deborah May) in late 1979, who had chemistry with Stewart, but Renee was killed by Roger. In fact, in 1981 Doug Marland brought May back to TGL in a different role to be paired with Mike, but that role never stuck. Then in 1984, Pam Long wanted to write for Mike Bauer, so she made Mike part of a love triangle with Alexandra (the sister of his on-again/off-again nemesis, Alan), and Lillian, and the issues from that triangle would have an effect on Beth/Lujack. But, apparently Bev and Don did not get along well, so Stewart was resistant to the storyline. Kobe decided to fire Stewart by the end of the summer in 1984.

 

And IMHO, TPTB never got the Ed casting right once they fired Mart Hulswit from the role. I never understood why Hulswit was never asked back during the times that Simon or the character of Ed was out of Springfield. Maybe he was difficult to work with, but I've never heard anyone confirm that.

 

Firing O'Rourke was a huge mistake on Kobe's part, especially after the well-written paternity reveal in 1983, after a 6 year (in real time) secret being kept on the show. The audience was never given an opportunity to see how the Phillip/Justin/Alan dynamic would have changed. 

 

Agreed on Pennock. I loved him in other roles, but he really didn't fit Justin at all.

 

As far as never bringing back Hope, I still say the reason we never saw her again after 1983 was because of Alan-Michael. Once they SORAS-ed A-M to 18 in 1987, it made bringing back Hope awkward. When Hope left Springfield in 1983, she would have still been in her late 20's, I think. Therefore, a recast would have to be more age appropriate. If that was the case, the whole May/December dynamic of Hope/Alan would have been lost (at least in 1987). Hope really should have been brought back in 1985 or 1986, ideally at the time that Bert's death would have been acknowledged on-air. That way, A-M could have been aged a bit more slowly (well, as slowly as allowed on soaps). I wish that Roussel would have stayed in 1983, because it looked like Long was setting up Alan and Hope for a "War of the Roses" scenario.

[MichaelGL]

I would’ve really liked to have seen a Lillian/Mike/Alex triangle play out, eventually turning into a Justin/Alex/Mike/Lillian quad. So many wasted opportunities from the Kobe era.

[vetsoapfan]

 

One of the many egregious and highly-destructive moves made by Kobe during her reign of terror. 

 

 

Right. Hulswit would have provided some much-needed familiarity and "comfort" to veteran viewers, what with all the other Bauers being purged from the canvas. By 1985, familiar, beloved faces were largely absent from Springfield, and so many of the newbies were complete failures.

 

 

Pamela Long gave an interview once, commenting that during her first run as headwriter, she and Kobe worked diligently to eliminate "the dead wood" from the cast, but I daresay that the vast majority of the characters they axed were popular, viable, and integral to the show's core, structure and success.

 

 

Aging Alan-Michael so rapidly was a major mistake, as stupid as aging Frederick's daughter Leah practically overnight years later. We needed Hope, a blood Bauer, as the matriarch after TPTB foolishly killed off Maureen. Having Hope and Mike forever off-screen left a hole in the show's heart.

 

It still infuriates me, and bogles my mind, that Kobe and Long were permitted to cripple TGL so completely. Did NO ONE at P&G understand the show, understand the audience, or give a damn?