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Smash: Discussion Thread

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Actually the general consensus on other forums, even among people who hate it is Debra is doing some of her best work, and I'd agree. She got very one note and shrill on Will and Grace (mind you the show got shrill and one note in general) , and never appealed to me much in other projects, but she's had to sell some pretty so/so writing here and does it well. Her relationship with Christian Borle also comes off as very natural--they actually seem like they could have a songwriting/best friend relationship.

Yes the real life Messing/Chase situation just adds to the ick factor though obviously the show can't be blamed there (*and I believe he isn't set to be in that many more episodes...) From the gossip I'm pretty much certain that neither of them was fully unattached when it actually started, but of course there is always more to the story and it sounds like Chase and his partner already knew their relationship was over, at any rate.

SFK Jack Davenport is the Bob Fosse-as a Brit director/choreographer (i love that he's meant to be a choreographer yet hasn't shown even one dance combination--it's true that usually the assistant choreographer, who is played by the actual main show choreographer, teaches the actual dances, but ...). I'm surprised you didn't recognize him as he's had, Messing and Houston aside, probably the most major film/TV career out of the leads (the rest are nearly all much bigger theatre stars--which I admit is part of the fun for someone like me--seeing a Broadway lead be an anonymous dancer in the chorus of this show, when I saw the San Francisco workshop fo the Tales of the City musical last year the guy who plays the uber gay chorus dancer played Mouse, etc). He was in the original UK Coupling, the Pirates of the Caribbean movies, etc, but was first famous for one of my fave UK serials, This Life, where he played a very similar character actually...

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That's actually why I keep tuning in (besides to hear all the inacuracie people on Broadway World gripe about--come on, if cops or lawyers or doctors complained about the way they were shown on tv as being false, and some do, it would be far worse).

LOL! Isn't the BWW bitching hysterical? I swear some of those people thought this show was going to be a documentary or something.

I agree with all the people who are tired about hearing homilies to Saint Marilyn. But I see why the show went with something like that because the final product needs to be something the people here in flyover country would want to see being developed. I'm astounded at the suggestion that the show was actually thinking about a Broadway tie-in where there would be a real "Marilyn: The Musical" on Broadway.

I crack up at all the mentions that Karen is from the dreaded Iowa. Because apparently everyone working on Broadway just hatched there, fully-formed and making jazz hands, from eggs incubated behind the bar at Sardi's.

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I love this crazy show. It's a fun concept and the cast is winning. It's a little OTT and is not exactly The Wire for realism, but it shows Broadway and the city well and I love it. I'm Team Karen still.

I swear, though, that "kid" playing Julia's son seems challenged.

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Ha,everyone hates the son. I dunno, I think I know some teens a bit like him, sadly, but...

One thing I do find amusing is the last few episode "Next time on" previews have been so over the top dramatic--in a way the episodes actually aren't. Like the preview for this last one had them implying Ivy has a drug overdose and Eileen was aiming a real gun at her ex or something.

Yeah I get why they chose Marilyn--they have slightly cut back on the "Whatr would Marilyn do thing". I think I said it already, but the only thing I really find amusing is they went on about how they wanted to show "the real Marilyn" yet nearly every number has basically been about how sexy she is. Others have also pointed out that for a show about the life of Marilyn, to have two songs about her and DiMagio singing the exact same point about how happy they are seems redundant but--it's a tv show, and they needed another number for Will Chase... But I love the production numbers, so won't complain. The idea of a Marilyn tie-in stage musical, which I have a feeling they may have already dropped, is too ridiculous though if they plan to use even half of those numbers--not to mention of course there have been two flop Marilyn musicals already...

I have no idea what the BWW people and some bloggers expected. I will say I think the episodes Theresa Rebeck hasn't penned have been better, despite her theatre pedigree... And yeah the Iowa thing is ridiculous, but...

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"Boo, hoo. I want a baby sister from China." rolleyes.gif

"Boo, hoo. I don't want your burnt pancakes." rolleyes.gif

LOL! The only time I haven't loathed that kid was when he got busted for smoking weed in Central Park. I thought, "That explains everything. He's stoned all the time!"

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im indifferent to the son. he hasnt done anything to get love or hate, imho.

Also, i am totally team karen. the only reason i can see anyone rooting for ivy is because its clear karen will win in the end, but i just find ivy.. annoying? desperate and pathetic but not in a i want to see you pick yourself up kind of way, in a thats just sad kind of way.

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Ivy is that classic theatre girl who everybody hates and talks [[email protected]#$%^&*] about yet manages to have a pretty healthy career and earn a few FEW loyal friends who can see beyond her bullshit (that stems from insecurity) that frankly nobody else has the patience for.

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Also, i am totally team karen. the only reason i can see anyone rooting for ivy is because its clear karen will win in the end, but i just find ivy.. annoying? desperate and pathetic but not in a i want to see you pick yourself up kind of way, in a thats just sad kind of way.

I can't say that I'm so much "Team" Ivy because I just can't buy into this epic rivalry that the show is selling but I just don't understand how anybody thinks Karen would be better for this part in this show than Ivy is. It's ludicrous to me that we're expected to believe they are both equals in this race. Karen has no theatre experience even as a member of an ensemble. She barely knows how to dance, hasn't been taking any classes to learn how to dance, and couldn't even behave like a professional when she was working a bar mitzvah on Long Island. Not to mention she looks all wrong for the part. She's a tall, lanky and built like a 12 year old girl. She'd be great as Maureen in RENT but as Marilyn? No. OTOH, Ivy has been scrapping on Broadway for, I think they said, ten years. She understands Tom and Julia's process and worked on their spec stuff for free. Not to mention, she's got the look. That rack of hers seems to grow more prominent with every episode. I challenge anyone to watch "Let's Be Bad" and tell me how Karen playing unspooling, drug-addled Marilyn would be anything but eye-scalding.

SMASH is doing what soaps have done for years. They are telling me how awesome Karen is. Over and over and over again. Even the graphic for the show tells me that this is supposed to be All About Karen. They are making it very clear that I am supposed to be rooting for Karen. I'm not. Ivy is the more sensible pick and no amount of Karen wowing people at karaoke is going to convince me that she's right for this.

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I can't say that I'm so much "Team" Ivy because I just can't buy into this epic rivalry that the show is selling but I just don't understand how anybody thinks Karen would be better for this part in this show than Ivy is. It's ludicrous to me that we're expected to believe they are both equals in this race. Karen has no theatre experience even as a member of an ensemble. She barely knows how to dance, hasn't been taking any classes to learn how to dance, and couldn't even behave like a professional when she was working a bar mitzvah on Long Island. Not to mention she looks all wrong for the part. She's a tall, lanky and built like a 12 year old girl. She'd be great as Maureen in RENT but as Marilyn? No. OTOH, Ivy has been scrapping on Broadway for, I think they said, ten years. She understands Tom and Julia's process and worked on their spec stuff for free. Not to mention, she's got the look. That rack of hers seems to grow more prominent with every episode. I challenge anyone to watch "Let's Be Bad" and tell me how Karen playing unspooling, drug-addled Marilyn would be anything but eye-scalding.

SMASH is doing what soaps have done for years. They are telling me how awesome Karen is. Over and over and over again. Even the graphic for the show tells me that this is supposed to be All About Karen. They are making it very clear that I am supposed to be rooting for Karen. I'm not. Ivy is the more sensible pick and no amount of Karen wowing people at karaoke is going to convince me that she's right for this.

What you say about Karen is true, but thats what the show is.. showing. thats kind of the point of it. and clearly at this point karen isnt right for the part, because she doesnt have it. And i wouldnt even play my best on her getting the role in the end at this point, because if its picked up for another season i could see them making a new musical for karen to star in.

and your right that in the context of for the musical ivy is right, but my issue is i dont want her to have it because shes utterly pathetic and oddly entitled. i hope she loses out on the role and i hope she wants to die if karen gets it. ivy, for all th goos she is, has been shown as being far from perfect and so far where she fails karen thrives.

as for the rivalry between them, its very one sided from ivy, thats another issue.

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Smash is NBC's highest rated scripted drama. After all the promo spent, NBC could not cancel it if only to save face.

Given the choice of saving face or saving money, I think networks would rather save money.

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