GL on DVD!

[DRW50]

Looking back I think I liked Melina, and her chemistry with Frank D, more than the character, which is funny, since I haven't liked Melina in anything since.

Reva as a character worked best when having material with other strong and long-standing characters - I would have loved seeing more of her with Vanessa and Phillip. We just got a few morsels in the last year. I'm surprised the show even had her with Philip after he came back from the dead, but it's that type of touch which makes me miss GL, even those last years I avoided...

[Soapsuds]

JFP GL ratings for the year we are discussing

1993-1994

1. The Young And The Restless 8.6

2. All My Children 6.6

3. General Hospital 6.2

4. The Bold And The Beautiful 6.1

5. As The World Turns 5.8

6. One Life To Live 5.6

6. Days Of Our Lives 5.6

8. Guiding Light 5.4

9. Another World 3.5

10. Loving 2.7

[Y&RWorldTurner]

1993 was also the year many CBS affiliates switched the show to early morning timeslots.

[Soapsuds]

Do you know why?? I forgot the reason. Was it that early that this was done??

[~bl~]

I only started watching GL after Reva and Josh were off canvas, so obviously I didn't miss them. I respect how important they are to the overall history of the show, but I would never say they were my favorites. Other characters I just find more relatable, though there were some scenes I saw prior to Josh leaving town after Reva went over the bridge (between 1987-1991 on VHS where I did like the characters), but they will never be the ones that made me love the show. When people act like Reva and Josh are the be all and end all of GL and if you don't love them you aren't a GL fan I do get pissed especially considering many of the characters (and actors) I love started on GL prior to Reva and Josh (ie Vanessa, Ross, Roger, Holly, Ed).

The story that hooked me on the program was Daniel and Holly at the Bauer cabin and him going crazy wanting to marry her, with Roger and Ross working together to save her. I didn't know the history, but the subtext was like a bolt of lightning. I thought it was the coolest thing ever as a teenager. (By this point, I'd watched every other soap that was currently airing and GL was completely different than anything I'd ever seen.)

In late 1992, GL was pulled in Sacramento area, it was not put to the mornings until the fall of 1995 and a short lived news show Day and Date was put in its place at the O&O east coast stations. I know it was 1995 as Wendy Moniz was in the promos for the time slot switch and she only started airing in 1995.

[Soapsuds]

I believe that was David Bishins. I liked him and was saddened when he went to the dark side.

[Soapsuds]

The 50th Anniversary Show...oh dear.....Rusty...mmmmmmm...always floved him....Reva's hair....lol.....Roxie..eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee.......AM...lol....Carl Evans was a cutie.....I didnt know Chris B was still on as Alan back then.....Ian Z....hahaha...before his 90210 days....and ewwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww...Jackson.....love..hated it when he said it....lol

[juniorz1]

Sniff, that was SB's last week on the air.

[DAYSjunkie1987]

I suspect it was the cancellation of Family Feud (after which CBS then gave the 10am timeslot back to affiliates) that triggered it. And it was mostly in markets where ABC soaps, particularly GH, were much stronger in the ratings. I wanna say I heard somewhere that in some of those areas, GL actually got better ratings in the morning than in the afternoon. But don't quote me on that.

[DeliaIrisFan]

That's interesting, because wasn't that when the show really dropped in the ratings? It was # 4 or 5 throughout 1991 and most of 1992, even hitting # 3 a few times like during the blackout, but by year-end it had dropped to 7th. That is often attributed to Maureen being killed off, which was so unpopular with viewers, but the decline actually slightly preceded Maureen's death. I always thought it was the combined impact of the void left by EP as well as others like Beverlee McKinsey who left around that time. But at that point, GL, B&B, GH, and OLTL were not that far apart in the ratings - it could he that being pulled off the air in a major market like the Bay area would have been enough to tip the scales.

I actually skipped ahead to watch the 1993 episode to see what was featured that everyone hated so much. I'm not a fan of JFP but I am a fan of that era of the show. I'll be the first to admit that Julie and the vortex that was Nick's lovelife were weak spots and, knowing what I know now about JFP's patterns, I can't look back on how "Friend of Jill" Vincent Irizzary was showcased at that time without thinking about the backstage politics behind it. But, IMO, there were three very strong sets of scenes featured in this episode: Ed and Maureen's final encounter, obviously, but also Jenna's scenes with Henry and, yes, Harley's scenes at the Vietnam memorial. That sequence was acclaimed at the time, and Harley and Mallet were very popular. (I don't know what went wrong in Harley's last years on GL that caused so many people to dislike the character and think less of BE's acting - the last I saw of GL before she left was when she played Irna Phillips in the anniversary fantasy episode, and I thought she was fantastic - but to me, she remains one of the strongest, most natural actresses I've ever seen in this medium.) In short, I for one would be ecstatic to turn on any soap now and see that quality - and variety - of material.

More than just strong scenes, though, they were also building blocks in equally strong, long-term stories (stronger, IMO, than pretty much any stories that I'm aware of on GL after 1993). Unlike the other notorious tragically-killed-mother stories JFP that has given soap viewers over the years, Maureen's death actually led to powerful story for her family for a long time to come. Jenna believing that Henry was her father for a time was a subplot (and a lovely, unique one at that - one that most soaps then and especially now never would have bothered to cultivate) in Jenna's lawsuit against Spaulding, which led to a battle for the company that drove stories for well over a year. And, yes, Harley's scenes here led to Buzz's return...his later material under JFP notwithstanding, I think the character's initial introduction and the way it seamlessly tied into stories for characters ranging from Harley and Frank to Nadine to Jenna and Roger and even HB was remarkable. Granted, the story would have been an even better addition to a canvas that also included BM's Alex, EP's Maureen, and others who were victims of the show's production (mis)management at the time.

[DRW50]

I had a tough time with the constant gum-smacking and the bad accent when Buzz first came around. To me it just seemed like an actor showing off, which, generally, set the tone for most of Deas' first few years on the show.

I liked Harley at the time, but can't say I ever enjoyed Harley/Mallet. He was too obnoxious for me and I think her cop job took away some of the spirit and the life and quirkiness she'd had up to that point. Just comparing Harley of, say, the relationship with Josh, to the Harley who was with Mallet - it's a huge change.

I do see where the timeslot changes probably did the most damage in ratings. Beyond that, I think the show just lost a lot of community and spirit starting in late 1992 and that made it more difficult to connect to, especially when some of their biggest names in terms of charisma or talent were leaving or had left.

I've never quite understood why JFP was so cavalier about things like Kimberly Simms leaving. I don't know if she believed you could just easily recast both Alex and Mindy and it would be OK, because they still had Nick. Not so much, IMO.

[~bl~]

I agree with you DeliaIrisFan about the stuff with Henry and how the Wall Memorial material was well received. For me having the Nick/Eve and Ann Hamilton was bothersome and while Zas was in it, wasn't substantial. There were better episodes around that time, but I can understand why they would want to have those scenes with Ellen Parker and Peter Simon.

I think GL going off the air in one of the top 10 television markets hurt the show. There was a smaller pool of people they could reach though in some parts of that area, could continue seeing GL. From what I recall reading (and taking to people from Sacramento online), a cable company aired it for their customers, but not everyone could get that cable company. So there were a few lucky viewers who could still see GL, but it wasn't on the regular CBS anymore.

With Kim Simms, JFP wanted to keep her, but Kim didn't want to stay for another two years, and just one. I think it was a pride thing. This was prior to JFP knowing that Bev was going to bolt, perhaps things would have been different otherwise.

[DeliaIrisFan]

I try to forget about the accent. Actually, I only remember it from YouTube clips - I was in junior high school in 1993 and hadn't quite figured out how to set a VCR time yet. But from what I've been able to reconstruct, he dropped the accent after a month or so? I think his acting from that point on, at least, was quite good. But GL aired opposite GH and GH was the show to watch in 1994-95, long before some of those later excesses I've read about, like Buzz's scenes during the 5th Street fire.

I wasn't watching when Josh and Harley were together. It's funny...for me, Josh always sucked the life out of his non-Reva love interests. I liked Harley and Mallet's sparring. But I can see how someone who saw Harley before might have found her becoming a cop jarring. I remember when JFP was at OLTL, one of the soap mags (it must have been Weekly, the only one with any teeth, at least at that point) printed pictures of Harley and Josie from AW, and some ingenue from OLTL (I had stopped watching by that point, so I don't remember who it was) in their cadet uniforms, side-by-side, and commented on how JFP's shows always seem to feature a young heroine deciding to become a cop and having a love-hate relationship with her police academy instructor. It seemed contrived on AW and obviously it sounded way out of left field for whomever the new recruit was on OLTL, since it's completely slipped my mind. For me, by the time I tuned into GL, it worked with Harley...but then, I always associated Margo on ATWT with being a cop, and I can see in hindsight how that must have been a far cry from James Stenbeck's mistress.

I don't know why, especially since that disc was called "Secrets and Scandals," they didn't air one of the blackout episodes, when Ed and Lillian actually had their one-night stand (while Maureen was trapped with Roger).

That's so interesting...would those who watched it on cable have been counted in the ratings, I wonder?

Yes, she didn't know, because she apparently hadn't read BM's contract. The mind reels at how people who executed some of the best material in the history of this genre could be so clueless at such critical moments...

[DRW50]

There's always been a tone deafness to JFP's work, and it seemed like at GL she just assumed what she wanted was what would happen. What the show had done to Alex over Beverlee's last year in the role was very damaging and while BM was getting older and tired and may have left no matter what, I wonder if they had actually made more of an effort in writing the character, if she would have stayed. I think they just saw Alex as a shrew.

I actually agree with you about Josh draining the life out of his partners. For some reason Josh/Harley worked for me. Beyond that, just the average scenes Harley had with people in those years - she was quirky, a lost little girl in many ways. I don't think the character needed to be changed so much.

The recruit on OLTL was Sophia, who went on to play Tori Granger on GL.

Looking at the full picture now I do see why GL's ratings fell. Even as much as I struggled with 1993 and 1994, they were certainly not the worst soap out there, and it actually makes me angry to realize just how much the affiliates killed the show. I guess this is one of the reasons why P&G and CBS still pressed forward. It makes the show's ratings gains in later years, brief as they were, more notable.

[~bl~]

During the blackout, Ed and Lillian just kissed in the car while stuck in the parking garage. They didn't have sex yet, as I think they were intimate at Lillian's place, before she came to move into the Bauer house. the blackout is something that they almost need to show the whole week (and there may be the music issues between Paradise City being on the radio when Bridget started the blackout to U2 playing when Blake and Ross had sex in her bedroom at Hollybend and it ending with Round Midnight.)

I'm not sure how or even if they could count those people watching GL on that feed...that is a question I never thought to ask the people I knew who had that problem.