I think it's worse - there are big behind the scenes problems, a number of producers and the CBS Daytime head booted. The other problem is that these changes with the panel onscreen generate no buzz, the way Debbie did. No one cares about why Sharon Osbourne or Leah Remini or Holly Robinson are going. No one cares about their replacements. The only people who talk about this are the very people CBS Daytime has little interest in.

Really? No one cares? I can easily say the same thing about soaps, this little hothouse not withstanding. You need look no farther than the Daytime Emmys for an example of no one caring. When even the Tony Awards do better than a TV awards show, that's apathy.

Yes, The Talk's audience has been growing slowly. As for the fact that it's doing worse that ATWT, so? Again...it's cheaper. That's not spin, that's profit. People seem to have a really tough time grasping the concept of these networks wanting out of the soap business. Passions, GL, ATWT, AMC and OLTL were all canceled for a reason. There have been no new soaps for a reason and despite OLTL's "ass-kicking" those reasons haven't changed.

Exactly. I think The Talk could generate a quarter of the audience ATWT had at the end and still turn a profit. These soaps, even at their reduced budgets, still are costing I am sure upwards of $1 million per week to produce.

Really? No one cares? I can easily say the same thing about soaps, this little hothouse not withstanding. You need look no farther than the Daytime Emmys for an example of no one caring. When even the Tony Awards do better than a TV awards show, that's apathy.

That's the problem. This wasn't supposed to get the same buzz level as a soap, a genre that has basically been ignored by most people for a decade. This was supposed to be something new and fresh and amazing - and the constant turnover and involvement of major CBS players suggests it's not something that can be thrown together cheaply like LMAD. If it gets no buzz and a minimal ratings increase from long forgotten ATWT, then that's not any success, IMO.

Exactly. I think The Talk could generate a quarter of the audience ATWT had at the end and still turn a profit. These soaps, even at their reduced budgets, still are costing I am sure upwards of $1 million per week to produce.

With Julie Chen's salary, having to buy people out of their contracts or make deals with them, hiring new people, etc. I think it's going to cost more than the usual talk show or panel show.

That's the problem. This wasn't supposed to get the same buzz level as a soap, a genre that has basically been ignored by most people for a decade. This was supposed to be something new and fresh and amazing

I never saw it promoted that way. Only here in the soapverse did I see people make that assumption. I saw it promoted as a new talk show on CBS, not as something that had never been done before.

I never saw it promoted that way. Only here in the soapverse did I see people make that assumption. I saw it promoted as a new talk show on CBS, not as something that had never been done before.

The early hype from CBS was that this was going to be about mothers, talk about mothers, that this was something people hadn't seen. I think this was the main thrust of their press tour, which got a bit of sneering from places like NPR. Only after that didn't really take off did they start to transition to become just a regular panel show.

Edited August 30, 201114 yr by CarlD2

All these senseless returns on AMC have done NOTHNG in the ratings. ( Oh God dare I say that word. Let me rephrase before the demo police come out and get me) The returns have done nothing in the demos. If those returns can't get the job done then nothing will and that's just a reality. I give AMC 12 months at best. I just think PP is taking on too much at one time and should considered reducing these shows to 30mins, or turn them into seasons. It would stand more of a chance to last longer as you get more quality stroylines and less filler ones.

The returns never were gonna do anything for the ratings, to be honest. When was the last time a "big return" really propelled a show upward? The people in charge at PP need to throw out the old 1985 team playbook and get a new one. I just hope someone in charge gets that and goes radical.

Here are the ratings for the week of August 8-12. This was its final week before returning in September.

http://www.soapopera...ts-proven-right

I couldn't care less about the OLTL ratings, but this:

1. The Price is Right 2 (CBS) 4,621,000 (TBD /-512,000)

2. The Young and the Restless (CBS) 4,587,000 (-162,000/-448,000)

3. The Price is Right 1 (CBS) 3,965,000 (TBD /-171,000)

4. The Bold and the Beautiful (CBS) 2,946,000 (-161,000/-358,000)

5. One Life to Live (ABC) 2,888,000 (-24,000/+641,000)

6. The View (ABC) 2,729,000 (TBD /+87,000)

7. General Hospital (ABC) 2,573,000 (+69,000/+25,000)

8. All My Children (ABC) 2,552,000 (+42,000/+94,000)

9. Let’s Make a Deal 2 (CBS) 2,428,000 (TBD /-48,000)

10. Days of our Lives (NBC) 2,349,000 (+37,000/-145,000)

11. Let’s Make a Deal 1 (CBS) 2,100,00 ( /-7,000)

12. The Talk (CBS) 2,023,000 (TBD / N/A)

is "music, sweet music."

I don't care if it costs tree-fitty to make The Talk. It can rake in all the profit in the world, but it's among the least watched shows on network daytime. I enjoy this because it proves my point that network daytime is a ghetto.

The returns never were gonna do anything for the ratings, to be honest. When was the last time a "big return" really propelled a show upward? The people in charge at PP need to throw out the old 1985 team playbook and get a new one. I just hope someone in charge gets that and goes radical.

Would Todd Count? Any of Brenda's returns? Just asking

I'll watch the Chew as soon as I start watching the Talk. Never will be soon enough for both.

Marley, I am honest enough with myself to admit that I am a disgruntled P&G soap fan. (I don't pretend to be objective.) But let's not pretend that there isn't a large segment of disgruntled AMC & OLTL as well (not just at SON, but at just about every related soap site on the internet). Unfortunately, few if any of these folks have had the courage to admit their biases.

Of course there are disgruntles soap ABC soap fans, I think all soap fans are disgruntled however I do believe that The Chew warrants criticism for th ir product regardless if you are a soap fan or not. I love watching cooking shows that are interesting and innovative but The Chew looks anything but that.

However, I've also stated that the PP venture will fail because AMC and OLTL are perceived--just like all cancelled programs would be--as failed shows (amongst the general public that has neither an emotional nor financial interest in them) that are on their last legs.

I also believe that AMC and OLTL online will fail miserably, that if, if they ever actually make it online which I have my doubts about.

Well, yeah, Todd's return has helped OLTL in the ratings, so that's something go with, but will they be able to sustain it? Or, I guess, the question is, would they have been able to sustain had they not received the cancellation notice? I can't say whether they would have or would not have, but even if they did, the success rate of big returns is so, so low. AMC really bombed big time because they have all this dead soap press and they went for characters who were supposed to make an impact, but it's all blown up in their faces (and left us with an embarrassing story to end the TV run with).

Still, though, my big thing is that things have to change. In HUGE ways, too. They're putting out these shows in the exact same way they were putting them out 30 years ago, while the rest of the television (most of everything outside the ghetto) has moved on up and changed over time to find an audience. No one at ABC ever thought in the last ten years that maybe trying these shows, no matter how much they sucked, in a different part of the day might help? It's ridiculous that the soaps never got as much as a marathon on ABC Family back before they found success with their current format. ABC has done nothing to make these shows successful.

I don't believe that soaps are seen as this dead creature you have to stay away from. I think people just don't care. That means if someone does come along and makes positive changes, then that could revitalize them. Or they could continue to be ignored. Either way I think the opportunity is there and doesn't equal automatic failure.

Well, yeah, Todd's return has helped OLTL in the ratings, so that's something go with, but will they be able to sustain it?

Wait. Is that what people are saying? The ratings are because of RH?

They're because of the two Todds story, for certain. I don't think that's up for debate at this point. We'll see if OLTL can hold that momentum with Victor unfortunately dead.

The Chew is doomed to failure. I'm just glad these soaps are getting what appears to be a better home and future. Network television is dying anyway.

Edited August 31, 201114 yr by Vee

LOL at 220 episodes of the Spew. Somebody is really going to sit and watch 220 episodes of that trash? ABC is seriously milking it for all its worth with their 45 second commercials they air every half hour. I'm just crossing my fingers that it ends up as a colossal bomb for the network.

As traitorous as this may sound, I find myself getting hungry when watching The Chew promos...